Discuss Extending a ring main outside. in the Electrical Forum area at ElectriciansForums.net

Status
Not open for further replies.
S

SAGE

Ok so firstly I am not a DIY'er but would like to get some info in regards to the following project.

I have a new house (2009) so the main board has rcd protection and the wiring would conform to the regs in that year I am not certain about the month though.

I need to get power to the garage outside (5-15meters away depending where I put the power socket in the garage) but am unsure of the best/legal way to do so.

My first thought was to add a rcd spur to the downstairs socket ring main and run 2.5 armoured cable underground(is there a specific depth?) into the garage and stick a double socket(used for lights and a fridge) which I thought would be fine. However I would like to turn the garage into a pub and do not think that 1 double socket will be enough and I do not want to have some shock horror multiple 4 plug extension lead scenario :)

I have now thought that it would be better to extend the ring main (not sure of the best way of doing this, just remove a socket and use a junction box?) that does not sound like a great idea but does it meet regs ? I have even thought about putting in an additional fuse box into the garage for better protection but I cannot get a cable back to the consumer board in the house. I would have preferred to do it this way.

I know guys at work with part P but know **** all about electrics so was hoping you proper sparks to help me out :)

Can a part P person sign this off or do I need a proper sparks to make the final connection ?
 

stef

Regular EF Member
Messages
576
Location
Gosport
Better would be a second ring if it is for an outside building like a garage pub. Anyway,Any work involving outside wiring and adding circuits needs to comply to part P either a registered spark or LAB.
 

Murdoch

Regular EF Member
Messages
26,648
Location
Woking
No scheme member will sign off another persons work, that's why its referred to as self certification.
 
OP
G

Guest123

Are you able to route an SWA externally to the garge at all???
 
OP
S

SAGE

to many terms he I do not know :) I thought it would something like what I do. Get somebody to run all the htg pipes how I want them (pipe sizing etc) then I do the boiler. but the electrican version :) please forgive my ignorance
 
OP
G

Guest123

SWA = Steel Wire Armoured cable, which could possibly be routed externally to the garage rather than through the house???
 

telectrix

Disrespected Scouser
Electrician's Arms
Trainee Access
Messages
63,525
Location
cheshire/staffordshire
sage, the ideal way would be for you to get a qualified spark to do the job. to save some cash, he might be happy for you to dig and run a steelwire armoured cable from your CU location to the garage. get a quote or 2 and see if you can do some of the donkey work. i know i would appreciate the groundworks to be done by someone else! LOL. (trench should be at least 18" deep. btw).
 
OP
S

SAGE

thanks telectrix that is what I intend to do, I just need to know what type and how to run the cables. They are ripping up the old driveway and putting down a new one so this is the only time I get to run the cables. I'm not intending to do it myself I am a gas engineer and totally understand all your stand points on "illegal" minor/major works I just need to know what to run and how best to run it, mainly do I need 1 cable to the garge from the house or 2 ? is 2.5mm good enough or will I need a thicker cable ?

Just asking what the regs say really I am not looking for a detailed step by step instruction so I can carry the work myself and tbh I only really know 1 proper sparks who is in fact a bit of a dick :) hence me using a forum for help rather than picking up the phone :)

I just want to run the cables while I can I'm not looking to start the "pub" till after xmas

hope this clears up a few things

@Lenny No way to go underground with the cable from the consumer board, the plug I intended to use is at the far back at the house which is next to the front of the garage.

:EDIT I was just wondering if what I plan to is possible or a big no no because I can not get back to the consumer board with the armour cable.
 

Strima

Electrician's Arms
Messages
3,632
Location
St Neots
How long is the run etc. I would probably be going between 4 or 6mm SWA dependant upon length or run expected load etc. Also a bit factored in for future proofing.
 
OP
S

SAGE

it is around 10meters I would say, would it be better to run 2 of them and extend the ring or will it be ok to spur ?
 
OP
G

Guest123

it is around 10meters I would say, would it be better to run 2 of them and extend the ring or will it be ok to spur ?

If you 'spur' off the RFC, you are limited to 13A full load.

Personally I dont like the idea of extending the RFC outside of the house to the garage as at some point it may become inadvertantly overloaded due to further future extension & additions etc.

Also the RFC continuity may again be indvertantly lost due to the aformentioned further future extension & additon.


Whilst it may be a PITA, a dedicated radial circuit from the CU is the best way to proceed IMO. Is the CU on a outside wall that you could drill out from and trench to the garage....you mention having your driveway ripped up soon....?????
 

Jimmy Boy

Electrician's Arms
Messages
1,281
Location
Lounge
All i would say is read the attached PDF and as for cable sizing difficult unless you know demand but I cant see you needing more than a 6mm + if you have metal services coming in for the pub they will extraneous and now you have to bring a 10mm bonding cable to the pub
 

Attachments

OP
S

SAGE

na there is no easy way to get from the CU, it is located on the ground floor toilet(next to the front door) the garage is located next door but one if that make sense. I live next door to a coach house whos garage is next to my house.

I think it might be easir to use a plug in rcd and just run a light and fridge off of it if what I want is not going to be possible
 

Jimmy Boy

Electrician's Arms
Messages
1,281
Location
Lounge
If you have a clear site line between the house and the garage you could go overhead on a catenary wire set up but you would need to mark it properly if any vehicle movement in vicinity

J
 

telectrix

Disrespected Scouser
Electrician's Arms
Trainee Access
Messages
63,525
Location
cheshire/staffordshire
if you have to come off an exisring ring final. i would install a 4 core , 2.5mm SWA. that way, you are extending the rfc.
 
OP
S

SAGE

looking at fig 2 of Jimmy Boys pdf I notice that there is a single socket, does this suggest that only a single applicance can be run from this method ? if so could I spur twice of 2 different sockets of the ring main ? as I know you can not spur off a spur
 

Strima

Electrician's Arms
Messages
3,632
Location
St Neots
You can run a 2 gang socket off a spur so in theory if you have ten outlets on a ring you can have ten spurs which can give you up to forty outlets.
 
OP
S

SAGE

thanks for all your help
I'm currently digging up the garden for the duct and amoured to go down, this is worse than working in lofts :/


 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Permanent unswitched live colour?

  • Brown

    Votes: 63 67.0%
  • Black

    Votes: 31 33.0%

Electrician Talk

Electrical Forum

Welcome to the Electrical Forum at ElectriciansForums.net. The friendliest electrical forum online. General electrical questions and answers can be found in the electrical forum.
Top