Bonding to gas and 544.1.2

[The Ghost]

Called today as client wanted boiler serviced/fixed. Gas safe man looked at meter boxed outside and said "No bonding! No fix!" Called me to assess. So...Clearly bonding x 2 are leaving the CU. Correct size. Test to water and Gas outside and readings below/within 0.05 ohms continuity. Suggesting there was indeed bonding connected as a previous electrician had confirmed the same. My consideration is looking at the above reg it says ...or at the point of entry to the building... Now how do you read that? Does it mean
A: the external point of entry
B: the internal point of entry
I have always assumed it is a matter of where it enters the building inside. Therefore, as in this case the bonding is probably connected under the floorboards inside the front living room as readings do indicate, and evidence of bonding cables leaving CU. What is your view?
Anyway it is clear that we must provide bonding to the outside gas meter so that work can go ahead and satisfy the gas man. Seems a bit silly to me but what else can you do.

 

[SparkySy]

I have this problem too Mr gas man can't see the earth so won't touch. To be fair it should be in an accessible position for testing and inspection as it's a mechanical joint in most cases! I took the point of entry to mean where it comes in so would say internal. Also if external not in the meter box it would need some protection from the weather and the thieving types that are a magpie for copper!

 

[buzzlightyear]

A out side entry .Vort . and to confrim that has been done.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

Can be either inside or out.

 

[buzzlightyear]

if you put the bonding under the floor boards to the copper pipes there is more likely that the bonding clips might rust with moisture .

 

[Strima]

For me the point of entry for bonding is internal however my common sense tells me that if the pipe work is not readily accessible then as close to the point of entry using suitable clamps for the environment is acceptable and within the spirit of the regulations.

 

[Dave OCD]

It's more nonsense where common sense goes out of the window, I did a CU change earlier this week, it was in the attached garage. The gas pipe [28mm copper] came in to the corner of the garage then up and along the length of the garage 300mm or so above the CU. So as it was continuous and with soldered couplers/elbows I thought do I run 8 metres of 10mm back to where the pipe enters or straight up to above the CU .....

 

[Deleted member 26818]

I once ran a bonding cable from the CU just above the front door, into the ceiling, out through the exterior wall, up the wall into the loft, across the loft, down into the airing cupboard, through the wall into the bathroom, through some pipe boxing to the rising water main.
All so I didn’t have to pull up the fitted carpets and floor boards.

 

[Octopus]

This is what I believe muddies the waters between GSR's and sparks!

 

[The Ghost]

If the gas safe man is going on he can see the bonding at the gas meter outside so it is safe to proceed that is poor method as there is no test to ensure the bonding is intact to the MET. For all he knows it could have been cut off by the painter last year inside where you can't see it.

 

[KentSparky]

I have this problem too Mr gas man can't see the earth so won't touch. To be fair it should be in an accessible position for testing and inspection as it's a mechanical joint in most cases! I took the point of entry to mean where it comes in so would say internal. Also if external not in the meter box it would need some protection from the weather and the thieving types that are a magpie for copper!

This is an ongoing issue between the trades and you can spend the whole day arguing with a plumber who is trying to tell you where to place your main bond! At the end of the day electricians have their regs and plumbers have their regs,
I was taught that you bond inside and if plums don't like it they can waste their day arguing on the phone with gas safe or niceic or whoever they choose

 

[buzzlightyear]

I was taught that you bond inside

what in side. new build .me don't think so . you must make a judgement on that .

 

[netblindpaul]

Bond is to be inside the premises, some of the gas industry paperwork is simply wrong.
It is doubtful that the gas fitter knows what is required.
He's certainly NOT a registered Engineer, that's for sure.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

Inside back when meters were inside.
Now it depends on where the meter is and accessibility to pipe work.

 

[buzzlightyear]

Bond is to be inside the premises,

you better tell all the sparks in uk their are doing it wrong gas out side meter .

 

[Deleted member 26818]

Regs say point of entry, nothing about inside or out.

 

[Toneyz]

I had this argument concerning a second-floor gas pipe ran from an external meter up on the outside wall through the wall to isolator valve to combi boiler it was bonded after the isolating valve. expected the 10mm earth to run from the flat outside to the meter showed him regs book still wouldn't have it. As far as I was concerned it was installed to regs left him to it to explain to the builder why 8 earth wires had to be run down the external walls.

 

[buzzlightyear]

Main bonding - Green and yellow conductors that connect metal pipes (gas, water or oil) from inside a building to the main earthing terminal of the electrical installation. Main bonding connections may also be made outside the building, for example where a semi-enclosed gas meter box is installed outside and it is not possible to install a bond to the gas installation pipework indoors.

 

[KentSparky]

what in side. new build .me don't think so . you must make a judgement on that .

Inside the property as opposed to outside the property is the judgement I am happy with

 

[netblindpaul]

you better tell all the sparks in uk their are doing it wrong gas out side meter .

If you want to comply with BS 7671 then that states that it must be after entry to the premises, or words to that effect.
If you put it outside then it is a deviation that must be noted.
Then, if you bond outside, you must defer to gas regulations as to how you bring the cable into the premises, if, you do this within the meter enclosure, and that is the law of the land, not some industry recommendation such as BS 7671.