Gender Neutral Confusion..............

[telectrix]

personally i think it's all a load of Bollox ( or lack of ). who will know?

 

[SparkyChick]

I've thought long and hard about posting this, but since so far it's all men who have commented, I'll throw in this chick's view on the matter and I'm sure I'm going to cop some flack for it because for this particular subject I am completely anti.

For starters, the way to avoid any possible problems (and I think putting this on a CV as opposed to ones biological sex indicates it is an issue for this individual which means at some point in the future it could become an issue for you) is to simply dismiss the CV and file it under B.1.N. I would. I won't even entertain the idea of employing someone for whom this fad is important regardless of qualifications. The legal protection being afforded these individuals is growing and thus it is opening a whole new way in which you could get screwed over as an employer. I certainly wouldn't enquire about it at interview as if they are then unsuccessful, it could be used as leverage against you.

I whole heartedly agree with @Rpa07 and @Vortigern .

There is no doubt this is a trend, nothing more. If you look back on it, it's quite clear it started on the internet (no surprise there, most likely on Tumblr - a site which appears to have great influence over the kids of today), but these days it's being pushed by main stream media, schools and universities and is gaining serious legal traction in various countries. We've already had guidance here telling NHS maternity staff not to refer to expectant mothers as MOTHERS... FFS. Have womb, get pregnant, give birth, are mother... period!

There is no biological basis for it as about 99.7% (or something of that magnitude) of human beings fall into the sex binary of male or female, and for the most part male = penis, female = vagina. The people who don't comply with that are transgendered or intersex (both of which are medical conditions, the sufferers of which deserve our compassion and understanding). But there in lies one of the key issues. The people using this are confusing biological sex with gender identity/personality and seem to be pushing back against being pigeon holed by their sex, which of course isn't an issue these days... being female doesn't mean you stay at home dropping sprogs playing housewife to your hubby (thank god!), but that fact appears lost on a lot of these people.

As I see it there are a few potential reasons why someone may choose to label themselves in this way. 1) Victim status - Labelling yourself as non-binary, is increasingly granting you protection under legislation designed to protect the truly transgendered individuals. Label yourself as non-binary and you can suddenly blame anyone but yourself for things that have gone wrong in your life (not being hired, being fired, making bad decisions). 2) Feeling special - Go look at the on-line profiles of some of these clowns... this is the only thing some of them have to say about themselves... how sad and shallow. 3) Self Acceptance - Remember this started in America, a deeply religious country with some way out there values and pressures regarding gender roles etc. I think it may be a way for kids who don't conform to excuse their lack of conformity. Now I think that's the wrong way to handle it, what should happen is parents should be telling their kids it's OK to be you, but I suspect that doesn't happen.

And to add to the confusion, this also ties up to the transspecies movement and other such BS. For those unfamiliar with that term... today I'm a cat (curiosity is my name as I'm doing an EICR on a small office building), yesterday I was a fish (gliding through my repair jobs like a fish glides through water). Sound stupid? It's a thing!

I've seen conversations start with openings like this "Hi I'm Mike, I identify as moonkin. I'm non-binary and my preferred pronouns are she and her". Is that how you want to be opening conversations? Some parts of the states have legislation that requires you to use Mikes pronouns... even though Mike is 6'4" 21st with a huge great bushy beard. She? Is that the kind of craziness you want?

And lets be clear about this... the agenda at the moment is for gender neutral everything. These labels are self defined, so anyone at any time could say "Hey, I'm female" and waltz into the girls bathrooms in public spaces. Anyone with a young daughter... is that what you want? People being able to self define as something with no medical diagnosis, something which grants them access to somewhere they wouldn't ordinarily be allowed to go. I certainly don't want that.

The funniest thing about this is that they often make statements about how the doctor abused them when they were born by assigning their gender by looking between their legs. As I said above, biological sex... penis = man, vagina = woman. They claim it's abuse because it's dictating their role in society. Thankfully we live in enlightened times... it doesn't matter male/female you can pretty much be and do anything you like, you're in control of what becomes of your life, what's between your legs has very little impact these days.

It should not be pushed as an agenda by the main stream media, it should not be taught in schools (growing up is confusing enough as it is, so lets kids be kids and don't add to their questioning) and it should not be afforded the same legal protection as being transgendered.

And that's my little rant on the subject. I'm sure some of you will think I'm a hate filled witch. Not hate, I'm just tired of society being dismantled piece by piece and this is another example of it. Years ago, you were male/female and straight/gay/bi. 6 possibilities. Why do we need more than that? Anything else is character/personality and should not be labelled because it's usually unique to the individual and should not grant any form of protection/legal status.

 

[Midwest]

I've thought long and hard about posting this, but since so far it's all men who have commented, I'll throw in this chick's view on the matter and I'm sure I'm going to cop some flack for it because for this particular subject I am completely anti.

For starters, the way to avoid any possible problems (and I think putting this on a CV as opposed to ones biological sex indicates it is an issue for this individual which means at some point in the future it could become an issue for you) is to simply dismiss the CV and file it under B.1.N. I would. I won't even entertain the idea of employing someone for whom this fad is important regardless of qualifications. The legal protection being afforded these individuals is growing and thus it is opening a whole new way in which you could get screwed over as an employer. I certainly wouldn't enquire about it at interview as if they are then unsuccessful, it could be used as leverage against you.

I whole heartedly agree with @Rpa07 and @Vortigern .

There is no doubt this is a trend, nothing more. If you look back on it, it's quite clear it started on the internet (no surprise there, most likely on Tumblr - a site which appears to have great influence over the kids of today), but these days it's being pushed by main stream media, schools and universities and is gaining serious legal traction in various countries. We've already had guidance here telling NHS maternity staff not to refer to expectant mothers as MOTHERS... FFS. Have womb, get pregnant, give birth, are mother... period!

There is no biological basis for it as about 99.7% (or something of that magnitude) of human beings fall into the sex binary of male or female, and for the most part male = penis, female = vagina. The people who don't comply with that are transgendered or intersex (both of which are medical conditions, the sufferers of which deserve our compassion and understanding). But there in lies one of the key issues. The people using this are confusing biological sex with gender identity/personality and seem to be pushing back against being pigeon holed by their sex, which of course isn't an issue these days... being female doesn't mean you stay at home dropping sprogs playing housewife to your hubby (thank god!), but that fact appears lost on a lot of these people.

As I see it there are a few potential reasons why someone may choose to label themselves in this way. 1) Victim status - Labelling yourself as non-binary, is increasingly granting you protection under legislation designed to protect the truly transgendered individuals. Label yourself as non-binary and you can suddenly blame anyone but yourself for things that have gone wrong in your life (not being hired, being fired, making bad decisions). 2) Feeling special - Go look at the on-line profiles of some of these clowns... this is the only thing some of them have to say about themselves... how sad and shallow. 3) Self Acceptance - Remember this started in America, a deeply religious country with some way out there values and pressures regarding gender roles etc. I think it may be a way for kids who don't conform to excuse their lack of conformity. Now I think that's the wrong way to handle it, what should happen is parents should be telling their kids it's OK to be you, but I suspect that doesn't happen.

And to add to the confusion, this also ties up to the transspecies movement and other such BS. For those unfamiliar with that term... today I'm a cat (curiosity is my name as I'm doing an EICR on a small office building), yesterday I was a fish (gliding through my repair jobs like a fish glides through water). Sound stupid? It's a thing!

I've seen conversations start with openings like this "Hi I'm Mike, I identify as moonkin. I'm non-binary and my preferred pronouns are she and her". Is that how you want to be opening conversations? Some parts of the states have legislation that requires you to use Mikes pronouns... even though Mike is 6'4" 21st with a huge great bushy beard. She? Is that the kind of craziness you want?

And lets be clear about this... the agenda at the moment is for gender neutral everything. These labels are self defined, so anyone at any time could say "Hey, I'm female" and waltz into the girls bathrooms in public spaces. Anyone with a young daughter... is that what you want? People being able to self define as something with no medical diagnosis, something which grants them access to somewhere they wouldn't ordinarily be allowed to go. I certainly don't want that.

The funniest thing about this is that they often make statements about how the doctor abused them when they were born by assigning their gender by looking between their legs. As I said above, biological sex... penis = man, vagina = woman. They claim it's abuse because it's dictating their role in society. Thankfully we live in enlightened times... it doesn't matter male/female you can pretty much be and do anything you like, you're in control of what becomes of your life, what's between your legs has very little impact these days.

It should not be pushed as an agenda by the main stream media, it should not be taught in schools (growing up is confusing enough as it is, so lets kids be kids and don't add to their questioning) and it should not be afforded the same legal protection as being transgendered.

And that's my little rant on the subject. I'm sure some of you will think I'm a hate filled witch. Not hate, I'm just tired of society being dismantled piece by piece and this is another example of it. Years ago, you were male/female and straight/gay/bi. 6 possibilities. Why do we need more than that? Anything else is character/personality and should not be labelled because it's usually unique to the individual and should not grant any form of protection/legal status.

Better than Vortigern, got as far as thought. Only joking

 

[Leader]

SC I agree with some of what you say, do some people take things too far and use their identity as some kind of victims status? Yes, most definitely. Whether they be gay, black, whatever - I have encountered people like this. Should we assume therefore that all gay people are like this? No. I believe in giving people the benefit of the doubt rather that judging them before I've even met them. And that, I think, is the crux of the matter. Judge everyone on their own merit.

 

[Midwest]

The human mind is a complex thing. Who can say this persons feelings about themselves, has been influenced by society/media. It just could be the way they feel, who are we to say otherwise. The way we conceive things changes over time, we evolve.

Just over 60 years ago a guy committed suicide after being found guilty of gross indecency in private. Homosexuality was decriminalised some ten years later in the UK, in 1967. Societies attitudes towards homosexuality have change completely in recent years, which was seen as an illness, that could be cured. What should are attitudes to gender neutral peoples be like?

The guy in question, was Alan Turing, attributed with saving millions of lives in WWII and shortening the war. Yet he's sentence for his 'crime' was chemical castration, as 'treatment' for his illness.

Hope you get past 'The' Vortigern & Sparkychick

 

[telectrix]

agree 100% with Sparkychick. Alan Turin is not relevant. he was homosexual, which is an actual "condition", and recognised as such. being nether male ot female ( except in extremely rare cases of hermaphrodites) is not possible.
As for employing such a person as in the OP, which staff toilets wolt it use, or would you have to build a gender neutral set of bogs for it?

 

[The Ghost]

Hope you get past 'The' Vortigern & Sparkychick

Oh oh better add @telectrix to that list

 

[telectrix]

 

[The Ghost]

Why so glum @telectrix its a badge of honour to have common sense.

 

[telectrix]

glum for coz. i didn't know what he was referring to. DOH.