Double socket spurred off of Ring.

[CFTIS]

Ok so I'd like your opinions on this as I seem to be the minority on this.

I'm fairly newly qualified and obviously still learning everyday.

Electricians I work with and everywhere on the web says that spurring a double socket from another that is on a ring final circuit is fine, as long as it's just the one!

Ok so let's set the scene, one double socket spurred off of another via 1x 2.5 t and e, the source socket used is in a ring final circuit on a 32a mcb.

With my understanding 1 single 2.5mm t and e has a ccc of say 27a ref method c, so you could potentially plug 2x 3kw heaters into your spurred socket on full power and thus over load the cable but not the mcb causing potential danger ??

I know any danger is highly unlikely as you'd nearly never plug anything in to draw such a load but surely the potential to is enough for this not to be good practise ??

I must be missing something as everything and everyone I ask seems to say it's fine but surely you'd just extend the ring circuit or add a fused spur first before the additional socket ??

thoughts?

TIA.

 

[Deleted member 9648]

you've answered you own question, the 2.5mm cable (27a rating) serving the spur will not be overloaded by two 13a appliances (26a).

 

[Dave OCD]

And it would be more than highly unlikely that two appliances consuming 3kW each would both be plugged into the same double socket and/or running simultaneously.

 

[Pete999]

Ok so I'd like your opinions on this as I seem to be the minority on this.

I'm fairly newly qualified and obviously still learning everyday.

Electricians I work with and everywhere on the web says that spurring a double socket from another that is on a ring final circuit is fine, as long as it's just the one!

Ok so let's set the scene, one double socket spurred off of another via 1x 2.5 t and e, the source socket used is in a ring final circuit on a 32a mcb.

With my understanding 1 single 2.5mm t and e has a ccc of say 27a ref method c, so you could potentially plug 2x 3kw heaters into your spurred socket on full power and thus over load the cable but not the mcb causing potential danger ??

I know any danger is highly unlikely as you'd nearly never plug anything in to draw such a load but surely the potential to is enough for this not to be good practise ??

I must be missing something as everything and everyone I ask seems to say it's fine but surely you'd just extend the ring circuit or add a fused spur first before the additional socket ??

thoughts?

TIA.

Suggest you familiarise, yourself with Appendix 15 Regulation 433.1.204 Fig 15a 17th edition page 453, gives you all the information you require I should think.

 

[CFTIS]

you've answered you own question, the 2.5mm cable (27a rating) serving the spur will not be overloaded by two 13a appliances (26a).

Ok so that does make sense and I knew it was something simple I was missing, however what if they had an extension lead plugged in and had something else plugged in pulling another 1kw putting the load to 30a ?

I know this is ridiculously unlikely but it's still possible, if this happened could it start a fire then you'd be at fault and liable ?

you've answered you own question, the 2.5mm cable (27a rating) serving the spur will not be overloaded by two 13a appliances (26a).

 

[CFTIS]

Suggest you familiarise, yourself with Appendix 15 Regulation 433.1.204 Fig 15a 17th edition page 453, gives you all the information you require I should think.

Ok I'll have a look thanks.

 

[Dave OCD]

The extension lead would have a 13a fuse in its plug.

 

[westward10]

Even if both points of the socket outlet were drawing 13A it would be an extreme installation method which would result in the cable combusting (Is that a word?)

 

[CFTIS]

The extension lead would have a 13a fuse in its plug.

haha fair point, so it's fine I knew I was wrong somewhere, I've just made myself look daft on here, which I can live with

 

[Pete999]

haha fair point, so it's fine I knew I was wrong somewhere, I've just made myself look daft on here, which I can live with

No you haven't Mate sometimes the simplest things are hard to see.

 

[Dave OCD]

haha fair point, so it's fine I knew I was wrong somewhere, I've just made myself look daft on here, which I can live with

Don't let that bother you at all mate, you're new to the trade and I think you have exactly the right attitude, you'll do well.

 

[Risteard]

Also bear in mind that double socket outlets are only rated for 20A.

 

[CFTIS]

cheers guys

 

[The Ghost]

20A.

13A, hunkers down in trench.

 

[Octopus]

13A, hunkers down in trench.

He means the total rating on a dual socket is 20A, not individual sockets ......

 

[The Ghost]

Double socket is 13A

 

[Octopus]

Double socket is 13A

Single plug is 13A

 

[westward10]

They are type tested for 20A.

 

[The Ghost]

Ok so why do the manufacturers rate them at 13A on say the MK and Hager site?

 

[westward10]

They accept 13A, BS1363 plugs.