Light switch issue

[Sean2293]

I’m hoping I can get some help on here as I’m at a loss as to what to do.



My mother is disabled and currently shielding so it’s very difficult to get an electrician to come out. her toilet light switch fell off the ceiling and fell to bits (god knows how)



She needs light to access her toilet as it’s a risk that she falls at night



I bought a replacement switch click and collect from screwfix and connected it up to the existing wires (blue, brown, and earth) blue in the com and brown in the l1 and the lights just stay on.



I rotated the blue and brown so that blue was in l1 and brown in com and I got the same result.



I disconnected the switch entirely and the lights come on without a switch connected at all.



The lights are fairly newly installed led down lights done around 8 months ago. The switch wires definitely worked less than 2 days ago.



I have tried two brand new switches from screwfix and got the same result with both.



Can anyone advise what I can do to resolve this?



Appreciate anything you can tell me



Thanks

 

[tony clark]

a photo if the wires at the switch might help

 

[westward10]

Sounds odd, just two wires at a switch ignoring the earth should be straight forward as you have done. Are you 100% sure no other works have been undertaken.

 

[Sean2293]

Yeah I’m sure definitely no other works. I paid for the entire bathroom to be redone and disabled access. I oversaw all the works myself and only other person in the house couldn’t reach the ceiling to do any works to the fitting if she tried.
An electrician installed all the lights

here’s a photo.
[automerge]1586901393[/automerge]
The l2 piece hasn’t melted or anything just thought I’d mention it as a friend thought the switch had been fried when I showed pic After trying everything else I could think of I poked it with a screwdriver as it was blanked off. I was improvising at this point but it didn’t have the connector inside it anyway.

 

[westward10]

If you have it connected Com and L1 then something else is wrong and this issue must have already been there. Judging by the earth connection at the other pull switch someone did not know what they were doing.

 

[tony clark]

If you have it connected Com and L1 then something else is wrong and this issue must have already been there.

agree with you problem must already there

 

[Sean2293]

The switch has been working fine for 8 months? How can that be then?
[automerge]1586901867[/automerge]
The electrician was provided by the company that did the entire bathroom. Certificates provided... can only do so much as a homeowner to vet a so called “professional” unfortunately
[automerge]1586901896[/automerge]
My main concern is how can I get this working again as soon as possible to ensure she has a working light

 

[westward10]

The switch has been working fine for 8 months? How can that be then?
[automerge]1586901867[/automerge]
The electrician was provided by the company that did the entire bathroom. Certificates provided... can only do so much as a homeowner to vet a so called “professional” unfortunately
[automerge]1586901896[/automerge]
My main concern is how can I get this working again as soon as possible to ensure she has a working light

No idea but as I say if you have connected Com and L1 then it should function. For it to fall on the floor and break to pieces it must have been disconnected so there is more going on here than meets the eye. Why is the other switch not fitted to its back box.

 

[Sean2293]

No idea but as I say if you have connected Com and L1 then it should function. For it to fall on the floor and break to pieces it must have been disconnected so there is more going on here than meets the eye. Why is the other switch not fitted to its back box.

For some weird reason the reply box isn’t showing up so I can’t reply. After logging in and out several times and refreshing it just showed up now but will probably disappear again



In response to the above





The other switch is disconnected as I removed it to look at wires for reference





The switch fell to pieces when I started unscrewing the cables as I needed to replace the entire thing as the holes in the ceiling were too big for the fitting
[automerge]1586904202[/automerge]
She doesn’t remember doing it (early onset dementia) but I suspect she yanked the cord too hard and the cowboys didn’t screw the fitting into the ceiling properly so it pulled the screws right out of the plasterboard

 

[Strima]

You may well have to call an electrician in to do some proper testing. When the switch was pulled out of the ceiling there may have been some unseen damaged caused.
Can you access the cables from above?

Was the switch only screwed into the plasterboard and not into a joist? If that is the case there’s a chance you can claim warranty work off the original installer. However without seeing the installation first hand this could be purely speculation.

 

[Sean2293]

You may well have to call an electrician in to do some proper testing. When the switch was pulled out of the ceiling there may have been some unseen damaged caused.
Can you access the cables from above?

Was the switch only screwed into the plasterboard and not into a joist? If that is the case there’s a chance you can claim warranty work off the original installer. However without seeing the installation first hand this could be purely speculation.

no I can’t access cables unfortunately.

it’s worse than not screwing to joist..
Pvc ceiling was installed and it looks like a screw was just screwed directly into the pvc and upon closer inspection they didn’t bother to fill in the holes in the plasterboard they made (assuming because they were hiding it with pvc) so when I drilled new holes through the pvc to screw the new socket in the drill went straight though like there was nothing behind the pvc..

They didn’t even use wall plugs though. I used some wall plugs and the fitting is secure now.

I paid via finance so I’m covered but my concern is getting someone out from the company was difficult for visual issues we noticed.. getting someone out now during a pandemic is probably next to impossible.

 

[telectrix]

as a stop gap can you get hold of a battery light. one where you just press it to come on?

 

[Strima]

no I can’t access cables unfortunately.

it’s worse than not screwing to joist..
Pvc ceiling was installed and it looks like a screw was just screwed directly into the pvc and upon closer inspection they didn’t bother to fill in the holes in the plasterboard they made (assuming because they were hiding it with pvc) so when I drilled new holes through the pvc to screw the new socket in the drill went straight though like there was nothing behind the pvc..

They didn’t even use wall plugs though. I used some wall plugs and the fitting is secure now.

I paid via finance so I’m covered but my concern is getting someone out from the company was difficult for visual issues we noticed.. getting someone out now during a pandemic is probably next to impossible.

TBH Rawl plugs won't last long either, ideally you need to either find something substantial to screw into, such as a joist, or fit a piece of timber above to screw into.

Did you receive any electrical certification for the work completed? Should be either an installation certificate or minor works certificate?

Do the contractors/electrician have any scheme accreditation such as NICEIC/NAPT/ELECSA? Might be worth a Google search if you know their company name.

This sounds like a poor installation that needs warranty work completing.

If you can't get any joy through the original contractor someone on the forum might be able to assist. Although there's a pandemic on things can be put into place for safe guarding and reducing the risk of disease transmission. You need to assess the risks between contracting COVID-19 and risk of injury due to falling.

 

[ruston]

If your mother is a vulnerable person your local council may be able to help in this instance. Failing that you could also try Social Services.

 

[snowhead]

As the light is on with or without a switch put the blue and brown wires into one terminal of the switch, fix it up best as you can and tie the cord up so it can't be pulled.
The light will always be on but that's better than not on.

 

[Sean2293]

As the light is on with or without a switch put the blue and brown wires into one terminal of the switch, fix it up best as you can and tie the cord up so it can't be pulled.
The light will always be on but that's better than not on.

yeah that’s exactly what I’ve done for now it’s all I could do.

I couldn’t put a piece of timber behind the fitting as the pvc ceiling panels are all sealed in place with edging trim.
I’d be afraid I cause any snapped panels and warranty wouldn’t cover anything I break.

i think she did get a certificate in the post a week or so after the work. I’d have to check when I’m next there but won’t be there for a while as I’m trying to limit amount of time I go.

i don’t have a clue who the electrician was that did it as I used a large kitchen and bathroom company that hired their own subcontractors as part of my contract with them.

but due to the size of the business I would have thought they were good but we had absolutely nothing but problems with many many things we could physically see wrong... this is stuff that’s hidden behind.. god knows what else I may find in the future

 

[ipf]

Is the other pull switch fixed securely and what is it for? (shower or fan?) It seems a bit strange, earth wise and a 32amp double pole switch wired in 3 core cable (grey sleeved blue). I'm wondering if the light switch has been badly installed by someone else (no brown sleeving).

 

[westward10]

I think it is a fan pull switch but most of those have earth terminals.

 

[Sean2293]

Is the other pull switch fixed securely and what is it for? (shower or fan?) It seems a bit strange, earth wise and a 32amp double pole switch wired in 3 core cable (grey sleeved blue). I'm wondering if the light switch has been badly installed by someone else (no brown sleeving).

the other switch is for an extractor fan.

no clue why the earth wire is like that it was like that when I opened it up. Which confused me more. It also had a supply side and a load side which is completely different to the light switch so it didn’t help me solve anything.

that switch seems more secure maybe it’s in-line with a stud but I don’t want to unscrew it to find out incase it loosens it more.
[automerge]1586970164[/automerge]

I think it is a fan pull switch but most of those have earth terminals.

I’m not there presently but I seem to think it may have two cables twisted together and rammed into that wago. Maybe it’s earthed somehow like that but can’t remember for sure
[automerge]1586970339[/automerge]
Yesterday I got a really bad electric shock off it though and I swear to god I only touched the earth cable. That’s when I gave up and just put it out of the way safe and stuck it up high out of the way

 

[ipf]

the other switch is for an extractor fan.


Yesterday I got a really bad electric shock off it though and I swear to god I only touched the earth cable. That’s when I gave up and just put it out of the way safe and stuck it up high out of the way

With supply isolated?????