Insulation Resistance Testing - necessary ?

[Bazabacon]

Recently my boss and I were changing a fuse board(old to new). It was a shared house and some of the tenants were out at work and their doors locked. Not knowing what they had plugged in, in their rooms we skipped the Insulation Resistance test. Everything else was tested fine. My question to him was obviously - is that cocha ? He said strictly speaking that the RCD would trip out if there was any issue with the insulation, so it was ok to bypass it. Thoughts ?

 

[Kate]

No. At very minimum I would test at 250v.
How can you have completed the test cert if you didn't have access to the circuits??? If you can't access rooms you can't have done the other tests properly. So your 'everything else was tested fine' comment it bullsh1t

 

[Bazabacon]

No. At very minimum I would test at 250v.
How can you have completed the test cert if you didn't have access to the circuits??? If you can't access rooms you can't have done the other tests properly. So your 'everything else was tested fine' comment it bullsh1t

yeah - obviously we couldn't get in to the rooms to test everything, but the rooms that we had access too, we tested. I have only been doing this a year, so my question is borne out of coming out of college where EVERYTHING is done by the book and to the letter of the law to the REALWORLD where obviously on occasion you cannot do everything by the book. Don't get me wrong I don't want to be taking shortcuts, but as I have little experience I guess, I'm basically asking , does my boss sound like a bit of a cowboy ? and would a 250 v test take any plugged in appliances out ?

 

[oldtimer]

Having to agree with Kate on this as I am seeing a lot of this where the mentality is if the RCD does not trip then its fine. Well not really as for the insulation test he could have done a combined LN-E 250v IR test.

Plus you can tell that when an OP comes on with the famous Help ! RCD is tripping type of post ? so again before a CU is changed do a Ze,PFC,PSSC, and a global LN-E 250 IR test and then you will have a chance.

 

[crow11]

as kate said how could you have provided a full cert if you haven't tested all the circuits, you don't know what is going on in them other rooms, you need to get into them other rooms to complete the testing, with the attitude of your boss why doesn't he just skip all testing and just switch on and hope for the best hopefully the rcd will trip if anything wrong, if it was me i wouldn't of been energizing them circuits until i have tested, think of it as your house would you be happy for someone to take shortcuts on something which could be dangerous, did your boss actually provide a eic for this job

 

[Bazabacon]

Having to agree with Kate on this as I am seeing a lot of this where the mentality is if the RCD does not trip then its fine. Well not really as for the insulation test he could have done a combined LN-E 250v IR test.

Plus you can tell that when an OP comes on with the famous Help ! RCD is tripping type of post ? so again before a CU is changed do a Ze,PFC,PSSC, and a global LN-E 250 IR test and then you will have a chance.

As I say, I have no other experience to compare my boss against. Sometimes I have wondered if he's cutting corners or not. I guess by your replies he is. I seen him drill a hole in the wall the other week and the cables were still live. I was then tasked with chasing out the wall for a backbox on the other side of the hole, where I discovered he was literally millimteres away from live wires. I told him and he just grumbled something. Made me have a bit of a think. I do want to learn, but I want to learn the RIGHT way

 

[Kate]

From your original post I knew you were a trainee. Im just a bit mad someone is showing you wrong. Your doing the right thing asking, I also know its impossible for you to realistically point all his flaws out to him as you would most likely get the sack. Keep asking us questions and when you do your own work do it right!

I do 250v IR on lighting as im worried about blowing every lamp!! And with modern tech of downlighters theres just too many lamps to remove.

 

[Bazabacon]

From your original post I knew you were a trainee. Im just a bit mad someone is showing you wrong. Your doing the right thing asking, I also know its impossible for you to realistically point all his flaws out to him as you would most likely get the sack. Keep asking us questions and when you do your own work do it right!

I do 250v IR on lighting as im worried about blowing every lamp!! And with modern tech of downlighters theres just too many lamps to remove.

Cheers for that. I am in a bit of a jam as you say. It's experience, but as I say I want the right kind of experience. The guy I work for has been doing it 20 yrs and to be fair I have seen him do good jobs as well as ones where I think, "this feels a bit shoddy ". Is a 250 v IR test fullproof as in it won't take anything out - ie phones, computers. I guess nominal voltage is 240 + or - 6 volts so I'm guessing it's sound ?

 

[Kate]

I wouldnt like to give a definitive on that. But in all my years nothing has broke when ive done it!

 

[telectrix]

if you short L to N and the IR test to E, you'll not harm any equipment ( hopefully).

 

[shanky887614]

nonminal voltage isnt usually 240 ive seen as low as 220 and high of 255 before.

new subs are supposed to be 230 but i doubt they will be

 

[Guest55]

But in all my years nothing has broke when ive done it!

you still need more practice then , the very best sparks will have trashed 000's of pounds worth of gear by the time they've reached the peak of their careers.

:-D

 

[Octopus]

Love to see the cert he filled out!

 

[44ALLAN]

you still need more practice then , the very best sparks will have trashed 000's of pounds worth of gear by the time they've reached the peak of their careers.

:-D

And the clever ones blame somebody else :smug2::wink_smile:

 

[Kate]

Done enough while pat testing!! Im sure I will though! Im only 26 got 40 odd years yet lol

 

[plugsandsparks]

To the OP, definetely not one to emulate, skipping IR is bad enough, but not doing the functional checks to make sure everything works is not something i would want my name anywhere near.
TBH - until now i had not heard of Cus being changed without access to circuits, there appears to be no depths to poor workmanship

 

[Guest55]

a calamity of mine that sticks in the mind..........

chasing out cable run in a kitchen , hammer flies out of hand and smashes through halogen hob
it was the only thing in the house worth more than £20.
some days its not worth even getting out of bed.

as for testing , i've sent plenty of electronic dimmers to an early grave

:-D

 

[Darkwood]

Your boss is an idiot as above their are other steps you can take, a damaged cable could be a fire hazard long before it trips an rcd.... remember the pvc is usually rated to 70c and can maintain much higher temps for a short duration which as ive just said could be a fire hazard if not health hazard from fumes.

Get your boss to read this thread he might learn something about electrics.... plus the insurance will be void if these tests are found to have been faked or skipped....
Landlords will have spare keys they have the right to gain access through arrangement for the purposes of repairs, testing etc ive done this for yrs and only time access was an issue is lost keys or tenant in bed leaving key in door but only a small delay.
Can't believe the guidance you are been given on your leaning curve into this career by your boss.... tell him MacDonalds are hiring :rolleyes2:

 

[Bazabacon]

Thanks for the feedback guys. I have my level 3 and what I learned on this and pure "instinct" told me that some of the stuff we've been doing is cutting corners. My boss isn't a very easy guy to get along with, so it's difficult to navigate around this without him spitting the dummy. My instincts and your replies are telling me to get away from him. Easier said than done in the current climate, and I would still want a reference from him. Decisions, decisions

 

[plugsandsparks]

Understand, though no matter what you have seen done, never forget what "should" be done.
Oh and don't sign any cert that you are not happy with