HMO Smoke alarms?

[alex kane]

Hello Everyone

A landlord recently asked me if I could carry out smoke alarm testing. When I asked her to go into more detail she just said the smoke alarms needed testing in one of her 'HMO' Properties (House in multiple occupation). This was all I could get out of her. When I went to take a look at the property the only smoke alarms present were in the living room and hallways, plus a heat detector in the kitchen.

As I don't have much experience with rented properties or HMO's, which I've heard have different rules I was hoping somebody could explain what sort of test certificate is required? I am currently working towards my 2394 inspection and testing but this sounds more like periodic inspection and testing me. I have tried to find more information on the web but haven't found much luck.

Any advice/ help would be appreciated.

 

[gavin.sibley]

Press test button. Wait for noise. Take payment.

Job done!!

 

[snowhead]

Press test button. Wait for noise. Take payment.

Job done!!

Leave piece of paper to say that you have only done the above.

 

[tazz]

you need to fill out a BS5839 Part 6 test & inspection certificate.

 

[derbylad]

Press test button. Wait for noise. Take payment.

Job done!!

Its a smoke alarm test in a HMO so it is very important to agree with the client what client wants and then decide if you can do the job. You have to be sure as the re is too much potential for disaster if you say the smoke alarms are working ok
and there turns out to be a big fire and the investigation says the smoke alarms had no batteries in.!! Change batteries and test the alarms and check they are on a dedicated circuit.

 

[tazz]

Its a smoke alarm test in a HMO so it is very important to agree with the client what client wants and then decide if you can do the job. You have to be sure as the re is too much potential for disaster if you say the smoke alarms are working ok
and there turns out to be a big fire and the investigation says the smoke alarms had no batteries in.!! Change batteries and test the alarms and check they are on a dedicated circuit.

As my previous post, a BS5839 part 6 will be requested by BC for HMO Licence...There is more to pressing a button to testing as explained in the BS. As the minimum grade for HMO is D.....A dedicated circuit is not required.

 

[bigspark17]

Dedicated circuit not required.! Test the test button make sure interconnection are setting all alarm off, spray smokes with smoke spray and hair dryer to test heat.! What about call points or reset/silence/test points,?

 

[tazz]

Dedicated circuit not required.! Test the test button make sure interconnection are setting all alarm off, spray smokes with smoke spray and hair dryer to test heat.! What about call points or reset/silence/test points,?

If you read the op post it refers to a Grade D HMO, not a Grade A....mains interlink smokes and heats, which do not require a dedicated circuit. Hairdryer????...can`t you afford a solo kit.

 

[bigspark17]

Where does he say it's grade d.??? He hasn't been there yet! And do u take your customers word for everything they say.? You must have mug written on your forehead if you do.! No I can't afford that.. Missus old hairdryer does me grande!!!

 

[tazz]

Hello Everyone

A landlord recently asked me if I could carry out smoke alarm testing. When I asked her to go into more detail she just said the smoke alarms needed testing in one of her 'HMO' Properties (House in multiple occupation). This was all I could get out of her. When I went to take a look at the property the only smoke alarms present were in the living room and hallways, plus a heat detector in the kitchen.

As I don't have much experience with rented properties or HMO's, which I've heard have different rules I was hoping somebody could explain what sort of test certificate is required? I am currently working towards my 2394 inspection and testing but this sounds more like periodic inspection and testing me. I have tried to find more information on the web but haven't found much luck.

Any advice/ help would be appreciated.

No mention of control panel nor required heat/sounders in bedrooms, which is requirement of HMO Grade A....comment given and highlighted in red shows grade D only.

 

[derbylad]

As my previous post, a BS5839 part 6 will be requested by BC for HMO Licence...There is more to pressing a button to testing as explained in the BS. As the minimum grade for HMO is D.....A dedicated circuit is not required.

a dedicated circuit for smoke alarms is good practice regardless and the seperation of circuits too,so when something trips an mcb you know its a faulty light and not maybe the smoke alarm or the hairdryer..and the client decides what is required,not some wise guy on the internet.

 

[tazz]

For Mains only detection Grade E, a dedicate circuit is required.....for grade D the addition of a battery backup, allows for warning of mains failure. This allows grade D detection to be connected to existing lighting circuits. With the lockable base forming 2 pole isolation for maintenance/repair.
To obtain a HMO licence, the BC decide what is required, following BS5839 and approved document B.

 

[alex kane]

Sounds like I need to get my hands on a BS5839 Part 6 test & inspection certificate then. Does anyone know where I can get these and what qualifications are needed to sign them off.
Like I said, I'm working towards my 2394 but this only allows me to sign off my own work. As the alarms are already in place, I get the impression this is periodic inspection and testing, which would mean I would need my 2395 under my belt?

 

[tazz]

Any scam you are with will have testing certs, if not you can buy a book of certs from you local wholesaler. You dont need any qualification, but you need to be competent on what you are doing. Suggest in long run you need to buy a full solo test kit, but for now, buy a can of test smoke, so you can test detectors correctly, also suggest changing all batteries.

 

[polo1]

Any scam you are with will have testing certs, if not you can buy a book of certs from you local wholesaler. You dont need any qualification, but you need to be competent on what you are doing. Suggest in long run you need to buy a full solo test kit, but for now, buy a can of test smoke, so you can test detectors correctly, also suggest hanging all batteries.

The batteries are innocent, they should not be hanged :willy_nilly:

 

[alex kane]

If all the work I do only entails changing broken smoke alarms then I assume this work is not notifiable? As I haven't made any changes or alterations to the existing circuit?
I've had a look at the bs 5839-6 certificate and it doesn't go into any detail about the circuit itself. Do I need to bother recording the results for testing the circuit as if I was filling out a MWC?

 

[tazz]

In the BS5839 there is a Modification certificate, I would use this on any system that needs to be repair, replaced or added to. Again this would be added to a new commissioning certificate, proving the system was left in a fully working state. Arse covering exercise.

 

[alex kane]

Still trying to find any official certs but to no luck. The the best ones I have found are:
https://www.elecsa.co.uk/Documents/Public-Documents/Contractors/Model-Fire-Alarm-Certificate.aspx

BS5839 Part 6 Installation Certificate Pack: Amazon.co.uk: SYAM: Books

I'll do a MWC as well to cover my back. If anyone has any links to better ones please post them. From what I've read, everyone is struggling to find them and everyone is just doing what they think is best.

 

[tazz]

Are you not part of a scheme..?

This is easycert, but you scheme should have them
http://www.tysoft.co.uk/easycert_certificates.htm

 

[alex kane]

No I am not. I have passed my 2394 inspection and testing recently (woohoo) but haven't joined up yet. I intend to soon. As as far as I am aware if it isn't notifiable work then I don't need to be part of a scheme.