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Discuss LABC Notification Responsibility in the Industrial Electrician Talk area at ElectriciansForums.net

M

mdavismccoy

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Hi, all ways read the forum, lots of very good advice. Just getting ready to start-up alone.

One of the questions that I would like help with is:

Who is responsible for LABC notification of electrical work to be carried out? There is nothing in black and white to pin-point this.

We know what is notifiable and what is not.

We know what experience and qualifications we need.

We know that a competent persons scheme pass notification to LABC.

We know that the person ordering the work recieves the EIC and associated shedules for work carried out.

Help would be appreciated.
 
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Des 56

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Arms
Esteemed
The Homeowner is responsible
The government advise I believe is
It may be that the electrician carrying out the work will take on this responsibility
 
M

mdavismccoy

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  • #3
Thanks Des 56,

I though it would be the person ordering the work, i.e. the home owner for the work they require. I didn't want to answer my own question in the same query with who I thought is responsible. Can you advise where you got the answer.
 

Des 56

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Arms
Esteemed
mdavismccoy
Sorry so long I am having difficulty posting a reply I keep getting logged out of the site
The owner is responsible for notification
He may contract a person registered on the competent person list to do the work in which case the competent person will notify instead of the owner
He may do it himself or employ an unregistered spark in which case he must notify
The responsibility for compliance with the building regs (without trawling the Gov site is explained briefly in the electricians guide to the building regs page 13 )
The owner is likely to be served with an enforcement notice if there is non compliance
 
M

mdavismccoy

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #5
Thanks for that Des,

I am happy with that, because what I'll be doing is, when carring out work for customers (non yet), I will issue all relevent certificates for the installation, no competent persons scheme certificates. I will be going part time self-employed, house husband responsibilities, childrens chauffer, at present, I'm getting all parts together.

Also I have booked the H&S ECS safety exam, so that I can renew my JIB card and UK Register of Electricians card, for the new ECS card. I will be trying to put my fingers in a lot of different pies. Another thing, I will see if any of the local self-employed require short term help, a day or so where required. Another thing would be to contact some of the local manufacturing companies and see if they require sick or holiday maintenance cover.
 
S

Shakey

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #6
Sorry I disagree

I teach THE EAL DEI course and have always taught that the person carrying out the work who is responsible, although the owner may be served with an enforcement notice in additon to the person carrying out the work

I refer to the Approved Document to Part P, the Electrical Installers Guide to the Building Regs (NICEIC /ECA) and the the Electricians Guide to the Building Regs (The IEE). There are a number of statements in these documents that both positively confirm (and strongly suggest) that the person carrying out the work has the responsibility for notification - how would the housholder be expected to know:

what Part P is about?
What the notification process involves?
what certification is required to comply?
The difference between non-notifiable and nitfiable work

etc etc
 
M

mdavismccoy

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #7
Hi Shakey,

I agree with your arguments against," a number of statements in the documents positively confirm (and strongly advise)" no definite confirmation there. The owner "may be served with an enforcement notice" no definite there.

what Part P is about?
What the notification process involves?
what certification is required to comply?
The difference between non-notifiable and nitfiable work.

If people are requesting work done, they would have some information for the requirements of the above.

If a person buys a car, how do they know they need a valid MOT, a valid insurance, a valid driving licience, a valid tax disc. They find out mainly by word of mouth.

The approved document P, does not state who is responsible for notification. Page 7, notification of work does not state who. It does how ever mention the person ordering the work a few times. These approved documents are supposed to cover all the bases, where they don't they call them loop holes.
 
S

Shakey

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #8
Hi Shakey,

I agree with your arguments against," a number of statements in the documents positively confirm (and strongly advise)" no definite confirmation there. The owner "may be served with an enforcement notice" no definite there.

what Part P is about?
What the notification process involves?
what certification is required to comply?
The difference between non-notifiable and nitfiable work.

If people are requesting work done, they would have some information for the requirements of the above.

If a person buys a car, how do they know they need a valid MOT, a valid insurance, a valid driving licience, a valid tax disc. They find out mainly by word of mouth.

The approved document P, does not state who is responsible for notification. Page 7, notification of work does not state who. It does how ever mention the person ordering the work a few times. These approved documents are supposed to cover all the bases, where they don't they call them loop holes.
Hi, yeah i agree that the approved document can be vague but the other two documents actually state that it is the person carrying out the work who has the notifiaction responsibility, in the same way that the person carrying out the work is absolved of this responsibility (to the LABC anyway) when they join the competent persons scheme

Dont quite agree with you car analogy

Whilst everyone that drives and ownes a car will have to go through each stage of the process within short space of time, or will learn by their ommissions from PC Plod, wheras you could own a property for 30 years and never require the services of an electrician, thus remaining blissfully ignorant of the Part P process. you could not rent a car without your driving licence but you could rent a house and never get involved with part P

which is why the responsibility to notify work (as with the responsibility to carry out that work i.a.w BS7671 and test and certify as such) rests firmly with the competent tradesman who is expected to know - i.e the person carrying out the work.
 

Des 56

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Arms
Esteemed
Your Responsibilities

This is a couple of lines from the gov site about who has the responsibility for notification



With all building work, the owner of the property (or land) in question is ultimately responsible for complying with the relevant planning rules and building regulations (regardless of the need to apply for planning permisison and/or building regulations approval or not).
Therefore, failure to comply with the relevant rules will result in the owner being liable for any remedial action (which could go as far as demolition and/or restoration)
 
M

mdavismccoy

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #10
Hi Des, thanks for that, I,ve been to the site. That basically covers domestic installations, which give the responsability to the property owner. Very interesting reading.

The customer requiring work to be carried out can either employ a company registered with a competent persons scheme, in the quote is an amount of money covering the companies registration.

Or competent Joe Bloggs with all the correct qualifications and experience, lower over heads, lower quote, LABC notification fee (don't know any fees, or LABC personell).

Depends on price for the customer.

Some LABC's only seem to know the NIC, no mention of the other four scheme providers. Why didn't the LABC just have a register of electricians in their area, for a nominal fee, then may be the electricians may register in a few LA's.
 
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