Using lamp posts to charge EV’s

[Welchyboy1]

Heres one to consider, the apparent government solution to charging EV vehicles for people without a driveway is to install a dual 16A charger on each street lamp post

this will also remove the requirement or temptation to trail charging leads across the pavement and walkways from peoples homes

due to the lamp post now having an LED lamp there is spare capacity to charge peoples vehicles

Fantastic idea!

How the hell is that going to work?? Potentially 7.5KW per lamp post all night long, over entire streets!

what cabling did the use for the street furniture? Have they actually considered the load implications?

Has someone not really thought that through, or am I missing something really obvious

 

[telectrix]

and just imagine the volt drop with 10 EVs all plugged into a street of lamp posts.
second thoughts, VD is irrelevant as the cable would be melted anyway.

 

[DPG]

I've seen certain groups of people do a similar thing already with their electric caravans.

 

[littlespark]

It’s a ridiculous idea. We don’t all live in cities where the biggest car journey is to the shops and back.

My van can 100 miles a day just home to wholesaler, to job, to next job and back home.

I’d need 2 chargers, car and van... and a 3rd for visitors?

How are vans going to cover hundreds of miles with heavy loads in the delivery timescales we’ve come to expect?

What’s the likely lifespan of the battery’s in electric vehicles, and how much to replace? I bet it’s much more than the apparent savings in fuel and road tax.

 

[snowhead]

It would depend on how the lamp posts are fed.
Some are a direct individual connection to the adjacent local DNO network, so could easilly handle extra load or the cable could easilly be upgraded.
Others, like where I live on a relatively new (30years old) estate have a feed looped between groups of posts then a single connection to the DNO supply, that wouldn't be able to take too much, if any extra laod, but wouldn't need to as everyone has a driveway.
Major roads are quite often grouped then the groups fed from a single cabinet with a DNO connection.

There will be several different solutions depending on the existing supply.
I think it's it's just as much using the lamp post location and running an extra supply so as not to clutter the street up as actually using the DNO supply at the post.

 

[pc1966]

The Devil is in the detail, if they we are going to be paying to fit these then presumably they will also factor in the cable requirements and DNO smart load management as well.

Are street lights centrally switched or permanently live with their own photo-sensor switches? That alone might demand new cabling.

 

[Zerax]

It's already happening... https://www.fleeteurope.com/en/new-...3]=charging infrastructure&t[4]=London&curl=1

 

[snowhead]

Are street lights centrally switched or permanently live with their own photo-sensor switches? That alone might demand new cabling.

Most are permanent with photocells on top of the post.
The ones on major roads with cabinets have the photocell on the back of the cabinet or a low level post nearby.

 

[DPG]

Seems like a good idea to me. Saves the problem of people with no off street parking having to string cables across pavements.

This sort of thing will be common place in a few years. Along with probably lots of other things we haven't even thought of yet.

And when are electric cars going to be built with solar panels in the roof as standard? Needs to be happening now, and then it will reduce grid/DNO demand problems.

 

[ipf]

No way......is any dog pi$$ing on my plug in power lead.

 

[snowhead]

No way......is any dog pi$$ing on my plug in power lead.

Don't worry, someone will have cut the flex to nick the cable for scrap.

 

[Ziggie]

Heres one to consider, the apparent government solution to charging EV vehicles for people without a driveway is to install a dual 16A charger on each street lamp post

this will also remove the requirement or temptation to trail charging leads across the pavement and walkways from peoples homes

due to the lamp post now having an LED lamp there is spare capacity to charge peoples vehicles

Fantastic idea!

How the hell is that going to work?? Potentially 7.5KW per lamp post all night long, over entire streets!

what cabling did the use for the street furniture? Have they actually considered the load implications?

Has someone not really thought that through, or am I missing something really obvious

You forgot that the long term is that no one owns a car. You dial up and a driverless car arrives and takes you where you want to go.
This implies car parks of cars strategically placed with power points.

depending what you pay there may be cars doing small detours to pick up people going in the same direction.

school runs will also use driverless vehicles and multi- pickups

no garages and no street parking.

 

[Ziggie]

Some of this was considered some time ago. The man who designed Letchworth , the first garden city thought that the town would have about 6 cars which would be shared.

 

[David Prosser]

Well I'm confused on how this prevents trailing leads across the pavement. Where I live the lamposts are on the inside part of the pathway not the road side.

 

[littlespark]

They’ll dig the outlets into the road, under cars. Massive strips running along the roads, and cars having electrical contacts hanging below....
Done before on a scaletrix track

 

[ipf]

Don't worry, someone will have cut the flex to nick the cable for scrap.

Or just for the sake of it, in our caring, sharing society.

Seriously though, there'll be all sorts of problems besides all the arguments....considering the present parking problems.?

 

[Simon47]

And when are electric cars going to be built with solar panels in the roof as standard? Needs to be happening now, and then it will reduce grid/DNO demand problems.

Some practical problems with that. Noticed how the panels are flat, and people don't like driving vans with flat roofs ? Ican see a lot of people saying "every little helps", and in principle it might, but realistically without a major breakthrough in panel technology, you're not going to geet much more than around 250W on a car roof (if that).
Lets put that in perspective. They say that depending on the car, just plugging in (13A plug, so 3kW) can need anything from 8 hours to 24 hours+ to charge. You've got 1/12 of the power available, and it's only there for 1/3 of the day in winter (assuming no shading). So now you are up to 8-24h * 12 * 3, or ... thinks ... 12 to 36 days to charge. Now even assuming you don't use all the capacity - needing several days to recover from one day in the office would be pushing it.

Sticking finger in the air, I could see it making at best 5% difference in overall load - at a great expense (as if lecky cars weren't already expensive enough)

You forgot that the long term is that no one owns a car.

That is where many people want us to be.

You dial up and a driverless car arrives and takes you where you want to go.

Ah, you've gone too far. The end game isn't that, it's no cars - we walk everywhere, and magically jobs move to within walking distance of homes (or vice-versa). Oh well , those rows of back-back houses will come back into fashion.

Well I'm confused on how this prevents trailing leads across the pavement. Where I live the lamposts are on the inside part of the pathway not the road side.

You beat me to it, that's the case on our street. Plus, there's only room to park on one side, and some of the lamp posts are on the wrong side of the road. And then what happens when both sockets are in use, and more people get home - guess that's tough. Or they'll unplug whoever's already there to plug themselves in. Oh, and not to mention the very long cables to get from the lamp post to the car that's two cars away - which will inevitably get run over and/or parked on by someone else.
And before we moved, some days we were doing well if we got to park on our own street at all.
I can see a fresh subject for online videos. Forget the parking wars, lets film the charging wars.

 

[ipf]

Sticking finger in the air

Thinking of wind power??? Better off everybody eating beans and cabbage....

 

[DPG]

Some practical problems with that. Noticed how the panels are flat, and people don't like driving vans with flat roofs ? Ican see a lot of people saying "every little helps", and in principle it might, but realistically without a major breakthrough in panel technology, you're not going to geet much more than around 250W on a car roof (if that).
Lets put that in perspective. They say that depending on the car, just plugging in (13A plug, so 3kW) can need anything from 8 hours to 24 hours+ to charge. You've got 1/12 of the power available, and it's only there for 1/3 of the day in winter (assuming no shading). So now you are up to 8-24h * 12 * 3, or ... thinks ... 12 to 36 days to charge. Now even assuming you don't use all the capacity - needing several days to recover from one day in the office would be pushing it.

Sticking finger in the air, I could see it making at best 5% difference in overall load - at a great expense (as if lecky cars weren't already expensive enough)

That is where many people want us to be.

Ah, you've gone too far. The end game isn't that, it's no cars - we walk everywhere, and magically jobs move to within walking distance of homes (or vice-versa). Oh well , those rows of back-back houses will come back into fashion.

You beat me to it, that's the case on our street. Plus, there's only room to park on one side, and some of the lamp posts are on the wrong side of the road. And then what happens when both sockets are in use, and more people get home - guess that's tough. Or they'll unplug whoever's already there to plug themselves in. Oh, and not to mention the very long cables to get from the lamp post to the car that's two cars away - which will inevitably get run over and/or parked on by someone else.
And before we moved, some days we were doing well if we got to park on our own street at all.
I can see a fresh subject for online videos. Forget the parking wars, lets film the charging wars.

Solar panels don't have to be flat, they can be made flexible, or to curved shapes.

It doesn't have to give anywhere near a full charge, just a bit of a top up. And it's pretty much for free.

This will become standard in a few years.

 

[Simon47]

I think it will be a long time, i.e. for "a few", make that "quite a few" years.
Non-flat panels cost more than flat ones, and I suspect have poorer performance still. So the cost benefit analysis isn't going to favour them for a long time.
And on our drive, they'd produce "not a lot" pretty well any time of year. Out and about, well that will vary.