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For many years the market for fire rated downlights has been highly confusing with many manufacturers making claims but not always having the technical data to back up these claims.
The NHBC has just launched new guidance to cover the use of fire rated downlights which makes it very clear that only correctly tested products can be used in the type of floor construction in which they are being fitted.
Specific reference is made to the type of joists being used as light weight joists are now the norm for many types of construction and these need different tests to the old solid timber joists.
http://www.nhbc.co.uk/Builders/Prod...uidanceDocuments/64/filedownload,84608,en.pdf

Take care to make sure what you are fitting is correctly tested.
 

Midwest

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I always fitted fire rated down lights whatever, although some on here suggest its not necessary in single fire zones, i.e. a domestic dwelling.

Or are you talking of the specific type testing of a 'fire rated' luminaire?
 
O

Octopus

Surely NHBC guides are for new builds only .........
 
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  • #4
I always fitted fire rated down lights whatever, although some on here suggest its not necessary in single fire zones, i.e. a domestic dwelling.

Or are you talking of the specific type testing of a 'fire rated' luminaire?
The new guidance refers to "intermediate floors" above and below 5M and refers specifically to recessed fittings.
 
O

Octopus

Strange how there is no restrictions on the use of plastic vent grilles and pipe
And that we are still allowed open stair cases in homes ....
 

Leesparkykent

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And that we are still allowed open stair cases in homes ....
I’m not 100 percent certain why but on a new build I’ve recently done the choices were to encase the stair case so it had a doorway or put a sprinkler system in on the staircase. They opted for the sprinkler system and kept it all open. There were 3 floors in total. From what I believe a 1st floor widow can be used as a fire escape but anything above 1st floor a window can’t be classed as a fire escape so if you have a loft conversion done or build convert a house that has more than ground and 1st floor then the stairs is the sole means of escape so the immediate rooms that are accessed from the sole means of escape have to be fire doors.
 
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Strange how there is no restrictions on the use of plastic vent grilles and pipe
Totally agree, however I have recently been involved in fire tests (using metal web joists)which involved other types of ceiling penetration such as fans and air valves and would assume that the same will happen to them as it has to the recessed lights, same applies to soil pipes which run vertically through floors.
 
They are protected or unprotected stairwells :D
 

Welchyboy1

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Unless a very specific circumstance, there should be no real reason why anybody is using non-fire rated fittings nowadays surely

I thought the days of the nasty 12v open backed halogens were well and truly over with
 

telectrix

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I don't know but I've been told...………...its about premature collapse of structural lumber.
you mean that new builds have undersized joists, spaced to far apart, construction done as cheaply as possible to barely meet safety standards? well, i'll go to our (solidly built) stairs. :D:D:D:D.
 
Unless a very specific circumstance, there should be no real reason why anybody is using non-fire rated fittings nowadays surely

I thought the days of the nasty 12v open backed halogens were well and truly over with
Agree with this guy. Nowadays they're virtually the same cost anyway.
 

PEG

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I wouldn't waste any time worrying about the NHBC....they are are a ridiculous and worthless entity,with no power or interest,in the things you would consider that they should be concerned with.

.....They do a thriving trade in stickers,though...
 

Midwest

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you mean that new builds have undersized joists, spaced to far apart, construction done as cheaply as possible to barely meet safety standards? well, i'll go to our (solidly built) stairs. :D:D:D:D.
My parents house was built in 1898. Bet its stairs were built better than your stairs. ;)
 

Welchyboy1

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Ive just moved into our house built in 1927

The loft joists are roughly 8x3's and 15inch apart

Doesnt even require new timbers for the loft conversion!

Dont build them like they used to!
 
O

Octopus

NHBC rules .............. ha ha ha

About as useful as a chocolate fireguard.

They need to spend more time holding builders to account for constructing mikey mouse houses full of faults
 

Midwest

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Ive just moved into our house built in 1927

The loft joists are roughly 8x3's and 15inch apart

Doesnt even require new timbers for the loft conversion!

Dont build them like they used to!
When they ask you not to print off an email to save on trees, I can see why they don’t. :)
 

richy3333

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NHBC rules .............. ha ha ha

About as useful as a chocolate fireguard.

They need to spend more time holding builders to account for constructing mikey mouse houses full of faults
Just dont put those non fire rated recessed lights anywhere near that chocolate fire guard :)
 
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I don't know but I've been told...………...its about premature collapse of structural lumber.
Hi Midwest
You are spot on, as in many areas of construction, regulation has not kept pace with changing practices on-site (sometimes leading to disaster). It has been found that modern "light weight joists" are much more fragile than solid timber joists in a fire situation leading to premature collapse. This is not only dangerous for occupants but also fire fighters who have to enter a burning building and can have floors collapsing both under them and on top of them if not correctly protected against against fire entering the floor cavity, the performance of recessed light protection for light weight joists thus needs to be much better than previous solid joists.
 

pirate

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For me, the idea of a first floor widow being a means of escape is perfect...for that reason...I'm in!
 

PEG

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One memorable example of the NHBC out performing their remit....

New build,all contractors in the club....at finish,client had storage cupboard doors,which stopped main access doors from opening,no metering of services (yeah,handy or what....) and a bio-filter system which covered the garden in sewerage and blew the electrics :rolleyes:

Their comment,on finally getting through the half a dozen desk Sally's,was "....none of that is anything to do with us..."

....I think they must spend a lot of time,supervising the fitting of teats to a boar,photographing it,and using it as a mirror...
 
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