Dno nightmare what do i do?

[gordysolar]

Hi everyone
problem i have is with dno i installed 4 kw rec panels with sma 3600tl 16amp g83/1 inverter on monday 8th october i emailed them on sunday to say thast i was installing on monday and would be commisioned monday /tuesday first thing.
didnt hear anything back till tuesday about 2 pm to say that 6 houses away there was solar fitted and i coulndnt turn on so i had to turn it off as i had tested it and powered it up as i didnt hear from themi thought everything was ok they said there engineer will have to look at grid and to check if ok or too quote me on any costs to fix.

OMG I THOUGHT COSTS TO FIX they said they would check it urgently and get back to me still waiting on them customer is getting agitated and not much i can do they now email me back saying thet this should be g83 type 2 or g59 as there is another solar install 6 houses away i didnt know this and i didnt do other install will i be liable for costs if it needs upgrading?

also all i did was contact them day before install like i always do should i have did something else?

GORDON

 

[Earthstore]

I thought G83 type 2 was only if you were doing multiple installs, not for you to go and check every house in the area.
Which DNO is it, as someone on here may be able to help if they are familiar with them (just a thought).

 

[gordysolar]

NORTHERN POWER GRID i havent installed in this village not within 5 miles atleast i asked why didnt u emial me or ring me on monday day of install do they have right to charge me if grid needs upgrading?

 

[gordysolar]

yes g83.2 is if u do multiple installs i did this last week when i installed 5x 1.5kw systems next too each other as far as i know 16amp limited inverter there shoudnt be a problem ?

 

[Gavin A]

why did you ask for advance permission when you already have advance permission automatically unless you ask them in advance?

you're going to have to hope the engineer says yes now.

New rules on all of this sort of thing are a coming though.

 

[finchy]

Indeed there are new rules coming, have a look at the sticky on the changes to G83. Hadn't you noticed the other Pv install when you did the survey ?

 

[Earthstore]

I have a friend who works for a DNO (handy that), and he spends all his working time trying to sort out overvoltage problems with PV, and guess what, normally it is the PV that is at fault, not always, but normally.
So the poor customer gets stuck in the middle,as the DNO do not rectify problems after the mains fuse/tails, most of us are aware what the problem usually is, AC cable is too small from Inverter to mains sending Inverter over voltage.

So it is not surprising they are tightening up, but just as everything in this industry, it is wrong how they go about changing the rules.

Personally I can not see how adding 4kwp is going to affect the grid, unless they already have a problem in that area.
Good luck on that one.

 

[infinity]

As Gavin Asked, why did you pre notify under G83/1? I would of installed and sent notification within 30days as normal

 

[gordysolar]

no i didnt notice other pv i just emailed them night before install like i always do and now problems

 

[sedgy34]

dont worry too much its not going to blow the grid cable up lol always do the job first on a domestic 4kw or under then tell them

 

[Ian-LS]

no i didnt notice other pv i just emailed them night before install like i always do and now problems

again, why are you pre notifying your DNO? This is not required and you are opening yourself up to situations such as the one in your original post

 

[JD6400]

Feel bad for you there Gordy , even more so with every ( ex,spert ) now giving it large after your mistake , but as Sedgy Say's , it is hardly going to bring the network to it's knees .
So good luck fella and it would be good to let us all know the end outcome ?

 

[grandfortune]

Thought i'd check with my DNO, so e-mailed them and got this reply

Good morning

Thank you for your email below.

I have spoken to our Connections Policy team and there has been no change to G83 processes:

- Single systems under 16amps/3.68kW can be installed without prior application using the ‘connect and inform’ G83 stage 1 process
- Multiple systems on the same street regardless of system size need to be pre-applied for using the G83 Stage2 application form
- Single systems over 16 amps need to be pre-applied for using the G83 Stage 2 application form

Please find the Commissioning Confirmation attached to complete after the system has been installed.

Kind regards

 

[Gavin A]

as a suggestion, I'd try emailing the DNO back, and explaining that the SMA 3600TL actually has a more conservative overvoltage protection setting than is required under G83/1, and cuts out if the 10 minute average grid voltage goes above 253V, so it shouldn't actually cause the grid voltage to exceed the limits in the way that some inverters could.

 

[JD6400]

At last , help not criticism !
Thanks Gavin for reminding me why i bother to stay on this forum .

 

[sedgy34]

you would be stage 1 unless you go checking down the same street whos had solar pv? why would the dno expect you to go checking to notify them so you cant do your install that makes loads of sense NOT!!!

 

[gordysolar]

in my training manual for niceic solar course i did a year ago it says

when installing a pv system under g83/1 for single installations the relevent dno must be notified at/before commisioning then g83/1 appendix 3 paperwork handed in before 28 days from install and this is what i did notified them that i was installing a 4kw system with a g83/1 inverter is this not the case? has this changed

 

[gordysolar]

im calling northern power grid in morning i printed it off from there website as long as its limited to 16amp i dont need there permission it says it clear from there webpage it even says on there website that u have to inform them on day of commisioning which i did so i dont understand what i did wrong ?

 

[mdovey]

I'm only an unqualified lurker on these forums, but I thought that G83 Stage 2 only applied if you were installing multiple systems on the same site, and that this thread - http://www.electriciansforums.net/p...installations-needing-advance-permission.html - was about a proposed (but as yet not implemented) change to make G83 stage 2 apply if there are other installations within the same close area (but even then only if those installations were done by the same supplier).

 

[TedM]

G83/1-1 Stage 2 applies if you are installing multiple G83/1 systems on different customer sites within a close geographic region. If they were on the same site then G59/2 would apply (assuming single phase) - subject to DNO agreement.

The problem is that "close geographic region" is not defined under the current G83/1-1 while it is defined in the new (but not yet implemented) G83/2. The issue there is with the practicality of the new definition. Presently different DNO's apply different interpretations.

Gordy should contact the DNO to confirm that he is fitting a G83/1-1 compliant system in a single location and that, therefore, Stage 1 applies. The fact that others have already installed systems within the "close geographic region" is irrelevant. Whether you pre-notify the DNO of the installation or not is also irrelevant as to what Stage of G83/1-1 applies.