Issues re import export meter

[DonaLS]

Hello again, @Little Spark has helped me in the past with metering issues with energy supplier. Having a few issues (again) and wondering if anyone can help...Basically I have a Landis and Gyr import export meter. Octopus has said it's running backwards (which I don't believe is the case). When I take a reading I have to deduct R from T. Meter has rolled over and they said I need a smart meter but firstly they said I need a meter move as there is no room for a smart meter. Do I need a meter move if the meter is swapped straight over? Image of meter cupboard below. That's question number 1 Many thanks.

 

[littlespark]

I think this is a case of “computer says no”

(Now there’s a modern reference for the young ones to look up.)

Suppliers want you to take out a smart meter, but there’s no reason to have one forced upon you.
You might just need to speak to a human being at Octopus, and convince them the meter has just run over.
Take daily readings yourself, you’ll see which way it’s counting

The next question is, how much electric have you used to roll over a meter? Not got an illegal grow room in your attic have you?

 

[mainline]

Hello again, @Little Spark has helped me in the past with metering issues with energy supplier. Having a few issues (again) and wondering if anyone can help...Basically I have a Landis and Gyr import export meter. Octopus has said it's running backwards (which I don't believe is the case). When I take a reading I have to deduct R from T. Meter has rolled over and they said I need a smart meter but firstly they said I need a meter move as there is no room for a smart meter. Do I need a meter move if the meter is swapped straight over? Image of meter cupboard below. That's question number 1 Many thanks.

A digital meter won't run backwards.

Not a lot of room in that cabinet by the looks.

 

[DonaLS]

I think this is a case of “computer says no”

(Now there’s a modern reference for the young ones to look up.)

Suppliers want you to take out a smart meter, but there’s no reason to have one forced upon you.
You might just need to speak to a human being at Octopus, and convince them the meter has just run over.
Take daily readings yourself, you’ll see which way it’s counting

The next question is, how much electric have you used to roll over a meter? Not got an illegal grow room in your attic have you?

Haha! No! The meter has been in the House for over 30 years. Octopus do have a reading where one month's reading is less than the previous month (2023) and have told me it's running backwards. Surely it would have lower figures every month? The reading this month is one digit less than last month...? I wish I could find my original post on here but I can't. They have also "suggested" a meter move as not enough room in cupboard for smart meter (not sure if I've already mentioned this), however, I don't think I should pay £1400/1500 for this just to receive a smart meter. The meter in situ is Landis and Gyr with both import and export (R and T) readings. I am actually speaking to someone via email so everything is documented. I asked them what evidence they have of it running backwards and as previously mentioned they quoted ONE reading from 2023...! I have taken readings today and it isn't running backwards, however when I deduct the export that's where the problem arises. Many thanks for your reply @littlespark

 

[snowhead]

"Smart Meters" and their associated comms unit take up more space than a standard meter, so there isn't enough space available in your cupboard.
You will need to extend the cupboard to the right, (look like it's next to a door or window?) or above, or to the left, so a new meter (if required) can be fitted, that won't constitute a meter move (and charge).

Re the readings, as on your older post linked below, a "1" is needed at the start of the reading before you deduct.

D

UK Thread 'Help with Landis and Gyr import / export meter'

Dec 6, 2022

Hi, Our meter is an import / export Landis and Gyr. To supply Our readings We have to deduct the R from the T. The meter has now rolled over to 00*** so We can not deduct the R now as this would give a minus reading. Any idea how to give energy company a reading? Someone said add 99999 to current reading but the energy company can not confirm this! They keep saying send the T reading but this is Total with the Export (R) reading. If anyone could help it would be greatly appreciated!

• DonaLS
• export help meter reading
• Replies: 7
• Forum: UK Electrical Forum

 

[DonaLS]

"Smart Meters" and their associated comms unit take up more space than a standard meter, so there isn't enough space available in your cupboard.
You will need to extend the cupboard to the right, (look like it's next to a door or window?) or above, or to the left, so a new meter (if required) can be fitted, that won't constitute a meter move (and charge).

Re the readings, as on your older post linked below, a "1" is needed at the start of the reading before you deduct.

D

UK Thread 'Help with Landis and Gyr import / export meter'

Dec 6, 2022

Hi, Our meter is an import / export Landis and Gyr. To supply Our readings We have to deduct the R from the T. The meter has now rolled over to 00*** so We can not deduct the R now as this would give a minus reading. Any idea how to give energy company a reading? Someone said add 99999 to current reading but the energy company can not confirm this! They keep saying send the T reading but this is Total with the Export (R) reading. If anyone could help it would be greatly appreciated!

• DonaLS
• export help meter reading
• Replies: 7
• Forum: UK Electrical Forum

Hi Snowhead,

Thank you. Yes @littlespark gave me that information a couple or so years ago which is what I've been doing. There is a discrepancy with Octopus as mentioned from 2023 where June reading is 6 digits lower than May of that year. This time when I took the reading and deducted the R the reading is 1 digit lower than last month. Is this because of the generation or export?
Many thanks for advice on extending cupboard!

 

[brianmoooore]

It's not a case that there's no room for a smart meter - it's more that someone has placed a consumer unit on the supplier's meter board.

 

[donnelly22]

I would advise not to make a meter transfer if the new smart meter fits in the same place. The main thing is to connect the wires correctly, then everything will work as it should.

 

[DonaLS]

I would advise not to make a meter transfer if the new smart meter fits in the same place. The main thing is to connect the wires correctly, then everything will work as it should.

Thank you @donnelly22. Octopus are saying (from a picture) there isn't enough room for a smart meter.

 

[brianmoooore]

Octopus are saying (from a picture) there isn't enough room for a smart meter.

Haven't they commented about the consumer unit being where it shouldn't be?

 

[DonaLS]

Haven't they commented about the consumer unit being where it shouldn't be?

Hi, no they haven't.

 

[mainline]

The main thing is to connect the wires correctly, then everything will work as it should.

What wires need connecting properly ?

 

[newfutile]

All wires need connecting properly, sounds like Ai nonsense to me?

 

[DonaLS]

Hi Snowhead,

Thank you. Yes @littlespark gave me that information a couple or so years ago which is what I've been doing. There is a discrepancy with Octopus as mentioned from 2023 where June reading is 6 digits lower than May of that year. This time when I took the reading and deducted the R the reading is 1 digit lower than last month. Is this because of the generation or export?
Many thanks for advice on extending cupboard!

 

[7029 dave]

Those meters have a built in back stop, only the old dial meters run backwards with PV.

 

[DonaLS]

Those meters have a built in back stop, only the old dial meters run backwards with PV.

Thanks Dave. Why would the readings be lower sometimes? Would it be possibly exporting more than We are using? Really appreciate your reply.

 

[7029 dave]

Thanks Dave. Why would the readings be lower sometimes? Would it be possibly exporting more than We are using? Really appreciate your reply.

Are we talking about your export meter? , maybe your not generating enough sometimes.?

 

[DonaLS]

Are we talking about your export meter? , maybe your not generating enough sometimes.?

It's an import / export meter with R and T readings. Octopus are saying I need a smart meter as meter running backwards (?) but some of the monthly readings are for example 6 digits less than previous month. Doesn't happen all the time. I deduct R from T to give the readings.

 

[7029 dave]

It's an import / export meter with R and T readings. Octopus are saying I need a smart meter as meter running backwards (?) but some of the monthly readings are for example 6 digits less than previous month. Doesn't happen all the time. I deduct R from T to give the readings.

When I worked for one of the big six, we stopped fitting import/export meters ( green meter). it was just the supply meter and the customers own PV generation meter. Maybe its gone faulty maybe you can ask for a like for like meter exchange. ( without the smart meter option) good luck

 

[DonaLS]

When I worked for one of the big six, we stopped fitting import/export meters ( green meter). it was just the supply meter and the customers own PV generation meter. Maybe its gone faulty maybe you can ask for a like for like meter exchange. ( without the smart meter option) good luck

Thank you. Have a great weekend

 

[baldelectrician]

That looks untidy

If it were my home I would replace the consumer unit and ask for the cable head to be replaced (bottom right)
When the new unit is installed it would free more space, you will have full RCD protection (through RCBO's). At the same time you could have the existing generation meter and isolator moved more out of the way.

Standard meters are still on sale- Octopus say they are no longer made; what they mean is they do not buy them.
Many places sell them

Get a quote from a decent compotent electrician.

ps I would suggest Hager consumer units as they are decent quality

 

[newfutile]

Hello again, @Little Spark has helped me in the past with metering issues with energy supplier. Having a few issues (again) and wondering if anyone can help...Basically I have a Landis and Gyr import export meter. Octopus has said it's running backwards (which I don't believe is the case). When I take a reading I have to deduct R from T. Meter has rolled over and they said I need a smart meter but firstly they said I need a meter move as there is no room for a smart meter. Do I need a meter move if the meter is swapped straight over? Image of meter cupboard below. That's question number 1 Many thanks.

I'm fairly sure you just give the import meter reading and the export meter reading separately and not deduct one from the other,if you on a seg or fit you get less per unit than what you pay import.

 

[DonaLS]

I'm fairly sure you just give the import meter reading and the export meter reading separately and not deduct one from the other,if you on a seg or fit you get less per unit than what you pay import.

Hi, I can only send one reading and I was advised on here and by Bulb that the reading they need is T minus R.

 

[littlespark]

Hi, I can only send one reading and I was advised on here and by Bulb that the reading they need is T minus R.

Mathematically it is quite possible to get a negative using this method, so for supplier not to accept it is foolish.

Any period of time where generation is more than consumption (ie, empty house for a period of time, nothing being used, but sun is still shining)

Nothing is running backwards. Both meters are increasing… but generation one has increased more than the consumption

All I can suggest now is check the contract with supplier that there isn’t a claus that says if T minus R is less than zero, then put in as zero, not a minus.



I’ve still got a feed in tarring contract.. where my supplier pays me for 50% of what I generate. If I use this free PV electricity, my digital (not smart) meter just stops going up…. It doesn’t go backwards. Any excess goes to the grid. They just assume 50/50

 

[newfutile]

I can't see how any subtraction can be possible,you might pay 30 p per kwh imported but only get 8p per kwh you sell back to them

 

[littlespark]

I can't see how any subtraction can be possible,you might pay 30 p per kwh imported but only get 8p per kwh you sell back to them

Technically not selling any back…. Just not paying for everything showing on the consumption meter.
Only paying consumption minus generation.