Discuss Plant Room Socket Outlets in the Periodic Inspection Reporting & Certification area at ElectriciansForums.net

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DjamW71

Good afternoon, first time post so be gentle please, I work for an organisation looking after different types of buildings, I have recently commissioned a condition report for a district heating plant room, the report has come back with 1# code 2 defect, details:

Circuit designation and details - Transformer Socket, Socket & Security Alarm. 2.5mm MICC clipped direct & protected by 20Amp BS3871-3MCB.

Code 2 Circuit Defect - No RCD protection to socket outlet in plant room CCT 6 - 2B

Test results are all fine, supplementary and main protective bonding is installed in line with current regulations and the overall installation is in good condition, maintained and reported on regularly. Its not really an issue to protect the socket with an RCD, even though the whole of the circuit is located within an area that can only be accessed by instructed persons there is an outside chance the outlet could be used to protect mobile equipment outside of the building and its equipotential zone however, I'm not sure I should be seeing a code 2 defect noted on the report.

Any thoughts?
 
I can see why the C2 has been applied in this case if outside appliances are easily utilised from the socket. Easily remedied though. Either a RCD socket outlet, or a documented risk assessment detailing the limited access to the socket and the training of the people who use it.
 
Cheers Andy, the socket could be used to supply equipment outside but it's very unlikely and there would be easier options. , I think you are on the same lines as myself regarding issue and solution. When asked the electrician completing the inspection to explain the departure he stated any socket should have RCD protection so I'm guessing he's more used to domestic than industrial installations, this gives me further cause to question competence and overall accuracy of the report given that the same guy has inspected 11 more heating plant rooms. Further investigation required on my part I think,
thanks!!!!
 
I can see why the C2 has been applied in this case if outside appliances are easily utilised from the socket. Easily remedied though. Either a RCD socket outlet, or a documented risk assessment detailing the limited access to the socket and the training of the people who use it.

Either that or ensure all appliances are fitted with an RCD type plug, although your option is the best fit RCD socket outlets
 
If the sockets were installed to a previous version of BS7671 which didn't require RCD protection then there's no obligation to upgrade to the latest edition.
It's a good idea, and a code 3 at worst, but IMO a change in the regs hasn't made it dangerous.
 
Cheers fellas, it's not an issue to provide the additional protection by means of installing an RCD but the 'reporting annomaly' has lead me to question the competance of the electrician and qualifying supervisor enough to scrutinse the report further, on doing so other problems have been noted such as inconsistencies in the schedules and some rather strange test results/conclusions, given the client isn't necessarily qualified to read test reports it's important that a reliable representation of the installation is provided through the test report, if it was a wonky socket outlet most clients would expect the issue to be rectified wouldn't they? Is it unreasonable to expect a test report with incorrect information to be redone?
 
Is it possible the testing bod whilst on site actually witnessed the socket being used for equipment outside? This happened to me last year that a random socket you would not have expected to be used outside had a long extension lead plugged into it to supply a power washer, why because the rcd socket next to the roller shutter for the power washer used to trip off!
 
Is it possible the testing bod whilst on site actually witnessed the socket being used for equipment outside? This happened to me last year that a random socket you would not have expected to be used outside had a long extension lead plugged into it to supply a power washer, why because the rcd socket next to the roller shutter for the power washer used to trip off!

just goes to show..... you can't beat stupid. if the OP's socket is labelled for dedicated use of aparticular item, then it's a no code for me.
 
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Hi westward, the socket is located at the back of the plant room, said plant room is only accessible by instructed persons and a permit to work is required before any job is begun (The F10 & PCI also covers use of mobile equipment) however the term 'reasonably practicable' is wide and broad ranging so someone using the socket isn't unimaginable.
The building is local authority owned and maintained therefore grass etc is cut by authority personnel & equipment. As I mentioned earlier this issue has had a positive outcome as scrutinisation of reports highlighted other problems resulting in a 'tool box' talk, I've also ammended the specification covering the work So that inspections to areas such as plant rooms has been covered as a s petard entity.
Thanks everyone for advise and general brain storm :)
 
This: it has also been decided that labels will be fixed adjacent to socket outlets stating restrictions to use.
Regards
 
Hi westward, the socket is located at the back of the plant room, said plant room is only accessible by instructed persons and a permit to work is required before any job is begun (The F10 & PCI also covers use of mobile equipment) however the term 'reasonably practicable' is wide and broad ranging so someone using the socket isn't unimaginable.
The building is local authority owned and maintained therefore grass etc is cut by authority personnel & equipment. As I mentioned earlier this issue has had a positive outcome as scrutinisation of reports highlighted other problems resulting in a 'tool box' talk, I've also ammended the specification covering the work So that inspections to areas such as plant rooms has been covered as a s petard entity.
Thanks everyone for advise and general brain storm :)

The definition of instructed person has been changed with the recent amendment, it was been abused as a get out clause so the reigns have been tightened.
 
First:
The circuit description mentions 'Transformer socket'.
What does this mean?
is this socket fed by a transformer and separated from Earth?
Or is it a socket intended to supply a transformer?

Second:
There is no longer a requirement to provide RCD protection to socket-outlets which may reasonable be expected to supply portable equipment outdoors.
This Regulation was removed in 2008, some 7 years ago.
I would question why the Inspector is conducting an Inspection to past Regulations.

Third:
As has already been pointed out, there is no requirement to upgrade an installation which complied with the Regulations in force at the time of it's design/construction.
As such at most this should only warrant a code C3.

Obviously, any report is no more than the Inspector's opinion, and there are many opinions.
However, the report should have a declaration declaring that it has been conducted to the current edition/ amendment of the Regulations. As such any defects, dangerous conditions or non-compliance should be referenced to the relevant (current) Regulation.
 
Transformer socket is almost certainly for a lead light and probably has an isolated output of 25V or 50V, common in many plant rooms in the 1960/70s.
 
No I think he was just describing the circuit and the transformer happened to be part of it along with an alarm, so he was only referring to the 13A socket.
 

Reply to Plant Room Socket Outlets in the Periodic Inspection Reporting & Certification area at ElectriciansForums.net

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