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Discuss A Q I was asked today in the Electrical Wiring, Theories and Regulations area at ElectriciansForums.net

C

Cirrus

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Very quick and simple - can a cooker be connected directly into load side of a 45A DP cooker switch or does it HAVE to be connected into a cooker outlet?

Apprentice asked me today and I said I didn't see any reason why not as it will still be switched and threfore isolated. Just means if you want to upgrade the cable / cooker you may need to chase the old cable out.

Your thoughts gents?
 
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ian.settle1

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Mentor
Arms
Very quick and simple - can a cooker be connected directly into load side of a 45A DP cooker switch or does it HAVE to be connected into a cooker outlet?

Apprentice asked me today and I said I didn't see any reason why not as it will still be switched and threfore isolated. Just means if you want to upgrade the cable / cooker you may need to chase the old cable out.

Your thoughts gents?
Can't see why not.

What is the difference if it was a surface mounted switch/cooker unit with socket?
 
W

wayne

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  • #4
dont see any reason why not ,from the sw to the outlet theres no further control normally
time enough ive seen 6mm sticking out of the wall and no cooker outlet
just dont put the power on till the cooker is on the cable otherwise you could end up with a live end
 
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rumrunner

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  • #5
hi cirrus
it has always been a no no ,the thinking behind it is if the cooker neads to be removed ,a live cable could be left sticking out of the wall ,it used to be ok to connect strait into surface outlets ,but i am not sure now

dont see any reason why not ,from the sw to the outlet theres no further control normally
time enough ive seen 6mm sticking out of the wall and no cooker outlet
just dont put the power on till the cooker is on the cable otherwise you could end up with a live end
waynee our posts must have overlapped ,the whole idea is if someone other than an electrician removes the cooker:)
 
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C

Cirrus

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  • #6
But Rum, if you removed the cooker then because it is a DP switch then at least the bare end would be isolated and hence not live. Ok, we know about best practice but I am guessing there is nothing in the regs to state it can't be done?
 
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rumrunner

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  • #7
It always used to be in the regs ,so i suspect it is now ,like waynee said hes seen the cable just sticking out the wall loads a times ,thats why they put it in the regs
 
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wayne

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  • #8
could be over lapping here but cirrus is talking about a cooker with a flying lead rum and i are on about bare ends
you are just as safe disconnecting from an outlet as from the sw if the coooooker has a flying lead .
 
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rumrunner

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #9
waynee
if somone comes along to remove the cooker ,and the cable is buried in the wall .then the simple way is to disconect thne cooker and leave the cable ,hence the cable hanging out the wall could be made live, thats why it is in the regs
 
A

Andy M

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #10
At least with a Lower Outlet the Cable between the Cooker and the wall is fixed by a Cord Grip both ends. (If it is a Free standing cooker, it could be liable to moving for cleaning)
Just a thought
 
L

Lofty

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #11
Hiya,
I've come across cookers that have been wired like this and removed at the cooker end leaving the 'tail' floating just waiting for someone to switch it on. The safer option is the cooker outlet.
 
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rumrunner

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #12
Hiya,
I've come across cookers that have been wired like this and removed at the cooker end leaving the 'tail' floating just waiting for someone to switch it on. The safer option is the cooker outlet.
yep .yhats what they make them for:)
 
both good points here, anyone able to point it out were in the regs, just to clear it up. Having a cooker connected to a socket outlet then to the 45amp DP, does this apply say to a water boiler, those what you'd have in a cafe or restaurant at the bar to pour instant hot water for your tea ?
 

Des 56

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Arms
Esteemed
Connecting to the cooker outlet as got to be the best option forb a flush installation
I have rewired some council houses in the past where everything was surface mounted inc the cooker outlet
Now this thing stuck out from the wall a rediculouse distance
The way I looked on them at the time was that the cooker wouold be better connected straight into the control switch with perhaps a bit of trunking to tidy it up
There would be one less connection so arguably a bit safer + there is generally a cord grip in the cooker control to stop the cable pulling away when little johnny starts swinging on it So straight in may have an advantage occasionally
 
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rumrunner

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #15
Connecting to the cooker outlet as got to be the best option forb a flush installation
I have rewired some council houses in the past where everything was surface mounted inc the cooker outlet
Now this thing stuck out from the wall a rediculouse distance
The way I looked on them at the time was that the cooker wouold be better connected straight into the control switch with perhaps a bit of trunking to tidy it up
There would be one less connection so arguably a bit safer + there is generally a cord grip in the cooker control to stop the cable pulling away when little johnny starts swinging on it So straight in may have an advantage occasionally
Absolutely no problem at all if surface mounted,but if its not then it must have an outlet:)
 
both good points here, anyone able to point it out were in the regs, just to clear it up. Having a cooker connected to a socket outlet then to the 45amp DP, does this apply say to a water boiler, those what you'd have in a cafe or restaurant at the bar to pour instant hot water for your tea ?
 

Had8Lives

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Arms
I'd agree it should always be done with an outlet, mainly because of the fact the cable could become damaged by the end of capping or mortar. You've got the added safety of the cable being out of reach if it is made live by accident. Mind you it makes sense to at least put wires ina connector block and tape that could be made live.

Reg 522-08-01 (Page 96 16th Edition) would not be fulfilled if you don't use a cooker outlet plate "A wiring system shall be selected and erected so as to minimize during installation, use and maintenance, damage to the sheath and insulation of cables and insulated conductors and their terminations."
 
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wayne

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  • #18
thanks h8l
sections 522 & the catch all 134 seem to cover this dilemma
anybody know of other regs that might cover this ?in favour or against?
 

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