Does Part P need Reform?

[Pete999]

Not sure if any of you have picked up Septembers PE yet I was out shopping and picked up a copy fro an Independent Wholesaler.

I am passionate about this issue and have received several " Old, Dumb, Dislike or Disagree markers for my threads", but hey I have broad shoulders, so no worries there then.
The article ends with 8 replies from, what I assume are time served Electricians, waiting for some cries of "Oh no not Pete 999 winging again about 18 Day Domestic installer courses, seems I'm not the only one concerned about this.

The replies range from I'm a timed served sparks and not allowed to do work in my own house apparently, to should Consumers Units have a serial number so only registered Electricians be allowed to buy them, the later from an overseas Sparks, judging by the name. Each reply has it's own validity however controversial. worth a read if you get hold of a copy, rather than just looking at the offers.

Should be getting loads of Old, Dumb responses etc, far to long in the tooth to be worried though, there was one reply which hit the nail on the head, verbatim, " Gas Safe certificates for properties are law, non compliance to the building Regs is illegal, but non compliance to BS7671 is not. Another fundamental difference", well said to the author of that letter.

 

[Midwest]

" Gas Safe certificates for properties are law, non compliance to the building Regs is illegal, but non compliance to BS7671 is not. Another fundamental difference", well said to the author of that letter.

According to the Secretary of State, the best way to comply with the Building regs is to comply with BS7671 (can't remember the exact wording, and can't be arsed to research, 'cos I'm orrff to cook the tea).

As Building regs are statutory, one fits hand in glove with the other. Just needs a few more successful prosecutions. That Kieran bloke would be on my hit list.

 

[Strima]

Part P is a complete waste of time in its current guise. It either needs full reform or binning.

 

[ferg]

Part what?

Ahh that thing you have to deal with in Englandshire.

 

[Toneyz]

" Gas Safe certificates for properties are law, non compliance to the building Regs is illegal, but non compliance to BS7671 is not. Another fundamental difference"

The Part P should have been like this. There should have been one organisation like Gas Safe maybe the NICEIC as they were already formed to upheld standards, instead you have different schemes competing for our custom and to make a profit. Too commercialised instead of upholding of standards. There also needs to be more checking of the electricians of companies that are doing the work ie suitably qualified at the office stage of an assessment.

 

[JAWS]

Do you have to be a time served electrican to change a socket, in other words how do you differentiate who can do what.

 

[buzzlightyear]

three words, waist of time.

 

[MDJ]

I am passionate about this issue and have received several " Old, Dumb, Dislike or Disagree markers for my threads",

Never from me mate, your one of the best sparks I have seen on any forum, keep up the good work, MDJ is by your side.

 

[Joshua]

It was a nice idea that was badly implemented.

In theory I could be a complete cowboy and do shocking work all year long. As long as I take care on 1 or 2 jobs a year for my assessment then I'm good. It should be a random inspection once a year not a prearranged one

it used to mean something when you said you were NICEIC registered but now they're letting anyone join who's done a short course. Now we're inundated with domestic installers who insist they're fully qualified electricians?

Then you've got legitimate companies who are registered, their QS passes the annual assessment but then they employ unqualified people to do the majority of their work? Surely the CPS's should step in and vet a percentage of the employees and not just one guy on a few jobs?

Basically "Part P Qualified" means you're half a spark, mere static to be honest.

 

[Toneyz]

It was a nice idea that was badly implemented.

In theory I could be a complete cowboy and do shocking work all year long. As long as I take care on 1 or 2 jobs a year for my assessment then I'm good. It should be a random inspection once a year not a prearranged one

it used to mean something when you said you were NICEIC registered but now they're letting anyone join who's done a short course. Now we're inundated with domestic installers who insist they're fully qualified electricians?

Then you've got legitimate companies who are registered, their QS passes the annual assessment but then they employ unqualified people to do the majority of their work? Surely the CPS's should step in and vet a percentage of the employees and not just one guy on a few jobs?

Basically "Part P Qualified" means you're half a spark, mere static to be honest.

These are exactly the points I have come to conclude.

 

[Octopus]

Part p would make sense if non compliance rewarded people with criminal records .....

 

[Toneyz]

Part p would make sense if non compliance rewarded people with criminal records .....

I didn't want to give you a disagree but I think it would be the last result though.

 

[Octopus]

I didn't want to give you a disagree but I think it would be the last result though.

It’s all very well having all the sections to the building regs but very few seem to be adhered to ....

 

[Bellendian]

Gas safe is obviously the perfect model...none of the gas safe fitters I work with have ever found any cowboy gas work, ever. Since it's illegal it just doesn't happen!

Illegal, legal, regulated, or unregulated, there will always be rubbish work carried out by the ill informed, lazy or just plain dishonest.

I have no real interest in any more legislation or regulation being imposed, and even if Part P didn't exist, we'd probably remain Nic or ECA anyways! So no change in terms of admin or fees really.

So for me, it is what it is, and at least most homeowners are now vaguely aware that there is some form of restriction on their bodgery!

 

[Octopus]

Gas safe is obviously the perfect model...none of the gas safe fitters I work with have ever found any cowboy gas work, ever. Since it's illegal it just doesn't happen!

Hum .... not sure I agree with that. .....

I know a plumber who isn’t gas safe, who installs boilers and get a registered chap to sign them off....

Then there are customers who buy boilers off the internet ......

 

[Bellendian]

I was being sarcastic murdoch! Of course ---- gas work gets knocked out all the time! That was my point!

 

[Octopus]

I was being sarcastic murdoch! Of course **** gas work gets knocked out all the time! That was my point!

Which takes us neatly back to my previous point .... what is the point of these regs if they are not policed and non compliance acted on ...

 

[static zap]

, " Gas Safe certificates for properties are law, non compliance to the building Regs is illegal, but non compliance to BS7671 is not..

Is it as simple as the fewer deaths of "Innocent bystanders"
--- ( No one official involved below -- unless failed electrical trainee, 18 day blunders)-
Both Gas and Electricity are fiddled , a certain number end in disaster.
Expecting higher death toll/adjacent property damage for gas explosions ?

 

[sparkdog]

I don't think Gas Safe is totally "gas tight" either, from what I observe.

 

[solarsavings]

There are at least as many disgruntled gas fitters as there are electricians moaning about "their industry" all of them demanding that something is "done"
They want restricted sales, more regulation, tougher sanctions for those that don't follow the rules, break the law. Blah blah blah.

For the most part they seem, to me at least, to be old blokes who have had their day or those that struggle to earn a decent living, or just miserable bassas in general.

My father-in-law has wasted many years of his life moaning about the way the "game" has changed. He hasn't been able to change a single thing with his moaning and neither will any of you.