Advice for the best routes to getting qualified

[wide74]

Hi all,

If possible is like to get your advice on the best way to getting house bashing qualified.

A bit of background first which will hopefully help....

I'm currently running 3 projects which are all restoring/rebuilding old buildings and as part of that all the services are to renew/install. Now on previous builds I've done most the wiring overseen by a family friend who is NICEIC registered . Now my problem is that he is retiring so I would like to get qualified to certify my installs but only on my own projects, I've no intention of hiring myself out as a spark. I realise that I'm kind of doing things backwards in that I've got a fair amount of experience but no qualifications. What I don't want to do though is waste a load of time and money taking the wrong route to getting qualified. Being self employed I am in the very fortunate position in that I can take time off to do an intensive course but is that going to get me where I need to be? Talking to a couple of training companies it is but seen as though they would be getting a load of my cash they would say that wouldn't they!

Any advice much appreciated.

Cheers.

 

[andyelectric]

Phone your LABC first and see what their requirements are, and balance up your costs there vs joining a competent person scheme as you will only be doing a few installs per year. Then tailor your training requirements to your needs,.

 

[wide74]

Cheers that's not a bad place to start.

I reckon it will be cost effective for the simple reason that because we are pretty rural and the buildings we work on are old the number of short notice visits we require (tracing and isolating hidden wires or re-routing ring mains while we replace rotten joists etc.) Is quite large and so costs would be prohibitively high over time. Also there is the time factor is I'm paying my lads while we wait for a spark to arrive. That said I've had more trouble taking down a decent plumber than finding a good electrician. ..........Don't get me started on builders, that's why I employ my own!

 

[D Skelton]

The only way to get qualified in one go is to complete the City & Guilds 2357 Advanced Diploma. Completion of the City & Guilds 2365, which is a technical certificate is another route you could take towards getting qualified.

The former of these two options includes the NVQ and will take an average of four years to complete studying part time at college. It could be argued given the work you have in mind that completion of an NVQ would not only be impossible given the nature of the work you complete but also unnecessary. I would personally argue that it is currently the only real way to learn the trade, for reasons I will explain further down. Others will have different opinions here though. The latter will take three years to complete part time however there are intensive courses that cover the full tech cert. These would take around 6 months to complete if learning 5 days per week. It could easily be argued here that the intensive course will not be suitable as there is no time to A. Absorb what you have learned, and B. Put it in to practice under the supervision of a time served electrician. For these two reasons, I come back round to the 2357, as this includes the NVQ and is probably the only way to have documented evidence of work that has been completed under supervision and then assessed by the college as part of the NVQ portfolio.

Sorry if that's a lot to take in but if one thing has to be made very clear here, that is that there is no short cut to becoming a qualified electrician.

 

[wide74]

Thanks for the reply much appreciated.

As I mentioned though I only need domestic installer for the work we do. If for any reason I needed commercial qualifications would I be correct in thinking that I could study that as a module (s) later on?

Cheers.

 

[D Skelton]

Thanks for the reply much appreciated.

As I mentioned though I only need domestic installer for the work we do. If for any reason I needed commercial qualifications would I be correct in thinking that I could study that as a module (s) later on?

Cheers.

There is no such thing as a domestic installer. You're either an electrician or you're not.

The methods used to design, install, inspect and test electrical circuits are exactly the same whether you're in a house, a shop, a swimming pool or a factory.

 

[Pete999]

WTF is house bashing qualified? Jeez Domestic Installer ? no such Animal you are either an Electrician or you aint how many more times has this got to be aired?

 

[telectrix]

the sad thing is, he can do a 5 week course, join a scam and then be let loose to muddle through with the blessing of the almighty LABC and niceic.

 

[D Skelton]

To be fair to the OP, he isn't to know better is he. Hence an attempt to educate him with regards to electrical qualifications as opposed to berating him.

You are right Pete, but it's up to us I believe to show him the right path, he can then choose to walk it or not. If he chooses not to, we've done our bit, that's the time I feel harsh criticism of his choices would be more acceptable.

Wide74 hasn't made a choice yet, so let's continue trying to push him in the right direction!

 

[Pete999]

To be fair to the OP, he isn't to know better is he. Hence an attempt to educate him with regards to electrical qualifications as opposed to berating him.

You are right Pete, but it's up to us I believe to show him the right path, he can then choose to walk it or not. If he chooses not to, we've done our bit, that's the time I feel harsh criticism of his choices would be more acceptable.

Wide74 hasn't made a choice yet, so let's continue trying to push him in the right direction!

OK Mate I'm with you on that, just get wound up at some of the threads "house bashing qualified" no offence meant OP, not your fault

 

[shanky887614]

im curious though, don't the new regs state electrically skilled rather than competent now.

technically doesnt that mean most DI's are not able to do the work to bs7671 now? as they dont have the qualifications or the courses to prove there electrically skilled

 

[andyelectric]

Thanks for the reply much appreciated.

As I mentioned though I only need domestic installer for the work we do. If for any reason I needed commercial qualifications would I be correct in thinking that I could study that as a module (s) later on?

Cheers.

You will get lots of flak on here from the time serveds.

Whether or not there is such a thing as a domestic installer or should be gets argued on this site frequently.

But, you are already and have been installing for years. So what you need to do is to learn how to test your installs. Completing a short course, and subsequently joining a Competent Person Scheme will meet your needs. I would first decide on a scheme to join, then phone them and discuss which training courses they are happy with and proceed from there.

 

[D Skelton]

Wide74, just a word of advice, take no notice of andyelectric, he's built himself up a bit of a reputation as a forum troll.

His advice is very wrong!

A short cut to becoming qualified, the main query of your original question, currently doesn't exist.

 

[andyelectric]

Wide74.

The route suggested by the time serveds is obviously the correct one should you wish to become a fully fledged electrician working on a wide variety of installs. I doubt for your needs this is entirely necessary, but feel free to make your own decision.

As long as the installs you will be doing in future are similar to those you have been completing for years, and you will not be stepping outside these boundaries the route I have described is fine.

 

[ian.settle1]

WTF is house bashing qualified? Jeez Domestic Installer ? no such Animal you are either an Electrician or you aint how many more times has this got to be aired?

Lobotomised

 

[wide74]

Ha! I Didn't mean to start a war.

One of my best mates is time served and runs his own company but due to the travel is just not feasible for him to come to our site and the other time served guy we use is retiring. They taught me how to work the right way and yes I appreciate that I sound like another person trying to cut corners but the fact I'm asking for advice surely indicates I want to do things the right way.

Cheers for the good advice though and I will try harder to use the correct terminology in future!

 

[telectrix]

Lobotomised

or 1 step up from a plumber. there again, flipping burgers is 1 step up from a plumber anyway.

 

[Octopus]

I do think that purely a focus on "exams" is completely wrong.

Competence is acquired by a combination of exams and practical experience under the "wing" of an experienced, up to date competent spark.

As for calling the LABC - wtf - so no current qualifications, that is NOT a call I would make.

 

[Adam W]

Thanks for the reply much appreciated.

As I mentioned though I only need domestic installer for the work we do. If for any reason I needed commercial qualifications would I be correct in thinking that I could study that as a module (s) later on?

Cheers.

No. It doesn't 'go' Domestic, then Commercial, then Industrial, and you don't go through the course picking up qualifications on doing different things as you go, like starting off getting 'qualified' to change a plug, then a socket, then a light switch and so on until you can do a fusebox. If you drop out part way through the course you'll leave with no qualifications, not qualified to do the basics but not the more complicated stuff.

A college will teach you the principles behind installing to the relevant British Standard, and you will be expected to demonstrate how you can apply knowledge to a situation, not just show you how to install something and expect you to be able to replicate that in every situation.
As Damian says you're either an electrician or you're not; there are no half measures.

 

[TJ Anderson]

No. It doesn't 'go' Domestic, then Commercial, then Industrial, and you don't go through the course picking up qualifications on doing different things as you go, like starting off getting 'qualified' to change a plug, then a socket, then a light switch and so on until you can do a fusebox. If you drop out part way through the course you'll leave with no qualifications, not qualified to do the basics but not the more complicated stuff.

A college will teach you the principles behind installing to the relevant British Standard, and you will be expected to demonstrate how you can apply knowledge to a situation, not just show you how to install something and expect you to be able to replicate that in every situation.
As Damian says you're either an electrician or you're not; there are no half measures.

The distinction that needs to be made is an Electrician is an Electrician. A Short Course person is a Short Course Person. Only the Electrician would get an Electrician grading but either could register as a Domestic Installer.