Discuss Is this thing in my fusebox labelled RCD actually an RCD ? in the DIY Electrical Advice area at ElectriciansForums.net

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fourtytwo

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I have my suspicions it is not as it has neither a trip current rating nor test button, please see picture
Is this thing in my fusebox labelled RCD actually an RCD ? P1170442.JPG - EletriciansForums.net
 
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Can you show the whole consumer unit.
 
Thanks for the replies gents, here is the whole board....... 1 ring for a 3 bed house and that's in black butyl 7/.029 at the board that disappears into the plaster behind BUT every socket I have inspected so far is 2.5mm red/black.

Certificate.....NO and I think it was done by an amateur botcher from what I have seen so far (moved in 3 weeks ago).
Is this thing in my fusebox labelled RCD actually an RCD ? P1170444.JPG - EletriciansForums.net
 
It is possible there was never an rcd there even though the cover indicates there was or there was an rcd but it was replaced by an isolator due to nuisance tripping. The fact the main switch is a compatible part makes me think it was always there but anything is possible.
 
It is possible there was never an rcd there even though the cover indicates there was or there was an rcd but it was replaced by an isolator due to nuisance tripping. The fact the main switch is a compatible part makes me think it was always there but anything is possible.
OK well given the interesting wiring particularly that outside I should think nuisance tripping would have been a problem, I am only amazed the previous incumbents escaped killing themselves! Do you happen to know if an RCD is still available for this board or is it to old ?
 
OK well given the interesting wiring particularly that outside I should think nuisance tripping would have been a problem, I am only amazed the previous incumbents escaped killing themselves! Do you happen to know if an RCD is still available for this board or is it to old ?
It would be second hand, it is obsolete.
 
It would be second hand, it is obsolete.
Would it be to much to ask an electrician to do the job or are they likely to run a mile, the internals looked like this when I arrived.......
Is this thing in my fusebox labelled RCD actually an RCD ? P1170365.JPG - EletriciansForums.net
I have tidied it slightly by removing a double socket fed by some 6A flex you can see attached to the 32A ring MCB & put both lighting feeds on the same 6A MCB for fire safety (vs one was on a 16A MCB, still not good but marginally better!
 
Looking at that your property is long overdue a rewire.
Absolutely agree BUTTTTT it also needs new plumbing, new structures to replace jerry built stuff etc etc, so for the time being it's a case of limping along as best we can. I thought at least if we had an RCD it might help prevent a serious outcome from some dodgy wiring some-place I cannot access like under the floors. Unfortunately it seems this property has been in the same family a very long time and basically they did no maintenance of anything, but added extensions to this & that using there own resources. The problem is ideas like extending EPC to include part P for example won't work as inspectors can be fooled or turn a blind eye as happened with the EPC report for this house so TBH I don't know what the answer is to protect purchasers from this kind of abuse.

Anyway on my hobby horse..... thank you all for your help

PS if you think the wiring is bad, try the plumbing and the collapsing brickwork..... the list is long
 
Would it be to much to ask an electrician to do the job or are they likely to run a mile, the internals looked like this when I arrived.......
View attachment 99368
I have tidied it slightly by removing a double socket fed by some 6A flex you can see attached to the 32A ring MCB & put both lighting feeds on the same 6A MCB for fire safety (vs one was on a 16A MCB, still not good but marginally better!
A good electrician will certainly look at it and tell you what is needed. But I doubt they will just swap the main switch for an RCD, given the regulations in place now.

Are you on an earth rod, do you know? If so, then originally an RCD main switch would have been essential to ensure that things tripped within a safe time limit.

It's possible that the main earth has since been updated, in which case the main RCD was not needed, but removing it without protecting at least the sockets was likely not acceptable even if done some time ago.

Some of those cables look like VIR rubber cabling, which is from the 50s and tends to fall apart very easily with age., especially at junction boxes/sockets/switches etc.

They can sometimes be currently serviceable, but are well overdue replacement and beyond service life so it may be more sensible to consider rewire options at this point.

It's also possible that some of it has been rewired and that only part of the leg back to the consumer unit is in the original stuff.

An EICR (Electrical Installation Condition Report) may be worth doing, but get one from an electrician who understands the context and will do a proper inspection, not a cheap one from a company who target landlords, as they will almost certainly not do a thorough job and just quote for a rewire anyway...
 
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A good electrician will certainly look at it and tell you what is needed. But I doubt they will just swap the main switch for an RCD, given the regulations in place now.

Are you on an earth rod, do you know? If so, then originally an RCD main switch would have been essential to ensure that things tripped within a safe time limit.

It's possible that the main earth has since been updated, in which case the main RCD was not needed, but removing it without protecting at least the sockets was likely not acceptable even if done some time ago.

Some of those cables look like VIR rubber cabling, which is from the 50s and tends to fall apart very easily with age., especially at junction boxes/sockets/switches etc.

They can sometimes be currently serviceable, but are well overdue replacement and beyond service life so it may be more sensible to consider rewire options at this point.

It's also possible that some of it has been rewired and that only part of the leg back to the consumer unit is in the original stuff.

An EICR (Electrical Installation Condition Report) may be worth doing, but get one from an electrician who understands the context and will do a proper inspection, not a cheap one from a company who target landlords, as they will almost certainly not do a thorough job and just quote for a rewire anyway...
Earthing is interesting, where I used to live it was overhead supply hence with RCD but here it's underground cable with a lead sheath connected to the CU, also to the gas pipe but on the consumer side of a smart meter and also to a water pipe that is hopefully connected to the rising main that is probably plastic of some kind, the water company is yet to find it so we don't know, the house end being invisible/buried! There doesn't seem to be an earth rod.

Thank you for reminding me it's called VIR, I saw some in the loft too for the upstairs lighting, yet to investigate any light switches but yes I agree the less disturbance the better though I would like to know if there is still some insulation in there....

Yes I had the feeling an electrician would correctly insist a lot more needed doing before they would be prepared to work on the property.

Many thanks
 
Earthing is interesting, where I used to live it was overhead supply hence with RCD but here it's underground cable with a lead sheath connected to the CU, also to the gas pipe but on the consumer side of a smart meter and also to a water pipe that is hopefully connected to the rising main that is probably plastic of some kind, the water company is yet to find it so we don't know, the house end being invisible/buried! There doesn't seem to be an earth rod.

Thank you for reminding me it's called VIR, I saw some in the loft too for the upstairs lighting, yet to investigate any light switches but yes I agree the less disturbance the better though I would like to know if there is still some insulation in there....

Yes I had the feeling an electrician would correctly insist a lot more needed doing before they would be prepared to work on the property.

Many thanks
No surprise really, but a smart meter should likely not have been connected to that without at least some comment being made on things...

It sounds like you may well have TN-S earthing, from the sheath of the incoming cable to the CU, which is good as it means an RCD may not be needed to ensure things trip in time - just for additional protection.

There are not many circuits, so a replacement RCBO consumer unit (where each circuit is individually protected) needn't be that expensive.

But no point adding them unless there are tests to ensure that the thing won't trip constantly....

It may be that testing shows that things are still OK and the consumer unit could be changed now - with a rewire in the future as funds permit - or even only a partial rewire - since there are new cables on the right hand breakers, which are if you haven't already realised the wrong make and should not be mixed into that fusebox.

The new circuits (brown/blue) will have been done after Part P and should have been notified, though it's quite likely they weren't...

You can check online at NICEIC Online Certification - http://checkmynotification.com (only covers NICEIC) or sometimes your local planning portal website has the same information.

If they weren't and the seller didn't declare any such work as I believe is required now, there may be some comeback.

If they were done, then a certificate should have been done and there may be some claim against the Part P scheme/installer.
 
This is the same house as the other thread?

Pictures on the other thread show an SWA running from the meter box, but this mainswitch is fed from normal tails.
Is there Henley blocks before the consumer unit? Or a service isolator or possibly an up-front RCD?
 
No surprise really, but a smart meter should likely not have been connected to that without at least some comment being made on things...

It sounds like you may well have TN-S earthing, from the sheath of the incoming cable to the CU, which is good as it means an RCD may not be needed to ensure things trip in time - just for additional protection.

There are not many circuits, so a replacement RCBO consumer unit (where each circuit is individually protected) needn't be that expensive.

But no point adding them unless there are tests to ensure that the thing won't trip constantly....

It may be that testing shows that things are still OK and the consumer unit could be changed now - with a rewire in the future as funds permit - or even only a partial rewire - since there are new cables on the right hand breakers, which are if you haven't already realised the wrong make and should not be mixed into that fusebox.

The new circuits (brown/blue) will have been done after Part P and should have been notified, though it's quite likely they weren't...

You can check online at NICEIC Online Certification - http://checkmynotification.com (only covers NICEIC) or sometimes your local planning portal website has the same information.

If they weren't and the seller didn't declare any such work as I believe is required now, there may be some comeback.

If they were done, then a certificate should have been done and there may be some claim against the Part P scheme/installer.
Thanks for the link, no surprise nothing found!
Wrong make I assume you mean wrong colours ?
I was unaware they were not allowed to be mixed, in that case how could one do a partial re-wire ?
 
This is the same house as the other thread?

Pictures on the other thread show an SWA running from the meter box, but this mainswitch is fed from normal tails.
Is there Henley blocks before the consumer unit? Or a service isolator or possibly an up-front RCD?
Other thread ? I have one for dodgy sockets & one for outdoor cable unprotected
There are no Henley blocks or service isolator or up-front RCD, just a normal underground cable, fuse block & smart meter (Ugghhhhh) then tails to the CU, I will try get a pic
Is this thing in my fusebox labelled RCD actually an RCD ? P1170448.JPG - EletriciansForums.net
 

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