Discuss Floor sockets + Building Regs in the Electrical Forum area at ElectriciansForums.net

KevinH

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48
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Pembrokeshire
I am 1st fixing an extension and in one area there is no wall space (glass walls like a sun lounge) for any sockets although customer insists he wants a power point in the corner.
I suggested a floor socket as the floor is due to be insulated and screeded.
The customer sounded happy with that but then he remembered an earlier conversation we had with me trying to explain building regs regarding heights between 450mm and 1200mm for switches/sockets etc on new builds, then he asked a brilliant question.........why do they make floor sockets if anything can't be lower than 450mm?
To be honest I was stuck for an answer and (to save embarrassment) I said the regs only cover WALL accessories.....only answer I could think of and he bought it.
So my question is pretty much the same as my customers. The answer is probably in some literature somewhere, but I thought I would just ask on this site instead.
 

cliffed

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Lancs
I put 2 in my conservatory,under the screed-in conduit,didn’t use the normal floor box,just normal ko box,their fine,no regs against that.
 

Pete999

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I agree, but then are we saying you can't use floor sockets on a new build?
Don't suppose there are many requirements for floor sockets in new build houses hence treat it as a one off.
 

DT1991

Regular EF Member
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Location
.
Maybe that would require coordination with building control on a new build.

Maybe some area in a new build house is a self contained office.
 

pirate

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Glasgow
I have recently installed a couple of socket outlets in a ceiling, 3m above the floor. They are for a dust extraction system and a projector. There is nothing wrong with this, imho, as they are for specific purposes, and will not be used for general things like a hoover or table lamp. Yes, they will be difficult of access for a less-able person, but then they are there for a single purpose, and I absolutely assert my right to put them where they are because they are clearly fit for purpose. Floor-mounted sockets could be deemed to be the same, if they serve a fixed location like an office. I don't care if the leccy police say they should be at a certain height on the wall...so, sue me! If you want to hoover the office, plug the damn thing into a socket that IS at the "correct" height, even if in a different room, hall, corridor, passage.
Floor sockets are more vulnerable to damage and spills, for sure...but hey, lots of sockets are, especially those installed in extractor hoods, or near sinks, even if within the regs. There are good reasons for the height regs, for general use sockets, but there are good reasons for other sockets being installed contrary to those regs.
It should be common sense, but somehow I don't think everyone will agree with me.
 

telectrix

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I have recently installed a couple of socket outlets in a ceiling, 3m above the floor. They are for a dust extraction system and a projector. There is nothing wrong with this, imho, as they are for specific purposes, and will not be used for general things like a hoover or table lamp. Yes, they will be difficult of access for a less-able person, but then they are there for a single purpose, and I absolutely assert my right to put them where they are because they are clearly fit for purpose. Floor-mounted sockets could be deemed to be the same, if they serve a fixed location like an office. I don't care if the leccy police say they should be at a certain height on the wall...so, sue me! If you want to hoover the office, plug the damn thing into a socket that IS at the "correct" height, even if in a different room, hall, corridor, passage.
Floor sockets are more vulnerable to damage and spills, for sure...but hey, lots of sockets are, especially those installed in extractor hoods, or near sinks, even if within the regs. There are good reasons for the height regs, for general use sockets, but there are good reasons for other sockets being installed contrary to those regs.
It should be common sense, but somehow I don't think everyone will agree with me.
i agree with you . :p:p:p
 

Des 56

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I think it was a very good question and having no intention of reading part P and its associated junk,its one I can't answer
 

Des 56

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The junk you require would actually be in Part M!
Having never read any of these "must have" documents I will accept your reply as true and well intentioned
If ever I needed to apply building regs to my work it was always done via what was contained inside my head :)

I did find a useful purpose at one time,they were fine for showing to a scheme assessor once a year
 

Strima

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St Neots
Unlike us mere mortals, the writers of building regulations are unable to apply common sense and those that enforce said regulations need common sense beating into them with the regulations books.
 
OP
KevinH

KevinH

Regular EF Member
Messages
48
Location
Pembrokeshire
Thanks all! I agree with all comments posted.
So basically the general answer is......bugger this reg as its not practical in some cases!!?? Seems kinda pointless having it eh?
 

Strima

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St Neots
Thanks all! I agree with all comments posted.
So basically the general answer is......bugger this reg as its not practical in some cases!!?? Seems kinda pointless having it eh?
The reg isn’t pointless, it just needs to be applied correctly using common sense.
 

Resu

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Thanks all! I agree with all comments posted.
So basically the general answer is......bugger this reg as its not practical in some cases!!?? Seems kinda pointless having it eh?
I think the key words are "general use". Provided some sockets are sited at the right heights for general use, the odd one placed in an otherwise unusual position doesn't matter.
 

Taylortwocities

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Oxfordshire
The “Approved Documents” eg Part P, Part M etc provide guidance on ways that we will be able to comply with the Statutory Legislation.

Socket heights are to provide sufficient access for disabled folk. Install sufficient sockets at the required height and add dome floor sockets.
Double check with you local friendly LABC person. They’ll be fine with it.
 

pirate

Regular EF Member
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2,108
Location
Glasgow
Minimum height of the dome is probably less than 1mm...
anything less and it would appear to be flat...
A flat surface would not be a dome, so we are looking at any height that might conceivably be dome-shaped...actually, maybe 0.5mm in the centre might be dome-shaped...well, of course it would technically, as would any height more than 0, but to the human eye/touch, I expect 0.5mm would be a dome to most folks. Indeed, anything giving a quaquaversal plane would be a dome...
Sheesh...all this work for a typo!
 

Taylortwocities

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Oxfordshire
if its an extension... sockets and switches can match the same height as existing fittings
Yes. That’s the point. And I had missed that it was an extension. Those socket heights only apply to new builds where all of the requirements of Part M come into play. Things like accessibility ramps, wider (wheelchair) doors for downstairs toilets, and much more.

@KevinH you can put the sockets etc to match the heights in the rest of the house, and in the floor for your problem locations.

You can download the Approved document here https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/540330/BR_PDF_AD_M1_2015_with_2016_amendments_V3.pdf

This is the key point in the introduction
4C726A19-8162-40BE-B4F3-57882327151F.jpeg
 
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DPG

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S Yorkshire
Nobody has mentioned the easiest 2 solutions:

Sink a couple of feet of uni-strut into the concrete floor and fasten a metal-clad socket to that.

Glue a standard back-box to the glass panel.
 

Lister1987

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Location
Runcorn
Install as planned then just write on minor works as a deviation from height regs, that way you've "followed" regs re certification and CYA'd by advising of the deviation on the paperwork
 

richy3333

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Install as planned then just write on minor works as a deviation from height regs, that way you've "followed" regs re certification and CYA'd by advising of the deviation on the paperwork
But it doesn't need noting as (in your scenario) it would be a deviation from Building Regs, not BS7671?

I've just had architect drawings for a new build in scotland and our sockets are supposed to be at 400mm. However it includes floor sockets for the property so clearly nobody else has an issue with it! I don't.
 

Lister1987

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Doesn't BS7671 stipulate install heights and location as well as found in building regs?

Either way you're recording it somewhere relevant and covering your arse, that's how I do it but I'm still learning
 

Taylortwocities

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BS7671 does not stipulate heights, only to say that sockets go in places where damage wont be caused to them by insertion of a plug.

That august publication, the OSG, mentions 450/1200mm heights of sockets etc, but states that these only apply to new builds. At least they got that right!
 

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