EICR Payments

[lionthecatt]

We are currently in dispute with a customer who has not paid for any EICR certificate's we have provided. The first batch(12) were forwarded with the invoice for the cert and remedial works required to gain a satisfactory certificate. The second batch was invoice only and no certificate. Their solicitor has requested the certificates before payment. They stated the industry norm is to provide the certificate before payment. The customer has already proved this is a bad idea. Please feel free to post your thoughts and feelings on this issue.

 

[Octopus]

How long ago did you submit your first invoice? and why is their Solicitor involved?

 

[lionthecatt]

This started April 2012, no payments received for 37 tests and 16K of remedial works including the costs of the original test

 

[lionthecatt]

This started April 2012, no payments received for 37 tests and 16K of remedial works including the costs of the original test

 

[Octopus]

This started April 2012, no payments received for 37 tests and 16K of remedial works including the costs of the original test

And you've not taken them to court AND you've done more work for them??

Madness

 

[Hiddo]

Is it in your terms and conditions about when certificates are issued?

Mine state that certification will only be issued once payment has been received as cleared funds.

Why is their solicitor involved?

 

[lionthecatt]

And you've not taken them to court AND you've done more work for them??

Madness

This was all completed within a few weeks by several men for a new contact from a friend. No issue was ever considered. Payment was not forthcoming so work was stopped. The work completed was before payment was an issue. The legal fees are about to outstrip the invoices, so yes we are taking them to court. The great British system that protects small business from unscrupulous crooks. 50/50 chance of winning, but even then they could go bankrupt or just not pay! The question was though, certificate with or without payment.

 

[lionthecatt]

It is in our T & C's but they are claiming its not industry standard. We also have a clause stating the verbal instruction given to us to proceed with the remedial works is a contract. Our Solicitor has confirmed this.

 

[Richard Burns]

Industry standard is immaterial if there is something different in your terms and conditions and they had access to these terms and conditions at the time of the works. That said I would probably agree it is industry standard, but not necessarily good business.

If you have provided a service and not been paid, then any further service can stopped as the contract has been broken.
You have completed the service of inspecting the premises and the further service of preparing and providing a written report has been stopped due to the breach of contract.

Surely this is something that your solicitor can do for you.

My statement is not a statement of law but just my idea of it.

 

[Octopus]

This was all completed within a few weeks by several men for a new contact from a friend. No issue was ever considered. Payment was not forthcoming so work was stopped. The work completed was before payment was an issue. The legal fees are about to outstrip the invoices, so yes we are taking them to court. The great British system that protects small business from unscrupulous crooks. 50/50 chance of winning, but even then they could go bankrupt or just not pay! The question was though, certificate with or without payment.

Given the history with the client it is simple - all debts paid and 50% payment for the latest work, then certificates will be provided.

Let them take you to court and see what happens

 

[lionthecatt]

The reply given by the NICEIC:Unfortunately, the legal, contractual and NICEIC positions all agree that the electrical contract is not complete until the certificate is handed over, as it is a part of the electrical installation process described in BS7671. Therefore, your customer can claim that he will not pay until the electrical installation work is complete (complete with certificate).

My advice is, issue the certificates and then sue for breach of contract if they do not pay. It seems we again as contractors are on our own, with the continued legal action the only option

 

[Brightspark2]

We're the same we dont issue certificates until payed. Its all we have!.


Seems pretty much industry standard to me...

 

[Octopus]

The reply given by the NICEIC:Unfortunately, the legal, contractual and NICEIC positions all agree that the electrical contract is not complete until the certificate is handed over, as it is a part of the electrical installation process described in BS7671. Therefore, your customer can claim that he will not pay until the electrical installation work is complete (complete with certificate).

My advice is, issue the certificates and then sue for breach of contract if they do not pay. It seems we again as contractors are on our own, with the continued legal action the only option

Shame you can't name and shame them - walk away and let somebody else take the pain.

 

[scotte1980]

Was thinking this myself, and would there insurance be void without the relevant cert. or could u put this on the invoice.

 

[Sparkytlec]

All though its a bit late for your case we are about to trial a system called bond pay. It uses a third party to hold funds before work starts (so you know you will get paid) and you only get paid when the customer is happy the work is complete. If there is a dispute they have independent surveyors to resolve the dispute. They also give a 1 year warranty that if work is defective and you are no longer trading they will pay up to 50% of the original cost to put defects right.

 

[thekingiam]

sounds like niceic are only saying you need to issue certs so they can get paid.
if they are saying industry standard is to issue, put a poll on this website to see how many would issue certs before paying?
doubt if legaly correct but at least you may have something to throw back at them?

 

[Octopus]

For people who have issues with bad payers for certs, surely all they need to do is add a caveat to their quotes saying certificates will be provided on receipt of payment. Then thats' covered.