Discuss 16A off 32A ring in the Electrical Forum area at ElectriciansForums.net

Welcome to ElectriciansForums.net - The American Electrical Advice Forum
Head straight to the main forums to chat by click here:   American Electrical Advice Forum

Status
Not open for further replies.
We don’t, dedicated supply to a 16A appliance
 
  • Like
Reactions: DPG
How do you guys get over taking an appliance which is 16A off a 32A ring?

thx
I wouldn't, I would install the item on it's own dedicated circuit
 
I wouldn't, I would install the item on it's own dedicated circuit
If easy to to do, but in some cases not so. The ring can take a 16A draw off it as from a spur using a MF junction box, and 2.5mm cable, is fine. These commercial plugs can do it, but boy are they clunky. But the ring would have to be dropped to a 20A mcb.
16A off 32A ring 1600175853406 - EletriciansForums.net

Also using a Wylex 104 switch fuse which will take a 16A cartridge off the 32A ring and the above commercial socket and plug off the 104 switch.

Also splitting the ring into two 16A radials - if it can be done of course.

How have others got around it? Must be a number of ways. Many Continental appliances state 16A.
 
If easy to to do, but in some cases not so. The ring can take a 16A draw off it as from a spur using a MF junction box, and 2.5mm cable, is fine. These commercial plugs can do it, but boy are they clunky. But the ring would have to be dropped to a 20A mcb.
View attachment 60830

Also using a Wylex 104 switch fuse which will take a 16A cartridge off the 32A ring and the above commercial socket and plug off the 104 switch.

Also splitting the ring into two 16A radials - if it can be done of course.

How have others got around it? Must be a number of ways. Many Continental appliances state 16A.
A spur using MF JBs may sound OK but remember an FCU will have a 13Amp fuse in it,
 
Last edited:
If easy to to do, but in some cases not so. The ring can take a 16A draw off it as from a spur using a MF junction box, and 2.5mm cable, is fine. These commercial plugs can do it, but boy are they clunky. But the ring would have to be dropped to a 20A mcb.
View attachment 60830

Also using a Wylex 104 switch fuse which will take a 16A cartridge off the 32A ring and the above commercial socket and plug off the 104 switch.

Also splitting the ring into two 16A radials - if it can be done of course.

How have others got around it? Must be a number of ways. Many Continental appliances state 16A.

Absolutely NOT.

I suggest you consult the regulations, in particular 433.1.204

16A outlet - 16A radial.
 
How have others got around it? Must be a number of ways. Many Continental appliances state 16A.
Basically we don’t “get around it” as you so charmingly put it. Anyone worth their salt will comply with BS7671. It is not allowed for the reasons above.
The ethos of a ring final is for distributed loads with a maximum of 13A on any point. See Appendix 15 for clarification.

Many continental appliances indeed state 16A. Jonny foreigner doesn’t indulge in ring finals and the standard circuit is a 16A radial. Which is what you need to install!
 
Was thinking of the Wylex switched fuse with 16A fuse in it off the ring, then the commercial 16A socket.
I have actually seen this done. It may be against 'regs' but electrically sound and safe. Only the one 16A appliance could use the socket outlet because of the commercial plug & socket.

Just wondering how people got around it without running a new radial back to the CU.

As I mentioned splitting the ring into two radials is an option. But this raises another flag. A 16A radial may have a number of 13A sockets in series on it. Either the 16A appliance can be hard wired into the radial, with cable outlet, or fit the commercial plug/socket.
 
Last edited:
Suggest you ask on another forum. The Screwfix one maybe has the sort of getting around the regs ‘advice’ that you are looking for.
 
I have actually seen this done. It may be against 'regs' but electrically sound and safe. Only the one 16A appliance could use the socket outlet because of the commercial plug & socket.

Just wondering how people got around it without running a new radial back to the CU.

As I mentioned splitting the ring into two radials is an option. But this raises another flag. A 16A radial may have a number of 13A sockets in series on it. Either the 16A appliance can be hard wired into the radial, with cable outlet, or fit the commercial plug/socket.

So if I read that right - and paraphrase:

I know/agree it is wrong, and could result in prosecution against a professional electrician if they do it.

So please could people confirm if they have done it?

What next: times, places, details - please also provide details of your defence lawyer?
 
All say a 16A appliance cannot be taken off a 32A ring because the regs say so, even though it can be done quite safely - and I have seen this done. Fine, I go with that, as we are all best going one way

I pointed out splitting the ring into two 16A radials, bringing up the point that a radial created out of the split may have 13A sockets on it, but a 16A commercial socket/plug can be fitted for a 16A appliance - unlike the Continent we do not have 16A sockets/plugs. I see no one took this one up.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
It would not be a good idea in my opinion.

The whole idea of a circuit feeding several sockets should be able to provide for the expected loads placed on it.

So a 16A appliance on a 20A circuit would lead to a circuit breaker tripping every time more than 4A was spread across the 13A sockets.

I suggest you do some diversity calculations and see if it is acceptable.
 
I suggest you read the thread. Then tell me where I have complained. And I suggest @Taylortwocities keep his suggestions to himself.

All say a 16A appliance cannot be taken off a 32A ring because the regs say so, even though it can be done quite safely - and I have seen this done. Fine, I go with that, as we are all best going one way

I pointed out splitting the ring into two 16A radials, bringing up the point that a radial created out of the split may have 13A sockets on it, but a 16A commercial socket/plug can be fitted for a 16A appliance - unlike the Continent we do not have 16A sockets/plugs. I see no one took this one up.

Mainly because it's clearly described in the regulations

A ring, and multi-radials are designed around the use of bs1363 fittings, they each are protected by a fuse up to 13A - or have one in the appropriate plug.

Industrial 16A and so on type fittings do not have any guarantee of a fuse protecting the cables, flexes, or end appliance.

Therefore they need to realistically be on single dedicated radials, generally you use these where greater than 13A is required and therefore you are unlikely to be able to apply diversity sufficient to manage multiple 16A outlets.

I do suggest that you familiarise yourself with the regulations rather than just decide what should be ok even if its not allowed by them.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Mate... it’s the regs. It might be electrically sound, but if it’s not and you end up in court what are you going to say... ‘Erm yes you honour, it’s against the regs but I did consult aload of random people on a forum till someone said it’s alright so I did it’
 
This is like the electric vehicle thread.
What is the point in asking a question if you have already made up your mind about the answer?
 
You lucky girl, @Julie.
He must be good at something to distract you from the thrilling subjects of British standard numbers!
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Reply to 16A off 32A ring in the Electrical Forum area at ElectriciansForums.net

OFFICIAL SPONSORS

Electrical Goods - Electrical Tools - Brand Names Electrician Courses Green Electrical Goods PCB Way Electrical Goods - Electrical Tools - Brand Names Pushfit Wire Connectors Electric Underfloor Heating Electrician Courses
These Official Forum Sponsors May Provide Discounts to Regular Forum Members - If you would like to sponsor us then CLICK HERE and post a thread with who you are, and we'll send you some stats etc

Electrical Forum

Welcome to the Electrical Forum at ElectriciansForums.net. The friendliest electrical forum online. General electrical questions and answers can be found in the electrical forum.
This website was designed, optimised and is hosted by Untold Media. Operating under the name Untold Media since 2001.
Back
Top
AdBlock Detected

We get it, advertisements are annoying!

Sure, ad-blocking software does a great job at blocking ads, but it also blocks useful features of our website. For the best site experience please disable your AdBlocker.

I've Disabled AdBlock