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GBDamo

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After the YY burnout posted in;-



I intend to rewire and have given a rough quote.

Background.

These lights are head height wall mounted intended to illuminate the engine bay of a car, 10 workstations in a large workshop.

At present they are through wired through each other so, if the cable goes in one they all go upstream.

The reasoning behind my intention is that should one fitting go then the a fuse will blow highlighting the damaged fitting and allow continuity of works with the other lights.

Also allows for the damaged light to be worked on without isolating the circuit (FCU option).

Intention

Is to re-wire in galv conduit in 2.5 singles running the whole circuit off a c25 MCB.

And

1, give each fitting it's own FCU fused to 3A

or (see Questions)

2, Fit a 5x20mm fuse holder to an IP65 JB and use a quick blow fuse.

Then flex down to each fitting from the FCU/JB.

The customer is keen on this approach if it is reasonably feasable.

Questions

1, I can't find a source I trust for a 3A BS1362 curve, BBB don't have it so can't be sure the BS1362 will go before the MCB, any pointers?

If the above is a non starter;-

2, Does anyone see an issue with the approach of fitting fuse holder to a JB and 5A F rated fuse, this route also allows me to down rate the circuit CSA and MCB and ?
 
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ipf

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I'm not really with you there.
I wouldn't think they're wired in series, though.

edit. Just install led's fed from a 6amp mcb. If one's faulty, why would it affect the rest, unless it's a wiring fault or fitting short?
 
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GBDamo

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  • #3
I'm not really with you there.
I wouldn't think they're wired in series, though.
Yes bad choice of word, not electrical series, will edit to clarify.
 

telectrix

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think they are in parallel, but if 1 goes tits up ( fried ballast is fav.) it takes out the MCB for all.
 
They will be wired 'daisy chain' fashion not in series but an earth leakage fault could still take the lot out (if protected by a RCD!)
Sounds like quite an expensive job!
 
T

The Ghost

Don't the fittings already have a fuse in them they usually do.
 
I think you are over engineering this. Would make more sense maybe to have two circuits across alternate fittings. Why a 25A, type C.
 
T

The Ghost

Anyway I wouldn't have them on a 25a mcb
 

GBDamo

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The few I've see seem to be on the PL in emergency fittings.

These are not internally fused.
 

GBDamo

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I think you are over engineering this. Would make more sense maybe to have two circuits across alternate fittings. Why a 25A, type C.
Looking to make sure the BS1362 blow first, VD means the singles will be 2.5mm.
 

ipf

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They will be wired 'daisy chain' fashion not in series but an earth leakage fault could still take the lot out (if protected by a RCD!)
Sounds like quite an expensive job!
Why expensive? Just replace the fittings and feed from plug in roses so that you can isolate any faulty ones.
 

GBDamo

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And as has been suggested go for LED's , they will pay for themselves in no time .
They still need a circuit running in as the YY is fried, due to the environment it needs to be in galv.

Adding tend LED non corrosives to the bill would be a no go.
 

ipf

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They still need a circuit running in as the YY is fried, due to the environment it needs to be in galv.

Adding tend LED non corrosives to the bill would be a no go.
What fittings are you planning for....and how long a conduit run?
 

GBDamo

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What fittings are you planning for....and how long a conduit run?
The fittings are already in place, they are twin 70W fluoros, conduit run is about 40M
 

ipf

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Galv conduit to individual metal clad S/FCU's to each fitting !

Lamps could be changed to LED, and do away with the ballast (heat) !
6ft led replacement lamps are total carp...….unless they've improved 10 fold in the last couple of years.
You could look at swa or hi tuff, if appropriate, terminated in conduit boxes with plug in roses.
Still don't get this fcu business.
 

GBDamo

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Galv conduit to individual metal clad S/FCU's to each fitting !

Lamps could be changed to LED, and do away with the ballast (heat) !
The wiring is fried.

The current installation needs replacing.

The correct method for the environment is galv.

Doing anything to the fittings at the moment is just cost with no immediate necessity.

If it WAS done as you suggest then we wouldn't be having this chat.:)

(other than the SY)
 

davesparks

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I don't quite see the point here, any and every lighting circuit has the same potential for a fault at one fitting to take out the whole circuit, what's so special in this particular case?
If there is a danger from the loss of the lighting circuit then a correctly designed emergency lighting system is needed.
 

GBDamo

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6ft led replacement lamps are total carp...….unless they've improved 10 fold in the last couple of years.
You could look at swa or hi tuff, if appropriate, terminated in conduit boxes with plug in roses.
Still don't get this fcu business.
I don't quite see the point here, any and every lighting circuit has the same potential for a fault at one fitting to take out the whole circuit, what's so special in this particular case?
If there is a danger from the loss of the lighting circuit then a correctly designed emergency lighting system is needed.
Not danger, convenience.
 

ipf

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The wiring is fried.

The current installation needs replacing.

The correct method for the environment is galv.

Doing anything to the fittings at the moment is just cost with no immediate necessity.

If it WAS done as you suggest then we wouldn't be having this chat.:)

(other than the SY)
If the wiring's fried, I can't see the fittings being in the best of nick.
You're saying galv in the envionment.....what is the environment?
 

GBDamo

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  • #28
If the wiring's fried, I can't see the fittings being in the best of nick.
You're saying galv in the envionment.....what is the environment?
Workshop, it's high level (2.5m) but there are hinged recoil air lines all along the wall so quite a high likelihood of mechanical damage. No other realistic route either.
 

Charlie_

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SWA into galv thru boxes wired into click roses?
What type of fluorescent fittings are currently installed?
Do you still have the ‘fried’ cable?
Please send it to Basec, they will inspectigate why and how it is fried..
 
If there is a wiring fault they are going to have to have it repaired anyway, and if it is done properly now, its unlikely to occur again in the next 20 years. So is the inconvenience of having to use work lamps/torches for a few hours, maybe once every few years, until they can get an electrician on site, worth the cost of adding in isolators for each lighting fixture?
 
T

Toneyz

Is there not fuses within the fittings? The problem with fluorescent fittings is that they can run hot if they are on the length of time they are on and probably breaking down with the effect of heat also.
Not seeing the existing installation I would do a run of conduit with a T box with flexible conduit (or the like) into the end of the fitting. A joint in the T box so that an H/R flex into the fitting. Having done some work within this type of installation you find everything covered with a layer of greasy dirt, therefore, I wouldn't use plugin ceiling roses.
 

ipf

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SWA into galv thru boxes wired into click roses?
What type of fluorescent fittings are currently installed?
Do you still have the ‘fried’ cable?
Please send it to Basec, they will inspectigate why and how it is fried..
I think it may be the ballasts …. tucked up the side of 'em….pretty Basec that, Charlie.;)
 
D

Deleted member 26818

If you’re going to go the galv conduit route, I would suggest two 10A circuits leap frogging each other.
 
Why expensive? Just replace the fittings and feed from plug in roses so that you can isolate any faulty ones.
They still need a circuit running in as the YY is fried, due to the environment it needs to be in galv.

Adding tend LED non corrosives to the bill would be a no go.
I agree with IPF Change fittings for suitable ones prferably LED that are intenally fused at 1 Amp and wire using Greg roses for disconnection/Isolation.
Whole installation if installed at suitable arms reach height or above if safe from mechanical damage risk of vehicles hitting or any other mechanical damage it could be run in HD plastic conduit above the line of fittings.
This way the complete circuit is drawing no more than 1.6 amps and can be wired in 1.5 mm singles with 1.0 mm flex to each fitting and be fed by a 6 amp type B mcb affording you discrimination local point of isolation for safety and saving the customer money in the long run whilst keeping the installation cost reletivly low. Not to mention the added bonus of saving the planet. there is also room in ther to suggest the customer and hes employees would benifit from changing some of these fittings for emergancy fittings.
 

davesparks

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there is also room in ther to suggest the customer and hes employees would benifit from changing some of these fittings for emergancy fittings.
If the emergency lighting installation is correctly designed yes, if not then you could end up with a bunch of useless emergency fittings
 

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