To be fully qualified.....

[Nifty]

Hi all

I passed my year one of c&g 2330 and just about to start my year 2 (part 2) am I right in thinking once I pass year 2 I will be a qualified electrician?

What is the improver course? (year 3)

Also if I am wrong could you someone tell me what else I need to do to become qualified.....qualified as in either working for myself - rewiring a whole house or working for a company which will send me out on jobs to rewire a house.

Regards
Nifty

 

[rmc86uk]

Don't know anything about the sole trader or domestic installer schemes.

If you plan to work on sites then to become a JIB graded Electrician you will need the 2330 levels 2 and 3, 17th edition and NVQ Level 3 which you will need to be working in the trade to complete.

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[Deleted member 26818]

If the 2330 is done to the 17th, will a separate 17th qualification be required?
I know someone who did their 2391, and when they updated their JIB card, it came back with the 17th on it, even though they haven't done the 2382.

 

[Nifty]

which you will need to be working in the trade to complete.

This is the dilemma I have now as im in full time work (nothing to do with electrics) so how will I complete if im not working in the trade?

I feel I might be in for a lot of hard work this year getting through my level 2 then level 3 the following year only to be told I cant complete and become a qualified sparky as im not working in the trade???

Nifty

 

[rmc86uk]

Spinlondon

Not sure, I thought you would have needed the the regs cert. How would you prove that you have done it to 17th edition wiring regs because some people have done courses such as 2330 to the 16th.

Nifty

It depends on what type of work you want to go into. The course you are enrolled on is the best one to learn theory and basic practical side of it all.

All I can say is you should start applying for trainee or labourer positions to try and work alongside you being at college. As you may have read the industry is very hard at the moment but keep on with everything your doing and good luck.

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[Nifty]

All I can say is you should start applying for trainee or labourer positions to try and work alongside you being at college.

Thanks rcm

That would be ideal if I was in my late teens or early twenty's but when I have a full time job and a mortgage ect its not as easy as that, to take a trainee's wage now woud mean starting from scratch..

My plan was a total change of career without the trainee/apprentiship. maybe a job with the council/ street lights or maybe alarm systems or electric doors.

hmmm I seriously need a hard think before I start a whole new year studying.....this week!

Nifty

 

[Risteard]

If the 2330 is done to the 17th, will a separate 17th qualification be required?

In a word, no. I never took the 2381 and yet my old JIB card listed "IEE Wiring Regulations, 16th Edition".

 

[OllieNotts]

This surely is stuff you should of asked before even starting college?
A qualified spark after 6 hours a week in a class room? Is this a wind up?
I don't think it's easy changing careers at any time in life, especially with the uk on it's knees the way it is. Why not try to shadow a local spark in your spare time to get some experience while you're at college? I only started my level 2 this week but I'm just repeating what the lads on here say daily to folk like you and me who are wanting to join the trade. It's not gonna be easy but if you want it enough you'll have to make sacrifices and like us 'hope for the best' at the end of it.

 

[Nifty]

HI OllieI wish I had the time to shadow a sparky...I undertand what your saying and I did ask questions but I got the impression I just had to complete year 1 and 2 to be a qualified electrician and then if I wanted to work on my own I would have to do the improver course which would be year 3.I didn't know anything about the nvq.Nifty

 

[OllieNotts]

Sounds like you've been told similar to me. I've been told that 'passing level 2 & 3 means you're a qualified soark' on paper at least. Not sure how good your chances if getting work out of it are though within the current climate. An approved electrician is one who does the nvq and gets the JIB status but if you don't want to do site work and stick to domestic I've been led to believe you can go work for yourself as a spark. Now wether you would or not without having relevant experience is obviously up to you. You can join a scheme and prove your competence which means you can sign work off to so I guess the answer is yes you'll be an electrician but I don't think I would call myself that until I have JIB or experience. I could be wrong but it's how it's been told to me. You'd have to stay on the domestic side though.

 

[Nifty]

HI Ollie,I've just got of the phone to my college as I was on the verge of quitting the course so my questions were....what do I need to become a qualified electrician and they said year 1 & 2 level 2 and then your 3rd year level 3 then your 17th edition.I mentioned the nvq and told him I'm worried I would need to quit my job. the tutor said the 2330 course I'm doing does away with the nvq.I know what your saying about getting experience......my reason for doing the course is a back up in case anything happens to the job I'm in at the moment..........sorry if this is all jumbled up but It's a reply from a phone.Regards Nifty

 

[Risteard]

the tutor said the 2330 course I'm doing does away with the nvq.

Nonsense. The NVQ requires the technical certificate and is not replaced by it.

 

[Nifty]

I'm hoping then he means the NVQ is built into my 2330 course So there is no need to do it separately.

 

[JUD]

As far as I know the 2357 will replace the 2330 and will include the old 2356 (NVQ) all in one course, but as already stated you will need to be working in the trade to complete it.

 

[piratebillybob]

from what im aware.... to be a fully qualified sparky you need to complete the NVQ level 3 electrotechnical, do the AM2, 17th edition regs and the 2391 They used to get people to do the 2330 level 2 and 3 as an introduction to the industry to lead you into the NVQ level 3. The NVQ level 3 is the actual qualification that makes you a qualified electrician. the 2330 levels 1,2 and 3 dont really qualify you to do anything. If you only do the 2330 and dont get an apprenticeship then its game over. And the only possibility left is an Electrical improver which seems to be for those who failed to get the nvq level 3 for some reason. You wont be able to work on your own as an improver, youll always have to have someone with you. And if you always have to have an electrician with you then theres no real reason not to work towards the nvq. Heres the definition for JIB Grading Definitions - Electrical Improver Grade As far as im aware, regardless of what these expensive training courses say there is no way you can become a fully qualified sparky without on the job training. You can become a domestic electrical installer by working in bays in a classroom, but to become fully qualified spark you need to work on the tools for at 2-4 years. And the minimum wage for apprenticeships is £2.50 To be a domestic electrical installer you need to do at least the 17th edition, part p and 2392 inspection and testing. You can do house stuff but you wont be able to change the distribution board and you wont be able to do periodicals.

 

[dasa NE1]

Hi guys posted this for another guy earlier hope it helps

The best way forward in my opinion is what I told you yesterday to find a local spark either someone you know or by standing outside local electrical suppliers and hand out leaflets to every spark who gets out of van . Tell them you will work for free at weekends after college or work. Times are hard at the moment no companies are taking on trainees at the moment and the ones who are use JTL or similar set ups to bring apprentices through. The domestic sparks are fighting to make money against cowboys , cheap oversees farmers and teachers etc coming over and working as sparks mates for dodgy firms charging peanuts for jobs and cutting every corner they can. So although it sounds bleak there will be some domestic sparks who will look at it as good investment some free labor for their knowledge. This my friend cannot be bought there are some brilliant sparks out there who can teach you more than any college, book or course ever will. There is not and never will be a substitute for a good teacher the best people to teach you are the guys who have done it since they were 15 years old when there was no training academy’s or quick 6 , 12 or 24 week courses . To be a good competent spark it takes years not weeks. Theory is important you need to understand the fundamentals of electrical safety and all its principles but it means nothing without a good spark taking you under his wing and teaching you all he knows. You have committed to your course both financially and in study use it as the first step to your career not the only step .Don’t be second guessing it now it’s done . The qualifications you will get are industry standard now so every job you apply for in the future will ask for them. So invest as much of your time as you can spare with a spark as this is the best investment you will ever make in your career. It’s worked for dozens of people I know and everyone wins.
Good luck my friend and always look for the opportunity there is always an avenue.
Hope this helps

Kind Regards Das

 

[dasa NE1]

Also guys you can do your NVQ 3 using the route above . You need to complete 2 jobs showing at different stages you prepping the job , first fix . second fix and a little bit of testing . A decent spark will get you to this level before you fininsh your 2330 level 2.

Im not sure about the coming changes to 2330 and NVQ but my guess is this route will still work and get you JIB status for commerial and give you your entry into the industry. This route has worked for a number of sparks I know any other questions please dont hesitate to ask

Kind Regards Das

 

[alarm man]

There is not and never will be a substitute for a good teacher the best people to teach you are the guys who have done it since they were 15 years old when there was no training academy’s or quick 6 , 12 or 24 week courses .

they were called technical college's then,it took years not weeks to become a spark

 

[platty1005]

Hi fellas I work in training and to be honest the whole system is very confusing especially for people who are looking to re-train and believe a college course will make them a fully qualified spark.
Part P courses are divided into 2 parts defined scope and full scope
Defined scope is for people whose main work is not electrical but involves domestic electrical electrical work such as plumbers CH installers kitchen fitters etc. Full scope is for people who want to do DOMESTIC electrical installation as their main employment. A one or 2 week course gives you the qualifications to be a DOMESTIC INSTALLER not a fully qualified spark
To be a fully qualified spark you need a technical qualification EG: 2330 and a NVQ. An NVQ is work based assessments by a qualified assessor you need to complete a wide range of electrical installations under supervision usually as an apprentice and build up a portfolio of all the jobs you have worked on. to get JIB status I believe you still have to complete AM2 which would be very difficult without lots of practical experience. Imagine getting your driving license without driving on real roads. This is like saying I am a fully qualified spark after doing a college course only. If you read the small print training providers advertise courses leading to becoming a qualified electrician they cannot guarantee it without a job in the trade.
So I am sorry to burst a lot of bubbles but to become a fully qualified spark you need to complete a technical certificate AND be in a job where qualified sparks teach and supervise you so you can build up your NVQ portfolio until you become competent on all aspects of electrical installation not just domestic.

 

[dasa NE1]

You do not need to do the AM2 if you have done and NVQ Level 3 to get JIB staus . AM2 is the practical exam for the apprentice route . The NVQ is still achievable by working on a voultary basis for an electrcial contracor if you are unable to gain full time enployment in the electrcial game. You do need to be covered by there insurance policy or you can take out your own cover and work as a suby but without getting paid. But I must stress this is only the entry route into the trade to stay in it you need to be working in the game on a daily basis learning as you go . Just having the paperwork to say your a spark doesnt make you one . The skills you pick up along the way does .

 

[platty1005]

Hi DASA working on a voluntary basis for what I would estimate approx 18months to get an NVQ that is dedication or just plain stupid

 

[Risteard]

to be a fully qualified sparky you need to complete the NVQ level 3 electrotechnical, do the AM2, 17th edition regs and the 2391

The AM2 forms part of the NVQ evidence. Apprentices must however complete the AM2.

2391 is designed only to be attempted by already fully qualified Electricians and as such is not required to become a fully qualified Electrician.

 

[Nifty]

Thank you all for the replys
I still havent made my mind up if to go back to college but there is 1 question I have:

I know someone who is a spark and runs his own company, am I able to do the NVQ Level 3 on the "odd" saturday with him....if he agrees, or would I need to be working full time with him?


If it is full time then I have my answer about going not going back to college.

 

[dasa NE1]

I know six other sparks who have done it that way as long as the learning provider who will assess you has no problems then you should be ok. Check with them then snatch your mates hand off.

Kind Regrds Das

 

[Nifty]

Cheers Das

 

[dasa NE1]

Every time you do any sparky work take photos . You must have correct PPE on including gloves , eye protection were required. As all can be used as evidence in your portfollio. It took my mates about 6 months to get through doing it part time but taking photos is a must . Good luck having a mate in the game is half the battle the rest will fall into place. Were are you with your 2330 now ?
Sorry if me spellings not correct but sorting me gear out for Afghan so me heads done in


Kind Regards Das

 

[jonesy123]

Nothing to quantify QUALIFIED in any book i've read. More so the BRB says over and over again is COMPETENT...Discuss????

 

[Nifty]

Hi Das

Im just about to start year 2 level 2...this Wednesday!

I'm sure I can get the photos done OK, but 6 months?? I honestly thought it would of been a couple of months at the most.....what is involved with the NVQ?

 

[dasa NE1]

It can be done easily in two months as long as you have 2 seperate jobs to start. It involves the prepearation , health and safety issues . first fix . second fix , little testing of two jobs . The NVQ is done online with whats called QUICKSTEP. you answer questions write statements attach photos, assesor marks it sends it back job done. The assesor send it away to be verified and thats it.
But to be honest it wont be any use to you untill after 2330 level 3 so use the time to get your NVQ but most of all get as much hands on as you can. I know working for nowt sounds crap but in all the cases I have seen once you can first fix on your own then the sparks tend to take you on a day rate as they start to depend on you hopefully this will be the same for you.
Good luck hope this helps anything else give me a shout.

Kind Regards Das