OP
ApacheTech
Strawmanning? Is that kind of like a scarecrow?
Yes, yes it is. Well done you.
Discuss New business start up; a few questions. in the Electrical Testing & PAT Testing Forum area at ElectriciansForums.net
Strawmanning? Is that kind of like a scarecrow?
but it you've paid for 15,000 licences then you get round the clock support and are on first name terms with your dedicated advisor.
We are on first name terms here, MDJ, Trev, Archy, Murdoch... I don't recall having to even pay for one licence?
No, I did a module on Business Studies in uni a few years back. I did a lot of research during my dissertation on SMEs from a Web Development perspective. I do a lot of network consultancy and systems analysis, bringing businesses networks, hardware, software and website up to date and secure. That's where the Social Engineering comes in, with Information Security. I've been doing this for a while now as a not-for-profit business and I'm now branching it out into a for-profit venture. I would like to offer PAT Testing as a part of the Systems Analysis package, with follow up appointments for aftercare.
I do take the non-flippant feedback to mind though. I'm used to forums where you ask a question and people answer the question you asked, rather than strawmanning the whole thread. I never thought I'd get this reaction, I assumed this was for people to get support and advice.
Look now fella how many times do you want an answer, we have told you some Companies are charging 50p an item, we have told you large Electrical Contractors have cornered the market, we have told you a small business of 10 or less people will have between 15-30 items which will need testing, we have told you anyone can pat test, we have told you to forget specialising in it as the market is dead and you will have to work 18 hours a day 7 days a week to earn 30k after tax, what else do you want to know?I put some handy examples up in the OP.
Hi, I'm a trainee. I've placed a few questions at the beginning of this thread. Would you be able to walk me through some answers to my queries? They're not difficult questions, and I've given examples to clarify my question where they are needed, such as in Question #1. I'm not interested in making a lot of money from this one line of work; as I have said in my opening remarks, this is only one part of the business plan I am writing, but it is just as important as the rest of it. Thank you in advance for your assistance.
Look now fella how many times do you want an answer, we have told you some Companies are charging 50p an item, we have told you large Electrical Contractors have cornered the market, we have told you a small business of 10 or less people will have between 15-30 items which will need testing, we have told you anyone can pat test, we have told you to forget specialising in it as the market is dead and you will have to work 18 hours a day 7 days a week to earn 30k after tax, what else do you want to know?
Look now fella how many times do you want an answer, we have told you some Companies are charging 50p an item, we have told you large Electrical Contractors have cornered the market, we have told you a small business of 10 or less people will have between 15-30 items which will need testing, we have told you anyone can pat test, we have told you to forget specialising in it as the market is dead and you will have to work 18 hours a day 7 days a week to earn 30k after tax, what else do you want to know?
I suggest some primary research is in order, so ... go out to some of these businesses yourself and count them, you could say you were doing a survey, and if you find any correlation between a business type / market / size / blah blah and number of items please let we know.
1. How many items, on average, would you expect a small business to have? I know this varies from business to business, but I'm just after a very bal park figure to use for my pricing strategies. For instance:
- Independent Retailer (Tech)
they don't give a damn or will have a retired sparky doing it for them for years in case they need it.
they don't give a damn or will have a local sparky doing it for them for years in case they need it. you may get business in case he retires.
- Family Run Shop (General)]
they don't give a damn or will have a company doing it for them in case they need it. dropping leaflets or business card may work...
- Small Office
they properly don't care.
- Used Car Lot/Breakers Yard
- Nursery
- Community Centre
those will have some big boys doing testing.
Gasp this really is getting silly now, you have had the answer several times yet still think you haven't, I'm outta here you will be pleased to hear, if anyone else helps you I will be suprised.I've said many times now that I'm not looking to make 30k p/a from this. I'm not really looking to make much money at all from it. I've just asked some simple questions, and although I know how to answer Q5 now in every language since Latin, I still have to find a response that actually answers what I have asked for Q1. "12-30 but don't bother" is not an answer to the question I have asked. A number against each example. Is that really too difficult?
Let you know? Are you joking? I can't even get a straight answer to the question from anyone on here, other than a miserly "12 - 30 but don't bother".
How hard would it be, just to put a number? A ball park figure, whether they care or not. It's not much to ask for. That's all I want. A number against each example. Is that really too difficult?
How many items do I have in my home that could need testing?Ball. Park. Figures.
Well you will certainely get your way regarding this comment.. I'm not really looking to make much money at all from it.
Thank you for your response. I did mention taking average numbers. If your brickie friend has no need for PAT, then he is automatically written out of any further conversation. You have nearly three times the items quoted previously within this thread. I am aware of the severe variance within numbers of items; hence asking people who may have done hundreds of site visits, for average values.
A micro-enterprise is a company that employs between 0 - 9 members of staff. A small business is a company employing 10 - 250 members of staff. Medium businesses employ between 251 - 1000 members of staff, and a large business employs 1001+ members of staff.
It appears, from the OPs definitions, that I am involved in 3 micro-enterprises. Lucky me!
1- electrical work (who'd have thought it) and I have probably 12 items eligible for PAT. But I'll do them myself if needed.
2- stage lighting etc hire company, there we have over 1000 items eligible for PAT, but most of them won't just plug in to a standard PAT machine. And we do it all ourselves anyway, plus doing specialist PAT of such equipment for customers.
3- professional fireworks display company, probably around 20 items eligible for PAT. But access to the site is very restricted so you wouldn't be getting anywhere near it.
I do it myself there too.
So there you go, 3 micro-enterprises with very different quantities of electrical equipment to test.
So that's an average of 344 items per business (don't you just love statistics)
And all irrelevant I guess as the work wouldn't be coming your way anyway!
Hi,
I'm currently writing up a business plan for a new company in the North West; the main disciplines I will be working in are Web Development; Software Development; Risk Based PAT Testing; Cyber Security Training; Social Engineering Awareness Training; and Computer Repairs and Maintenance.
Most of the work is contractual, however the Risk Based PAT Testing will be a source of regular income on a monthly basis, with a lot of seminar and freelance style work in-between. I'm not expecting to make a fortune from PAT Testing, but my ethos is:I'm focussing mainly on small businesses, micro-enterprises and sole-traders because of the work and research I've carried out during my dissertation this year.
"Providing Enterprise level services and support for small business and micro-enterprises".
I have a couple of questions that I cannot find answers to online.
1. How many items, on average, would you expect a small business to have? I know this varies from business to business, but I'm just after a very bal park figure to use for my pricing strategies. For instance:
- Independent Retailer (Tech)
- Family Run Shop (General)
- Small Office
- Used Car Lot/Breakers Yard
- Nursery
- Community Centre
It would be nice to have a Light, Medium and Heavy average for the purposes of financial forecasting.
2. Is using the PAT Testing Distance Learning DVD going to be enough? I have a background in Electrics and Electronics; I have a firm knowledge of Electrical Theory and Electrical Engineering and I have an IET Accredited Honoues degree in Computing and Networking. I have also done some Level 3 Diplomas in Workplace Safety and Health, Project Management and Electrical Studies via ALISON online. Is it worth forking out for the C&G 2377 22 and 32, or should I start with the qualification from the Distance Learning DVD and take the course if I find myself in over my head?
3. Can you do a Electromechanical NVQ while PAT Testing, in order to diversify to be a full Electrician?
4. Is it possible to work towards professional registration with the IET through starting off in PAT Testing or working as an Electrician?
5. How saturated is the PAT Testing market at the moment? I know the changes made in 2012 have put some people off starting up or carrying on with PAT Testing. In my immediate vacinity, there doesn't seem to be anything, but I'm not sure about the North West. I'm looking, realistically, in a 25 mile radius of Chester.
6. Is much of the information you can find online still valid, after the changes made in 2012 to the CoP? There seems to be a lot more emphasis now on merging PAT Testing with traditional Risk Assessment; has there been a shift away from PAT Testing being within the remit of the Maintenance Dept. and more towards the Health and Safety Officer's remit? How has this affected our jobs as outsourced labour?
Thank you for any assistance you can give. Questions #1 and #2 are the greatest concern at this time.
Reply to New business start up; a few questions. in the Electrical Testing & PAT Testing Forum area at ElectriciansForums.net