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CamoElectric

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With a radiator that is conventionally plumbed, with a valve at either end at the bottom, it should be possible to lift it off its brackets, and rotate it 90 degrees onto wooden blocks of the correct height, so that it lies out into the room. All that's required is to loosen the connections slightly and tighten them when its lain over. Leakage should be zero or just a few drops.
Complete overkill for a bit of unseen skim imo. You don't pull out kitchens to skim all the way down the wall you just skim up to worktop height. Same goes for painting behind rads, nobody takes the rad off to paint they just go as far as they can with an angled brush or mini roller.

What if it's winter? You're leaving someone with no heating for at least a full day while the plaster dries before you can remount, just so you can literally skim in about 6 square inches of plaster that's never going to be seen until you take the rad off the wall.
 
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CamoElectric

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My method doesn't put the radiator out of service. It'll still work lying flat. Done it many times, both for decorating and plastering.
I'm not following you. If pipework is done properly and clipped properly, you won't be able to unhinge the rad from its brackets without disconnecting the pipework. It's physically impossible unless i'm misunderstanding what you'e saying.
 
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brianmoooore

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You need to lift a rad. about 8mm to lift it off of its brackets. A correctly installed rad will have at least that amount of movement, if for no other reason than to stop creaking from expansion and contraction.
A rad. with no movement is a badly installed rad.
 
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CamoElectric

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You need to lift a rad. about 8mm to lift it off of its brackets. A correctly installed rad will have at least that amount of movement, if for no other reason than to stop creaking from expansion and contraction.
A rad. with no movement is a badly installed rad.
Well i can't lift any of the rads off my walls, there's only a couple of mm play and it never creaks, it's silent despite the installation being about 25 years old. Nowhere near enough play to get them off the walls without undoing the pipework. If clipped properly there should be no play in radiators - the clips are snug fit to stop vibration noise.

If you clip a horizontal piece of pipe along a joist before it goes up into a rad there will be no/very little play in the pipe, certainly not 8mm. 8mm would suggest that there is 8mm of play inside the clipped horizontal fixings because how could the pipework move up and down by 8mm otherwise?

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.
 
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Simon47

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With a radiator that is conventionally plumbed, with a valve at either end at the bottom, it should be possible to lift it off its brackets, and rotate it 90 degrees onto wooden blocks of the correct height, so that it lies out into the room. All that's required is to loosen the connections slightly and tighten them when its lain over. Leakage should be zero or just a few drops.
Agreed, I've done that as well in the past.
Same goes for painting behind rads, nobody takes the rad off to paint they just go as far as they can with an angled brush or mini roller.
You can take a running jump with that idea. I always paint behind the rads, and I almost always take them off to do so. In the general case, it's usually possible to see bits that aren't accessible to paint.
It also depends on how the rad is mounted, a lot are mounted too close to get a roller down behind, but you'll definitely see some of the wall you can't paint.
And what about wallpaper ?
What if it's winter? You're leaving someone with no heating for at least a full day
Without heating in that room, the rest of the heating will be just fine.
And if you've just leaned the rad away from the wall or "hinged" it down then you can still have it on - though it's output will be "a bit reduced" if it's laid flat.
As mentioned, I routinely take rads off for decorating etc - we don't live without any heating for weeks (or sometimes, months).
just so you can literally skim in about 6 square inches of plaster that's never going to be seen until you take the rad off the wall.
Pardon 🤪 Take a rad that's (say) 4' wide & 3' high (a lot of mine are bigger than that, one is 4m wide). You'll get, at best, 6" in - and nothing from the bottom - it's harder than painting with a roller. So that's an area 3' wide by 2'6" high - or 1080 square inches. So you're off by a couple of orders of magnitude.

It's interesting that there are people advocating massive disruption to electrical systems, disturbing the connections by doing an EICR on every tenant change (could be twice/year for some properties). And at the same time there are those advocating never disturbing a radiator even for a really infrequent event like skimming the walls !
 
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CamoElectric

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It's interesting that there are people advocating massive disruption to electrical systems, disturbing the connections by doing an EICR on every tenant change (could be twice/year for some properties). And at the same time there are those advocating never disturbing a radiator even for a really infrequent event like skimming the walls !
Electricity is probably more important to get perfect than a bit of skim nobody will ever see. You can get all the way into the brackets on most rads from the sides with a long trowel, and 6-9" down from the top, meaning you're removing rads to skim 2' of wall completely hidden from sight behind a radiator.

I would never advocate for bodging something if it was visible but if you do it properly there is zero visual difference unless you put your head right up alongside the wall and peer down there with one eye. It's the equivalent to pulling out a kitchen to skim behind the backs of the units. But then again we can agree to disagree.
 
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timhoward

timhoward

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Forgive me briefly distracting from the dizzying excitement of life behind radiators...
When the initial walk around on an EICR throws up these, I would reckon the can is very large and there is no shortage of worms still to surface...
This is booked in for late September. More fun to follow I'm sure.

So close....and there are another 3 like this.
1630072041105.png

Ah yes, definitely adequately supported then.
1630072079425.png

Yummy......
1630072156593.png

Maybe labelling could be a little clearer
1630072505351.png

This was what they call the 'new building'. I'm about to be taken to the 'old building'.
 
littlespark

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Gees. If you’re going to do the job, do it right or not at all.
If your going to the extreme of reskimming a wall, get a plumber in or do it yourself.
Take the radiator out, cap the pipe ends and refill. Do the work, plastering, then decorating…. The whole wall…. And put the rad back.

That’s like us fitting a socket and not lining up the skirts on the 3.5 screws so they’re horizontal😆
 
DPG

DPG

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If I paid for a room re-skimming then I would not be happy if the wall behind the radiator was missed out. Let's face it, a re-skim is not exactly a regular thing to have done so you want it right when it is done.

Seems a bit of a bodge to go through all the upheaval and mess of a reskim to not have it spot on.
 
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CamoElectric

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If I paid for a room re-skimming then I would not be happy if the wall behind the radiator was missed out. Let's face it, a re-skim is not exactly a regular thing to have done so you want it right when it is done.

Seems a bit of a bodge to go through all the upheaval and mess of a reskim to not have it spot on.
It's literally never seen, you cannot see it unless you take the rad off and if you do it properly you don't have a massive lip, you can blend it in decently. This is like calling it a bodge because skimming only went just past worktop height before a new kitchen was fitted instead of skimming the entire thing, which is a completely unnecessary time sink and monetary cost.

A lot of plasterers won't touch rads and will make you pay for a plumber if you want it doing.

Seems to me that tradesmen just love to find things to call bodges when in the real world there's nowt wrong with it. Cosmetic work to unseen areas isn't the mark of whether you're a bodger or not. Some rads do have to be taken off, depending on location, but most of them don't. If you can get a trowel in there you can do a decent job and the unskimmed bit will literally never be seen.

Go get a 16 inch trowel and see how far inside a rad it will reach.

Again, i'm sure many will disagree but maybe those people also paint the bases of the walls behind their kitchen plinths.
 
littlespark

littlespark

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You can see down the back of a radiator…. You can’t see behind a fixed kitchen unit.

It’s a case of “but I know it’s there!”


I’ve just done an electric heating job… the wet rads came out and there was undecorated wall behind.
Of course the new heaters aren’t as big as the old radiators. The bare patch is seen.

Luckily the new ones can simply lift off the wall to decorate behind.
 
DPG

DPG

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The 2 plasterers I know do a full skim unless specifically told by the customer otherwise.

Behind kitchen units is a competely different issue as you can't see behind.l them at all. You can see quite a bit behind radiators, and I've noticed this before at some people's houses where you can see the previous paint colour, especially if the radiator is a bit further away from the wall.

Let's face it, you're probably only ever going to have your room skimmed out once in 20 years or more - might as well spend half an hour taking the rad off abd refitting it.
 
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CamoElectric

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The 2 plasterers I know do a full skim unless specifically told by the customer otherwise.

Behind kitchen units is a competely different issue as you can't see behind.l them at all. You can see quite a bit behind radiators, and I've noticed this before at some people's houses where you can see the previous paint colour, especially if the radiator is a bit further away from the wall.

Let's face it, you're probably only ever going to have your room skimmed out once in 20 years or more - might as well spend half an hour taking the rad off abd refitting it.
And that's a fair enough stance, my only point is calling it 'rough' or 'bodging' unless you take all the rads off the wall is a bit of a stretch. Unless you put your head to the wall, if you've done the job properly you cannot see it. It's a more 'complete' job to take the rad off and just skim the lot but it's hardly a bodge job to do otherwise.

Like i said i know plasterers who won't touch rads because they've tackled one in the past and the valve was faulty and snapped off or wouldn't stop leaking once put back together and then they get the blame for it, and guess what, insurance doesn't pay out since they're not plumbers.

In the real world, skimming behind the rad with the rad still on is a perfectly acceptable solution if you do the job properly. That's all i'm saying.
 
nicebutdim

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The 2 plasterers I know do a full skim unless specifically told by the customer otherwise.

The couple of plasterers I know would be clear in telling you where you could stick the job, if there was a suggestion of leaving unfinished surfaces.

Don't think I could sleep at night knowing stuff in the house had been plastered around 😄
 
telectrix

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With a radiator that is conventionally plumbed, with a valve at either end at the bottom, it should be possible to lift it off its brackets, and rotate it 90 degrees onto wooden blocks of the correct height, so that it lies out into the room. All that's required is to loosen the connections slightly and tighten them when its lain over. Leakage should be zero or just a few drops.
that is what i do. rotate , maybe only 45 deg. strap a cable tie or 3 to the wall bracket. paint/paper, whatever, then refix after.
 
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Mikegh

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that is what i do. rotate , maybe only 45 deg. strap a cable tie or 3 to the wall bracket. paint/paper, whatever, then refix after.
Hadn't seen this one before,clever thinking if they will lift

If they're on a ground floor with screed obviously they wont
 
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CamoElectric

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Oh.no wrong again you gotta raise the rad first to tilt
If pipework is clipped properly it's not possible to lift off the brackets. I've tried in my house on the back of this convo and not a one of my 8 rads will lift because the pipework is all clipped down properly. I would have to turn off the water and then completely disconnect the valves to get it off, by which time my floor is soaked.

Someone reckons apparently that properly clipped down pipework is the sign of a rubbish installation though so maybe my installation is just crap.
 
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brianmoooore

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I the pipes come out of a screeded floor, they should have thick walled insulation around them, and there should be enough compliance in this to allow the to be lifted off.
Sounds like CamoElectric's installation is a retrofitted one, with surface mounted pipework. Even then, there shouldn't be clips so close t the radiator that it's unable to be lifted slightly. Too many clips, and clips in the wrong place, stress the pipework.
 

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