24 module DB to include 16 MCBs

[vini]

I am looking for a 24 module DB to include isolator, 16 MCBs, 2 RCDs and a SPD. So far all I have seen is an Excel board, which I have never used. I tend to use BG boards.

Has anyone used these boards? and what are your thoughts?

Area there other boards available? I have to admit my search was about 20 minutes long, before I came here to ask the question. Any help/thoughts would be appreciated.

 

[davesparks]

I assume from the mention of BG that you are looking for a consumer unit?
In which case I have always used and recommend contactum but would strongly recommend against a dual RCD setup in favour of the RCBO option.

And don't forget surge protection

 

[James]

FuseBox F2022M 22 Way RCBO Consumer Unit

FuseBox F2022M 22 way rcbo consumer unit has a Double bank design and is ideal for situations where a larger board is required but space is at a premium

www.fusebox.shop

they also do a 30 way unit

 

[nicebutdim]

Can also be done in a single row board, but most manufacturer's will have stopped producing dual RCD boards and stocks of more popular brands will most likely be sold out.

 

[vini]

RCBOs is actually a good shout with a SPD would help with the size.

Unfortunately space constraints won't allow for a double bank unit

 

[Teddy Lop]

If going rcbo (and I'd echo not wanting that many mcbs on a RCD) Hagar do an 18 usable way that already has SPD onboard, ie 22 module. And they're my current favourite.

 

[nicebutdim]

If going the RCBO route most manufacturers should offer a board of this size with SPD onboard as this is what a good percentage of new domestic installations require.

 

[littlespark]

There’s another thread on here showing, I think, a 24 module board, with 24 modules in it…. And had enough space left over for a blank (25 modules in a 24)

 

[richy3333]

Why would you want to hang that many MCBs off of 2 RCDs? It's just asking for trouble now or in the future.

Why not just ask your wholesalers to sort it out - thats what I would do. Tell them the space dimensions you have for the CU and your desired layout?

 

[MDJ]

I am looking for a 24 module DB to include isolator, 16 MCBs, 2 RCDs and a SPD. So far all I have seen is an Excel board, which I have never used. I tend to use BG boards.

Has anyone used these boards? and what are your thoughts?

Area there other boards available? I have to admit my search was about 20 minutes long, before I came here to ask the question. Any help/thoughts would be appreciated.

I would use Separate Rcbos and go for a Schneider DB which will take 24 ways or more if needed and they have multipull choices, I would avoid contactum and BG as IMO they are cheap and cheerful, that said we all have different opinions, Hagar is also a good make IMO

 

[Teddy Lop]

I would use Separate Rcbos and go for a Schneider DB which will take 24 ways or more if needed and they have multipull choices, I would avoid contactum and BG as IMO they are cheap and cheerful, that said we all have different opinions, Hagar is also a good make IMO

Maybe just my experiences are anecdotal but I've found that many BG RCDs out of spec while doing EICRs I carry a spare. Odd as most of their stuff is fine, fitted billions of their sockets etc, the grey inserts on steel is a nice look.

TBF Hagar is all I want to fit these days, hardly anyone else seems capable of producing something that fits together properly IE doesn't try to twist out of shape when you tighten it all together. Had an encounter with a newly and quite poorly installed large crabtree DB last week and it made me want to cry, their stuff was once what you aspired to.

 

[nicebutdim]

Maybe just my experiences are anecdotal but I've found that many BG RCDs out of spec while doing EICRs I carry a spare. Odd as most of their stuff is fine, fitted billions of their sockets etc, the grey inserts on steel is a nice look.

TBF Hagar is all I want to fit these days, hardly anyone else seems capable of producing something that fits together properly IE doesn't try to twist out of shape when you tighten it all together. Had an encounter with a newly and quite poorly installed large crabtree DB last week and it made me want to cry, their stuff was once what you aspired to.

BG grey inserts were an excellent idea and ended up being fitted on tiled surfaces in my home. I recently replaced an FCU on which the switch had failed and found another switch on a socket sticking a few days back - so far it has been fine since, but raises a few concerns for me.

Hager generally make decent domestic boards, but I feel they're hugely over-priced and the company is slow to introduce innovations that other manufacturers incorporated years before, but seemingly obsessed with needless 'innovation' such as bluetooth technology in protective devices. Most of my work is on 3 phase installations and Hager are decades behind on that front.

 

[Teddy Lop]

Hager generally make decent domestic boards, but I feel they're hugely over-priced and the company is slow to introduce innovations that other manufacturers incorporated years before, but seemingly obsessed with needless 'innovation' such as bluetooth technology in protective devices. Most of my work is on 3 phase installations and Hager are decades behind on that front.

Hugely overpriced? Compared to what? RCBOs are 15 or so and I see only budget brands below that

Don't do much 3ph but do have a couple coming up and it's hard to look past Hager - have a dim view of the electrium stuff and mem and schneider escalate the price - what is it they're lacking out of interest?

 

[nicebutdim]

Hugely overpriced? Compared to what? RCBOs are 15 or so and I see only budget brands below that

Don't do much 3ph but do have a couple coming up and it's hard to look past Hager - have a dim view of the electrium stuff and mem and schneider escalate the price - what is it they're lacking out of interest?

Looking around I see there has indeed been a significant reduction in pricing of Hager protective devices. It's not very long ago that Hager didn't offer a single module SP+N RCBO - something which 'budget' brands had offered for several years prior and which Crabtree (an electrium brand of which you take a dim view, without any explanation as to why) had offered for quite a few years before that - and when they did introduce the option it was accompanied by a considerable price tag.

I'm not sure what exactly constitutes a 'budget brand' other than lower prices. I can think of a few low priced brands producing very good exclosures with flush mounting options and all other features expected of a domestic board. Am I missing something here or is there something about all 'budget brands' for which they should be overlooked?

What Hager lacks where 3ph distribution is concerned is a sensible means of avoiding accidental shorting of phases. I have no issue with working on Hager boards and would be happy to spec one, but we aren't exactly talking state of the art and I fail to understand why the brand attracts considerable praise. Consider how long ago Square D overcame the issue and, despite your reservations, the IKQ range continues to be widely used under the Schneider banner. Other manufacturers have managed to avoid exposed 3ph busbars in different ways and I'm not sure that plastic push on covers warrants the 'premium brand' status afforded to Hager.

 

[davesparks]

Don't do much 3ph but do have a couple coming up and it's hard to look past Hager - have a dim view of the electrium stuff and mem and schneider escalate the price - what is it they're lacking out of interest?

I only use Schneider Acti9 boards as in my opinion they are worth the money.
Some of the advantages include the isobar system, plug in RCBOs so there are no messy neutral or earth flyleads, the distributed neutral kit allows any normal way to be converted to a neutral, backwards compatibility.
Plus the comprehensive range of auxillary devices, aux contacts, shunt and UV trips, vigi units to make a TP RCBO etc etc.

For me Hager simply don't offer what I need.

 

[Teddy Lop]

Looking around I see there has indeed been a significant reduction in pricing of Hager protective devices. It's not very long ago that Hager didn't offer a single module SP+N RCBO - something which 'budget' brands had offered for several years prior and which Crabtree (an electrium brand of which you take a dim view, without any explanation as to why) had offered for quite a few years before that - and when they did introduce the option it was accompanied by a considerable price tag.

I'm not sure what exactly constitutes a 'budget brand' other than lower prices. I can think of a few low priced brands producing very good exclosures with flush mounting options and all other features expected of a domestic board. Am I missing something here or is there something about all 'budget brands' for which they should be overlooked?

What Hager lacks where 3ph distribution is concerned is a sensible means of avoiding accidental shorting of phases. I have no issue with working on Hager boards and would be happy to spec one, but we aren't exactly talking state of the art and I fail to understand why the brand attracts considerable praise. Consider how long ago Square D overcame the issue and, despite your reservations, the IKQ range continues to be widely used under the Schneider banner. Other manufacturers have managed to avoid exposed 3ph busbars in different ways and I'm not sure that plastic push on covers warrants the 'premium brand' status afforded to Hager.

I've been fitting Hagar inc. SP RCBOs for at least 10 years and I'm fairly hard nosed when it comes to pricing so that differs from my experience... Although I did cheat and fit a number of Schneider boards for a bit for reasons I can't recall so that could well have been price related

Also I didn't offer an opinion on the merits of "budget" brands - I referenced them as being all I saw cheaper in response to the claim Hagar was overpriced. Hager seems priced on par with other established brands, while seeming better quality. I'm no fanboy, have fitted most things, and would swap in a mo if the price/quality/forward dependability threshold changes. I'm not that impressed one has to turn to the french for the current best trade off point but ho-hum.

As for the 3ph busbar issue - yes it's horrible opening a panel and having 400v prongs staring back at you - but conversely I've always liked (long before those who write the rules cottoned on) to do a final tight check on every terminal before I pop the cover on, something not that convenient if you have to power down a circuit to access the busbar feed...

 

[nicebutdim]

I'm a bit tired and also don't feel it's worth arguing the ---- about different brands as I've made my points, but in response to your final paragraph I'd raise you Schneider IKQ for versatility and convenience. While I rate this particular range of 3ph boards, I've never been impressed by their single phase offering - preferring Crabtree's Starbreaker where budget permits - but @davesparks has made a good case for revisiting their range.

 

[Teddy Lop]

I'm not arguing, I want to understand why some arrive at different conclusions to myself and some amount of disagreement is inherent; there's no reason why we can't agree to disagree on what are ultimately nuances while still respecting anothers knowledge though. (That goes for a lot in the world)

Id say it's a couple of your own comments that have had an unnecessary combative edge to them.