Smoke head in same room as DB

[Risteard]

The scenario is a fire alarm panel within several flats/houses fed from a landlord's DB. Apparently these qualify as HMOs despite being separate flats. The person who will be commissioning the fire alarm is adamant that a smoke head needs to be fitted in the same room as the DB in each flat.

I am not aware of any such requirement in spite of having done a fair amount of fire alarm installation over the years, and indeed having trawled through both BS 5839-1 and BS 5839-6 have found no reference to any such requirement. Unless this is a licencing requirement for HMOs?

Does anyone know where such a requirement is stipulated or is the fire alarm guy just talking total crap?

 

[Vortigern]

Well if he is designing it he no doubt would have done a fire risk assessment and I could well understand why a smoke would go with the DB as there is fuel oxygen and ignition source which you cannot mitigate by removing so it would on that basis seem a good reason to do so. Although having just recently scoured the both of the standards for other reasons, can't say I am aware of such a particular requirement explicitly stated, more implicitly due to the fire risk assessment in the first instance. Although it is unusual for just the commissioning agent to specify the design so a bit puzzling all in all.

 

[Risteard]

I completely agree that it's not a terrible idea if he wants it. It's just his claim that it's a requirement now which has been reiterated through two different people to me. The more he's insisting that it's required makes me more keen to point out that he's full of crap. I'm fairly confident that it is not stipulated within BS 5839 unless I'm being blind and/or stupid. I considered myself to have a reasonable grasp of BS 5839 and certainly I wasn't aware of any such requirement.

 

[westward10]

Without knowing the intended Category of system it is impossible to say. An L1 system would almost definitely require it.

 

[Risteard]

Without knowing the intended Category of system it is impossible to say. An L1 system would almost definitely require it.

Fair comment.

I'm not sure what category he's going for. Although one of the landlords took it that he needed it in the same room as a DB as a general requirement in all circumstances. I told him that a Grade D1 Category LD2 system for his premises I surveyed for an alarm would not get one specifically at that location.

 

[westward10]

Is it a Part 1 or Part 6 system.

 

[Risteard]

Is it a Part 1 or Part 6 system.

I'm assuming Part 1, although I haven't actually met or had any contact with the fire alarm guy. He is going to commission the system so I've just had indirect relays of a message that he wants heads at the DBs. I had initially said get him to install the alarm and I would just provide the supply to the keyswitched spurs but was told today that the fire alarm man only wants to commission it. If I'd had a chance to talk to him it might have helped clear things up rather than relayed messages which always leaves the risk of them being incorrectly relayed.

The Part 6 system I surveyed for the other landlord was at a different premises.

 

[westward10]

You need to know the Category of system. An LD2 or L2 system could be seen as requiring one in the room due to its possible high risk.

 

[Pete999]

The scenario is a fire alarm panel within several flats/houses fed from a landlord's DB. Apparently these qualify as HMOs despite being separate flats. The person who will be commissioning the fire alarm is adamant that a smoke head needs to be fitted in the same room as the DB in each flat.

I am not aware of any such requirement in spite of having done a fair amount of fire alarm installation over the years, and indeed having trawled through both BS 5839-1 and BS 5839-6 have found no reference to any such requirement. Unless this is a licencing requirement for HMOs?

Does anyone know where such a requirement is stipulated or is the fire alarm guy just talking total crap?

Don't know of anny regulations, but it would be logical to include a detector in a room which houses the electrical distribution board, what say everybody?

 

[westward10]

Don't know of anny regulations, but it would be logical to include a detector in a room which houses the electrical distribution board, what say everybody?

There are Category of systems which dictate the extent of coverage.

 

[Vortigern]

The thing is, Fire Risk Assessment then design, who is responsible for the design, who specified the category. It is quite common for independent commissioning but that is last in line. The commissioning agent should be able to tell you the cat. and who designed/specified it. Usually the owner/designer. Mind you it is not common that LLs will go for the highest level system due to cost.