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Discuss Downlights and the different varieties.. in the Electrical Forum area at ElectriciansForums.net

happyhippydad

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I was with a customer today discussing installing new downlights.

I can't quite see the point in installing the really expensive ones as opposed to the cheaper ones. I don't mean the silly cheap ones on ebay that will just fall apart, but for example...

Lap fixed LED from screwfix £7 approx (good reviews and feel like good quality) compared to JCC, robus, enlite etc etc £15-20?

Also, do you guys prefer integrated LED downlights or ones that you can change the bulb? Again, I struggle with the concept of integrated as you have to change the whole downlight when they go. Are they supposed to have a longer life expectancy? A quality LED lamp is supposed to have about 15 years life expectancy so why not just fit a downlight with a quality changeable LED lamp as opposed to an integrated unit?
 
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SparkyChick

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Personally I avoid integrated fittings as much as I can. Styles and such change so rapidly these days I dread the thought of having to explain to a client I can't simply replace the one that's failed because I can't get the fittings any more. So I tend to go for lamps that use GU10 bulbs ;)
 

Andy78

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I have had problems with GU10 leds since I started using them. Cheap brands and expensive brands.
I have had problems with cheap integrated led fittings.
I have had minimal to negligible problems with the mid range integrated fittings I use.

The GU10 form was designed for the purposes of housing a halogen light source. This was not designed for housing a led source, this is a retrofit solution and pretty much the definition of a bodge.

Just look at the heatsink chip cooling solutions provided with integrated led fittings and it should become apparent that the GU10 form is not the best format for housing such equipment.
 

Midwest

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Failure rate is not much of an argument IMO, as both formats will last a very long time, unless you have the misfortune (like me) to install some particular examples. In the most part, if they fail, they fail pretty soon after installation.

I would like someone to give some more prices of a good GU10 lamp (notice I didn't say bulb) and can (sorry HHD, not LAP), compared to your average integrated ones. 1st floor etc installation, don't see how you can install anything other than a good quality integrated, which can be covered by insulation. Can the others?

If you're concerned about lamp replacement, JCC hybrids are easily replaceable by the end user. Think there some others on the market.

On the other hand, I've recently gone over to the dark side, and fitted some Philips Hue gu10's in my house. Output's a bit on the mean side. See Aurora and doing some 'Smart' lighting with GU10's, better output. Perhaps thats where the market will start to go.
 

Andy78

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If you're concerned about lamp replacement, JCC hybrids are easily replaceable by the end user. Think there some others on the market.
JCC have now discontinued this line and flogged all their stock to a wholesale discounter.
 

Andy78

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That didn't last long, did it. Wonder how the warranty will work on that then?
I believe JCC have kept the legally required amount for warranty purposes, but all their sale stock has been got rid of. This info came from the discounter who was flogging them on a facebook group and using this reason to justify the low prices they were selling for. Might need verifying.
 

Midwest

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I believe JCC have kept the legally required amount for warranty purposes, but all their sale stock has been got rid of. This info came from the discounter who was flogging them on a facebook group and using this reason to justify the low prices they were selling for. Might need verifying.
Your post prompted me to read this piece;

JCC FlameGuard Downlights – End of an Era - JCC Lighting, Latest News - Downlights Direct Advice - https://www.downlightsdirect.co.uk/advice/lighting-brand-names/jcc-lighting/jcc-flameguard-downlights-end-of-an-era/

Seems they got their fingers burnt with the FGLED6. The V50, now only has a 3 year warranty. But it seems its a third of the price of the old FGLED10 etc.
 

Andy78

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Seems they got their fingers burnt with the FGLED6. The V50, now only has a 3 year warranty. But it seems its a third of the price of the old FGLED10 etc.
Seems more sensible. I did think their 7-9 year warranties were a bit ambitious. It's an evolving technology so the early models are clearly destined to become obsolete.

I have heard good things about the V50 model so far. It is very similar to the KSR models I have been using for few years now. They also do a CCT version.
 

NDG Elecs

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I normally lean towards Enlite E8 and E5s. Found them reasonably priced (online) and no failures to date that I know of.
I avoid Lap gear generally but I actually don't mind their LED GU10s, very good price and of the many I've fitted only been called back once. Screwfix swap them for new with no quibbles.
I would prefer non integrated fittings but they are largely harder to come by these days.
 

Midwest

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Seems more sensible. I did think their 7-9 year warranties were a bit ambitious. It's an evolving technology so the early models are clearly destined to become obsolete.

I have heard good things about the V50 model so far. It is very similar to the KSR models I have been using for few years now. They also do a CCT version.
I convinced a guy to replace his troublesome MR16 luminaires in his house. Populated his whole house with JCC FGLED6's. Big mistake. Still replacing them one by one, 3 years on. In fairness to JCC, he just rings them up, and they send him a replacement FOC. Hope the last one goes before JCC run out of stock. :)

Not a good advert for integrated.
 

davesparks

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Personally I use eco600s from ecostar, I've found them to be incredibly reliable and they look better than most as you can't see the individual LEDs.
The price is a bit much for some people but I've never had an issue with it.
 

Andy78

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I convinced a guy to replace his troublesome MR16 luminaires in his house. Populated his whole house with JCC FGLED6's. Big mistake. Still replacing them one by one, 3 years on. In fairness to JCC, he just rings them up, and they send him a replacement FOC. Hope the last one goes before JCC run out of stock. :)

Not a good advert for integrated.
Definitely not, but that range seemed to be very flawed. I once went to a large house full of failed JCC integrated fittings, not the FGLED but presumably a forerunner.

I'm happy with KSR. Been using them for over 4 years with only 2 faulty in that time out of many hundreds. They have altered their fittings' design slightly in the time I've been using them, but the visible parts match older ones very well.
 

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