Retired folks get too much benefit

[sparksburnout]

This subject has started to get to me recently so I thought I would air my views. Might be the area in which I live, it is wall to wall in very well off folks who have retired and are living the life of riley, while most young people are really struggling with one thing or another. I have first hand knowledge of some of them, all they had was run of the mill jobs, basic teachers, civil servants, power station "operatives" for example, and now have pensions that my kids will only dream of. Thing is, most of the ones I have talked to seem to think it is their god given right. Where I live you can't park on the street, it's full of them, parking their new cars so they can jump on the bus from the stop at the end of the road to go into town cos they all have free bus passes. How can that be right? They can easily afford to run a (new) car, but they get a free bus pass? One bloke in the pub the other night was bragging about how he had negotiated an 30% OAP discount at the gym, when I know for a fact he has 3 properties and is minted. Another one was telling him how he spent his winter fuel allowance on a pair of £350 wheels for his ROAD BIKE. This is all a massive joke in my opinion and should be stopped, I would be ashamed of myself if I took this money when I didn't need it, its basically taking money from other hard up people so these old farts can just enjoy themselves and they don't give a monkeys. Typical selfish old gits. And before anyone says it, no they have not "earned" the right to it, their generation is mostly the one that has got this country in the ****k mess it's in. Why are these benefits not means tested? How hard would it be to check on the DVLA database and say "Sorry matey, you own a car so you don't NEED a free bus pass"? No wonder the country is struggling, bloody old timers.......

 

[telectrix]

most will have paid into pension funds all their working lives, workplace pensions and/or private pensions. they certainly won't be able to afford new cars on a state pension alone.

 

[Rpa07]

Good post sparks, I take it that you are working tomorrow and haven't started the weekend yet!
You are right about most of those issue if not all. A lot of it should be means tested, that'll save some.
Winter fuel allowance should credit the fuel provider and not go into the OAP account as the other end of that scale is the Poor OAP, who doesn't spend it on fuel so she can buy the grandkids some presents that they don't need anyway and then goes and dies of hypothermia in the new year when it's coldest. Trouble is nothing is ever even - some fought hard for our freedom and don't ask for anything and some did b@gger all and expect it on the plate.
There is no doubt that that generation is the most fortunate as they may be sitting on a house worth loads now - downsize and have money left over. Fair play but unfair on some.
Have a good weekend

 

[sparksburnout]

Good post sparks, I take it that you are working tomorrow and haven't started the weekend yet!
You are right about most of those issue if not all. A lot of it should be means tested, that'll save some.
Winter fuel allowance should credit the fuel provider and not go into the OAP account as the other end of that scale is the Poor OAP, who doesn't spend it on fuel so she can buy the grandkids some presents that they don't need anyway and then goes and dies of hypothermia in the new year when it's coldest. Trouble is nothing is ever even - some fought hard for our freedom and don't ask for anything and some did b@gger all and expect it on the plate.
There is no doubt that that generation is the most fortunate as they may be sitting on a house worth loads now - downsize and have money left over. Fair play but unfair on some.
Have a good weekend

yes I realise there are some pensioners who genuinely need it, that makes it even worse. The thing that rankles with me is that these old sods have lived in the golden age but they won't realise the fact and just think it is their right to take take take off those who need the money more than they do.

 

[HandySparks]

Interesting point of view from sparksburnout. In some ways I agree. I don't see the point of reductions for OAPs for various venues when many OAPs have more disposable income than many working people.

The free bus pass, winter fuel allowance, free TV licence, different personal tax allowance if born before 1938, etc, are just other examples of government complicating things to appear generous to a particular section of voters. Let's just have an adequate, but not generous, state pension for everyone who's acquired enough NI contributions and then get rid of all the silly extras which just add to the cost of administration.

Same applies to the tax and benefits system in general. Much too complicated!

 

[sparksburnout]

most will have paid into pension funds all their working lives, workplace pensions and/or private pensions. they certainly won't be able to afford new cars on a state pension alone.

Or bought 1000's of utility shares at next to nothing and cashed them in for a fortune just cos they happened to work as a button presser for a well known power company, as in the case of a mate of mine. Some of these people had unbelievable pension schemes for doing relatively crap jobs, just like Greece, and now they get free this, that and the other on top, and than the old *****S sit in the pub and gloat about it, really winds me up.

 

[The Ghost]

The guy I just wired a house for is 73, and just gets £55.00 pound pension and nothing else. I know this because his daughter told me before you ask. He is able to claim more but cant be bothered and hes stubborn. Whereas upwardly mobile people seem to be getting everything going. I think thats the thing there is no help for that kind of guy to claim what not only is he due but would really benefit from it.

 

[GMES]

The Goverment has to take some of the blame as well though, I watched a piers morgan interview with Lord Alan Sugar last year and he was saying how stupid it was that every year he got a winter fuel allowance, he declined it every year and rightfully so, but My point is if they are stupid enough to not realise he doesn't need one then then they are automatically going to send them out to every pensioner.

 

[sparksburnout]

The Goverment has to take some of the blame as well though, I watched a piers morgan interview with Lord Alan Sugar last year and he was saying how stupid it was that every year he got a winter fuel allowance, he declined it every year and rightfully so, but My point is if they are stupid enough to not realise he doesn't need one then then they are automatically going to send them out to every pensioner.

Well there you go! How much dafter can you get, Alan Sugar getting a winter fuel allowance, and no doubt bus pass and free TV license. No wonder the country is in a mess. I wonder if anyone has still got any of those crap old Amstrad amplifiers???

 

[Rpa07]

"I wonder if anyone has still got any of those crap old Amstrad amplifiers???"

Ummmmh! But it's got a nice cabinet that my Shirley Bassey LPs stand up in!

 

[sparksburnout]

"I wonder if anyone has still got any of those crap old Amstrad amplifiers???"

Ummmmh! But it's got a nice cabinet that my Shirley Bassey LPs stand up in!

Your joking!!! I am going to look on Ebay........

 

[Silly Sausage]

Aye, there certainly appears to be a lot of discontent amongst young people these days.
Just to pick up on the Winter Allowance, agreed, it is ridiculous that 'rich' people get it, but it's one of these things that the means testing would cost more than it saves, a pointless exercise all round. I believe that some people donate their WAs to charity.
The people you mention bragging about stuff are basically selfish, greedy, ignorant pricks. If it wasn't that, it would be something else they'd be boring the living daylights out of everybody.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

Ahh, the politics of envy.
It's not fair that they get looked after in retirement while youngsters have a hard time. The government should do something to stop them getting so much.

How about it's not fair that youngsters have a hard time. The government should do something to help youngsters?

 

[Midwest]

Means testing, sounds simple but perhaps not so;
Means Testing - National Audit Office (NAO) - https://www.nao.org.uk/report/means-testing/

 

[sparksburnout]

Ahh, the politics of envy.
It's not fair that they get looked after in retirement while youngsters have a hard time. The government should do something to stop them getting so much.

How about it's not fair that youngsters have a hard time. The government should do something to help youngsters?

Your missing the point Spin, they don't NEED looking after.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

I see the point as being take from them what they worked for.

 

[sparksburnout]

Means testing, sounds simple but perhaps not so;
Means Testing - National Audit Office (NAO) - https://www.nao.org.uk/report/means-testing/

No way! How hard is it to check on the database that already exists and determine that Mrs G Rumpy owns a 2015 Vauxhall Meriva (Standard old folk issue) and therefore does NOT need a bus pass, for a start. Also, if they can run a car, they probably don't need a free TV licence or WFA either for that matter??

 

[sparksburnout]

I see the point as being take from them what they worked for.

They didn't work, in run of the mill jobs, to enjoy free everything when they don't actually need it, while young people have their backs to the wall trying to get on the housing ladder that has spiralled out of control while said retired people have mostly contributed to the very mess that we are in now?

 

[Midwest]

No way! How hard is it to check on the database that already exists and determine that Mrs G Rumpy owns a 2015 Vauxhall Meriva (Standard old folk issue) and therefore does NOT need a bus pass, for a start. Also, if they can run a car, they probably don't need a free TV licence or WFA either for that matter??

Well the National Audit Office thinks it need some consideration, after all it takes one person to means test, another person to approve the payment and another to send the cheque. OR just one person to send a cheque

 

[sparksburnout]

Well the National Audit Office thinks it need some consideration, after all it takes one person to means test, another person to approve the payment and another to send the cheque. OR just one person to send a cheque

That's cos its full of old nearly retired farts.

 

[Pete999]

This subject has started to get to me recently so I thought I would air my views. Might be the area in which I live, it is wall to wall in very well off folks who have retired and are living the life of riley, while most young people are really struggling with one thing or another. I have first hand knowledge of some of them, all they had was run of the mill jobs, basic teachers, civil servants, power station "operatives" for example, and now have pensions that my kids will only dream of. Thing is, most of the ones I have talked to seem to think it is their god given right. Where I live you can't park on the street, it's full of them, parking their new cars so they can jump on the bus from the stop at the end of the road to go into town cos they all have free bus passes. How can that be right? They can easily afford to run a (new) car, but they get a free bus pass? One bloke in the pub the other night was bragging about how he had negotiated an 30% OAP discount at the gym, when I know for a fact he has 3 properties and is minted. Another one was telling him how he spent his winter fuel allowance on a pair of £350 wheels for his ROAD BIKE. This is all a massive joke in my opinion and should be stopped, I would be ashamed of myself if I took this money when I didn't need it, its basically taking money from other hard up people so these old farts can just enjoy themselves and they don't give a monkeys. Typical selfish old gits. And before anyone says it, no they have not "earned" the right to it, their generation is mostly the one that has got this country in the ****k mess it's in. Why are these benefits not means tested? How hard would it be to check on the DVLA database and say "Sorry matey, you own a car so you don't NEED a free bus pass"? No wonder the country is struggling, bloody old timers.......

So someone who has paid into a pension scheme all their working life don't deserve to live comfortably in their retirement, is that what you are saying? Pete999 pensioner and I can't afford a new car, and I have given up my winter fuel allowance, I have my own house which is bought and payed for, so I'm not scrounging off the social. You may not be so critical when you have reached retirement.

 

[sparksburnout]

So someone who has paid into a pension scheme all their working life don't deserve to live comfortably in their retirement, is that what you are saying? Pete999 pensioner and I can't afford a new car, and I have given up my winter fuel allowance, I have my own house which is bought and payed for, so I'm not scrounging off the social. You may not be so critical when you have reached retirement.

Your missing my original point Pete, which is that a lot of pensioners that are very well off thank you very much and can afford a new car and 2 cruises a year are still taking everything they can get and then gloating about it because "it is their right". Well it ain't IMO. A lot of young people are struggling due to the mess that their generation have left behind, and to top it off they seem to think they are worthy of benefits they don't need. Of course there are some that do deserve it. Anyway well done for giving up the WFA, that's what I would do as well.

 

[Midwest]

Well that's what everyone does, with a few exceptions (and the likes Alan Sugar aside). As Pete says, if you spent 50 years of your life paying into a system you will gladly except what you are entitled to. A few examples;
Child Benefit, NHS dental treatment, sick pay, holiday pay, and if your self employed paying as little tax as possible (via your accountant), claiming expensives for dining 'business partners' etc etc. That's before you retire. Everyone's at it not just good old Joe Public, MP's, Doctors, even the Queen tax affairs are questionable.
So when I properly retire, I will claim my state pension, along with my other pension I bought and paid for. And if I want a new car. or go on a cruise. I won't feel guilty

 

[ruston]

Maybe if you had said privileged instead of old folks , you might have had a bit more agreement.

 

[Barry White]

So the OAPs who have worked all there lives most of them very hard. Paid there taxes,paid into pensions,bought there houses(instead of ----ing it up the wall) shouldent claim what they are entitled too?
I disagree,The young of today need to work and get on the property ladder forget about fancy new phones, games machines and fancy clothes. Buy a good pension or invest savings so they too can live it up.
Theres far too many not ever had a job claiming state pension and fuel allowance.Then there free bus pass. these are the folks I dont like.

 

[ruston]

So the OAPs who have worked all there lives most of them very hard. Paid there taxes,paid into pensions,bought there houses(instead of ****ing it up the wall) shouldent claim what they are entitled too?
I disagree,The young of today need to work and get on the property ladder forget about fancy new phones, games machines and fancy clothes. Buy a good pension or invest savings so they too can live it up.
Theres far too many not ever had a job claiming state pension and fuel allowance.Then there free bus pass. these are the folks I dont like.

You are correct again. No one is giving them anything , they have bought and paid for what they have got .
If they are going to means test , they need to find out where the super large tellies , phones and contracts , designer gear people on free rent and council tax are getting their bit from.
Before anyone starts , this is not a dig at genuine claimants , but we all know the abuse goes on.

 

[boardey]

I have a reasonable car, i also have a travel pass for the area i live in. Why do i use my pass because their are so many sausages at your age that drive like they are in a race everyday they get behind the wheel.

 

[sparksburnout]

I have a reasonable car, i also have a travel pass for the area i live in. Why do i use my pass because their are so many sausages at your age that drive like they are in a race everyday they get behind the wheel.

Not sure what age you think I am! (58) but I don't drive like like a sausage. But I do go back to my point, why do you think you should get free bus travel when you can afford to run a reasonable car? It doesn't make sense to me. At the end of the day, it is not "free", it is being paid for by everyone else isn't it? If a pensioner is unable to run a car due to financial constraints then fine, but an awful lot are just being plain greedy, and what wound me up in particular was the way they were gloating about it.

 

[Resu]

Seriously? There's plenty worse in the world to be worrying about than this. Why waste your time with this sad little rant when it's going to acheive nothing? There's a few billion people in the world now and I think it's generally accepted that you aren't going to agree with how everyone runs there lives. So just ignore the assholes and get on with your own life.

PS. I am a struggling 24 year old with a wife and 2 toddlers, a 10 year old car and live in a rented house. I claim no benefits. Do I agree with the people in your OP? No. But I'm not going to waste another minute of my life moaning about them.

 

[Midwest]

I do think sparksburntout raises a valid point. Benefits are for people on low incomes, sick, disabled or otherwise unable to support themselves. If the system functioned correctly and fairly, there would sufficient government funding to increase or improve the range of benefits.

Unfortunately, benefit fraud stands at £1.3 billion (Benefit fraud and error at record low - Press releases - GOV.UK - https://www.gov.uk/government/news/benefit-fraud-and-error-at-record-low), and whilst at its lowest level in recent years, is still a massive amount of money.

It would appear that 'means testing' might be counter productive (#14). So we need to rely on peoples honesty & benefit fraud investigation. As I mention early, some people have a different 'threshold' on what is dishonest & what is just getting back what their paid in to the system. When I am collecting my state pension, I wouldn't apply for a bus pass if I had a car, but I would consider help with my heating bills for example.

Perhaps if we perceive people are abusing the system and especially if they appear to be bragging about doing so, we should consider reporting them. My favourite pet hate, is the abuse of the 'blue badge' parking permit. I seen vehicles parking using the badge, where clearly the badge holder is not utilising the vehicle or the badge holder is parking a vehicle in a dangerous position, albeit one allowed under the scheme.

If anything has come of your thread sparksburntout, you're perceived as a twenty something tearaway
:mkungfu: