Are some PV panels better than others?

[Gozoman]

I'm currently unemployed and thinking of having Solar PV installed on my roof so obviously I want the best system I can get for the least outlay. I have already received one quote of £3500 and I would like to ask members opinions on this. The System size is quoted as 1880 Watts and the panel type as Linuo P235W and number of panels is 8. Annual generation is quoted as £273.68 and export payment as £24.10 and avoided tariff as £116.63. They list payback period as 8.48 years but it says that this is based on reclaiming VAT back for commercial jobs which I find odd as it's my home it will be installed on and not a commercial property. Have they just did this to make the system look better? Total annual income is listed as £414.41. The roof in question has a gross/active PV surface area of 13.11 / 13.43 square meters with a yield reduction due to shading of 6%. System efficiency is listed as 11.8%. My roof faces due South.

Does this sound like a good deal? My main concern is not the £3500 outlay but the system size of 1880 Watts as I would prefer something higher. So my main question is this. If a different panel was used on the same given area of roof could I expect to get a higher output? What would be the best output I could expect from today's technology and at what extra cost. Many thanks in advance for any information and advice.

 

[Vegelen]

Consider installing a solar system when you are back in full employment.
Save your cash reserves until returning to work, to protect your financial circumstances.
Solar systems are excellent, incremental investments that will help reduce your electricity bills and supplement your income long term. They arent get rich quick schemes.
Your roof has a surface area of 13.11 / 13.43 square meters.
As your roof is small it will be important to use solar panels with as high efficiency as possible, to maximise generation on a small southerly facing area.
The most efficient solar panels are expensive (Panasonic HITS, Sunpower etc), so you'll have to decide how much money you are prepared to spend versus, the net benefit.
Use the following websites to help you discover what panels could be installed on your chosen installation location:

CompareMySolar - Compare solar panel prices and installers in the UK
Best Photovoltaic Solar Panels | Unbiased, Data-Driven Comparisons.
Compare Solar Panels

High efficiency solar panels allow you to generate more energy in a limited space.
You need to look at a variety of solar panels and work out what solar panel will best fit the area available, how much will it generate, for what cost.
The more efficient a panel, the more it will generate for a limited area.
But the more efficient a solar panel is, the more expensive they are to buy.
All 250W solar panels dont generate exactly same amount of power, they have different specified tolerances i.e +5% or +- 3%.
The less efficient a solar panel is, the larger its size will be to generate a similar amount of power.
As your roof suffers from shading it is important to install a solar system that works well with shading issues.

There are many options available designed to work with shading:
(1) Solar Inverters /DC-DC Solar Panel Optimisers (Tigo,Aurora Power One,SolarEdge etc).
(2) Microinverters (Enphase, Enecsys, SMA (Due Q3 2013)).
(3) Solar Edge with Solar Edge Panel Optimisers.
(4) Solar Inverter with Software Algorithm (SMA Inverter with Optitrac Global Peak).

Your roof is small so your options may be limited to (1) & (2).

Solar systems installed on smaller roofs tend to be more difficult to design because of various design constraints i.e small roof area, limited range of high efficiency solar panels & low power inverters etc.
Also solar system efficiency comes into play.
The smaller a solar system is the less efficient its operating efficiency is likely to be.
There are many people on this forum that will be able to help you further, with additional analysis of your system design, following this posting.

 

[Gozoman]

Thanks for that Vegelen. I'll check out those sites. I'm not after a get rich scheme by any means. I have the cash lying doing nothing anyway so at least with a solar PV system it would be doing some good and hopefully pay for itself in about 7 years at which point I will have reached retirement age. After that any cheques I get in will be a top up for my pension.

 

[moggy1968]

there is no value in going for 235's. 250s are probably the same size. It's only worth going for something like panasonic if it increases the number of panels you can fit (because of their small size).

what are the actual dimensions of your roof?

I would say if you need to use up some savings because it has a negative effect on your benefits this is worth doing, but not with that firm, they aren't being upfront and honest. get a couple more quotes in.

 

[Gozoman]

Yeah that's what I'm doing at the moment Moggy. Hopefully I will have at least another survey done next week.

 

[Vegelen]

If you find the ideal solar panel for your roof is from a Chinese manufacturer, make sure your MCS installer buys advanced stock before the EU introduces anti dumping taxes on imported Chinese solar panels into the EU.
The European parliament intends to take the UK government to court for charging 5% VAT on solar hardware for domestic installs.
They want to increase UK VAT to 20% on solar hardware.
These 2 factors will significantly increase solar hardware costs in the short term.

 

[Gozoman]

I can assure you that if any installer suggest fitting anything Chinese to my roof they will be told where to stick it. I wouldn't have anything Chinese in the house!

 

[Vegelen]

I understand the sentiment, I get fed up with buying and fixing many cheap Chinese items, but in fairness to the Chinese some Tier 1 solar panels / hardware are made to exceptionally high standards on German production lines with Centrotherm equipment.
I'd avoid buying Chinese inverters, as German solar inverter hardware is expensive but more reliable, although the Chinese are catching up fast.
SMA are exceptional at replacing failed hardware under warranty should anything go wrong.

 

[Gozoman]

I don't much like the Chinese and their flooding of the world with fakes and substandard products. But I hate them more now as the company I worked for moved the majority of their operation to China and I ended up out of a job!

 

[SRE]

Ahem! Linuo - Chinese manufacturer ....... I think you'll find a good 85 - 90% of panels installed in the UK are made in China, along with an increasing number of inverters. Some installers would go as far as to say they would have some Chinese manufacturers over Sharp panels made in the UK. If you're wanting bargain prices then you may well end up with Chinese panels ON your house.

 

[Gozoman]

I can assure you I won't mate. That's why they are fast becoming the most powerful nation on earth because we are financing it. I don't intend to help them in that regard. I don't want any cheap Chinese rubbish on my roof and I'm prepared to pay extra to ensure that doesn't happen. My main concern is quality rather than cost.

 

[Vegelen]

If you're wanting bargain prices then you may well end up with Chinese panels ON your house.

* This is a time limited offer.
The EU are recording Chinese imports into the Eurozone, with a view to introducing retrospective anti dumping levys.
Want cheap Chinese panels? - Buy soon to avoid imminent price hikes.
Or follow Gozoman's lead and give them the bum's rush.

 

[finchy]

Where are you located Gozoman. I would get a quote from some of the regular contributors on here. Only use Real and Mcs companies check their credentials on the website. http://www.microgenerationcertification.org/

It's not a decision to rush, once you have found an installer you then can get prices for alternative panels inverters and output predictions.

 

[Gozoman]

Hi Finchy. I'm based in N. Ireland so probably not as many installers here as on the mainland.

 

[SRE]

I can assure you I won't mate. That's why they are fast becoming the most powerful nation on earth because we are financing it. I don't intend to help them in that regard. I don't want any cheap Chinese rubbish on my roof and I'm prepared to pay extra to ensure that doesn't happen. My main concern is quality rather than cost.

Good to hear, wish our customers were the same but the vast majority are very price sensitive. We're in a low wage area and those with cash have probably just got as much as those perceived to earn low amounts in other parts of the country. So in short even the cash rich in our area haven't got much cash!

 

[jason121]

How many of you on this forum have Apple Iphone or IPADs were do you think they are made.

 

[Gozoman]

What I really need to know here is this. I have been quoted for a system which has 8 Linuo P235W panels having a total system size of 1880 Watts. The panels are Chinese which I certainly don't want and the system efficiency is stated as being 11.8% which okay I'm no expert but that doesn't sound great given there are panels on the market with over 20% efficiency. Given the footprint of these 8 Linuo P235W panels as that appears to be my limit area wise are there other panels I could request which would give me a better efficiency and a higher overall output? Also can anyone comment on the inverter which they propose fitting in this system which is a Samil Power Co. SolarRiver 1600TL 1.5kw? I suppose this is more Chinese made stuff? I may seem to be coming down hard on the Chinese here but I really don't want to trust my property or my life to an electrical component made in China where quality and health and safety are nil!

 

[Gozoman]

Point taken Jason as I have a new iPhone 5. However I didn't have a choice in the matter as it was a present from a friend and I don't think there is a possibility that it will malfunction to the degree where it might burn my house down!

 

[Vegelen]

:leaving:

 

[Vegelen]

I don't think there is a possibility that it will malfunction to the degree where it might burn my house down!

That's what Beko fridge freezer owners said.....:ihih:

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