yield data from Sma sunny design software

[oslosolar]

Hey dudes
I m new to posting but have been reading a long time
we are doing our first job next week then been checked for mcs
but what i'm really wondering is why everyone is so crazy about a few PV manufacturers when according to Sma design software non of them stack up against
Philadelphia M60-250
LDK 240
HHV solar 295

sanyo are way down as are sharp

we are using 14 HHV 295 delived for a really competetive price with 10 year warrantee
they been manfacturing since 1960 or so cheers

 

[SolarCity]

I've read something similar. It also has Moser Baer in 4th place. To say I'm dubious is an understatement.

 

[Markc]

Moser Baer in 4th! You must have that list upside down!

Another point to mention over panel choice is customer expectations. A well known named brand to the client is perceived to be better than a unknown.

 

[oslosolar]

Don't want to rock the sanyo boat etc but there are a lot of first class panels manufacturers out there and they have to pass mcs expectations which can cost a fortune and setting up as a manufacturer can cost tens of millions just for machinery
all I'm saying is open your eyes to what other manufacturers are doing some of these guys have been doing it for forty years but don't make TV's to pay for marketing etc
Cheers

 

[SolarCity]

I'm open minded - but a reports that shows Sanyo in 14th place and Moser Baer in 4th leaves me a little skeptical.

I'll do some research when I eventually have some time.

 

[oslosolar]

Respect biggsolar

 

[SolarCity]

This list appears to be from: Philadelphia Solar photovoltaic - Manufacturers of high quality solar photovoltaic modules, compare modules, solar panels, solar cells, PV panels, solar power France and Spain, solar energy Europe

And it looks, frankly, ridiculous.

Philadelphia panels don't even show up on PV Sol Expert (that should set alarm bells ringing for a start)



From my research on PV Sol Expert:

4kWp system using 16no Sanyo 250w panels and Fronius IG TL 36 inverter:

3,637kWh

3.84kWp system using 16no LDK 240w panels and Fronius IG TL 36 inverter:

3,380.5kWh

3.84kWp system using 13no HHV 295w panels and Fronius IG TL 36 inverter:

3,219.1kWh

4kWp system using 16no Suntech 250w panels (23rd on the list!) and Fronius IG TL 36 inverter:

3,618.1kWh



It would appear that the HHV panels are bloody awful when compared to other panels. LDK are better, but only slightly.

I will run this through Sunny Design and see what I get. I'd be stunned if the LDK panels outperform the Sanyo ones.

 

[SolarCity]

Running the same figures through Sunny Boy 2.0 gives me similar figures. The Sanyo outperforms the Philadelphia panels on an idential set up (16 240w panels, 2 strings on SB4000TL inverter)

None of the other figures in the table stack up either - unless forced to adopt 8 panels systems (which sometimes don't quite 'fit' to the SB inverters)

The industry seriously needs sorting out.

Is there any reason why the yield of a panel can't be empirically proven over a period of time? The power that a certain panel will yield is scientifically answerable and I don't see why this information cannot be given to the consumer. Why aren't these tests carried out?

 

[Worcester]

Saw this lurking at the bottom:

"Yield Data taken from SMA Sunny Design Software v1.56, Location London, Array angle of 30 degree, South Facing"
​

Which makes it an interesting staement of "Independent comparison of solar PV panels rate Philadelphia Solar M60-250W module as the number one performing panel in the world"

 

[oslosolar]

14 hhv 285wp with sunnyboy 3800 = 3549kwh so not that bad surely with 10 warranty on panels

regards

 

[SolarCity]

I've yet to find a panel that has such poor results as the HHV panel. All of the common panels are better in terms of output.

 

[whlphil]

You've got to remember that most of the yield forecast tools rely on manufacturer submitted I/V curves etc so they can be 'adjusted' by those that might be a little more shall we say 'flexible' with the figures.I've had some revised .pan files for LDK that place them in the middle of the pack certainly above Sharp (of old) but not on par with Sunpower,Sanyo etc It's like I always say tho you can't beat experience and all the installers I know who have been working in Spain and Germany say Fronius for reliability and Sanyo for outputImportant statement to add tho that makes no correspondence between cost and return just they they give the most output and the best reliability.Haven't used Sunny Des v2 much as I use PVSol all the time but PVGIS has a disclaimer statement on the website that says 'do not use for financial calcs as the model is not accurate enough'

 

[tlsambo]

PV Sol seems to be giving conservative figures for PV output over a year, unless we've had particularly good year for Solar PV in Cornwall? Typical installs are coming in 10% over predicted PV Sol outputs. We'll be posting actual results soon on our website of actual PV Solar output on some of our customers installations.

 

[SolarCity]

Well the last couple of years have been particularly good for annual sunshine... who knows what next year will bring.

 

[tlsambo]

solar city, do you have any figures for that? It would be interesting to see as it came up in conversation at ecobuild today. One of the Solar PV suppliers was saying they're seeing a consistent year on year increase in irradience. That may explain the performance of PV installations over the PV Sol as the weather files are from 1981-2001.

 

[Gary K]

solar city, do you have any figures for that? It would be interesting to see as it came up in conversation at ecobuild today. One of the Solar PV suppliers was saying they're seeing a consistent year on year increase in irradience. That may explain the performance of PV installations over the PV Sol as the weather files are from 1981-2001.

Well thats a surprise-not!
haven't you heard of global warming.LOL

 

[tlsambo]

yep Gary, that's about the gist of it. Seeing as panels performance reduces as they heat up maybe we're looking at an everdecreasing impact on global warming for PV!?