Discuss What is causing burning and vibration and how to stop it? in the UK Electrical Forum area at ElectriciansForums.net

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I am renting a room and at night, the floor gets searing hot (or feels that way) in places. I have noticed that this is where the ceiling light cabling runs on the lower floor. Similarly, where the ceiling light cabline runs on my ceiling, heat belts down. This happens whether the lights are on or not.

I have noticed that this tends to happen when the outside motion detecting light is triggered.

Also a burning sensation seems to emanate from appliances whether they are switched on or not. My kettle's cable gets red hot after I have boiled water.

I have only been in this abode for 3 weeks, and none of my appliances have behaved this way before.

I'm thinking that somehow there is a surge of electricity into the cabling.

Please humour me and don't tell me that it isn't happening. :) Instead, can someone tell me how it is possible to cause this to happen?

Also, at night, there is a nasty vibration coming from the ceiling above the window and also from the floor diagonally opposite. By morning, the vibration is so bad that the entire room is vibrating.

All the while, there is an irritating high-pitched hiss that might be due to wifi or RF.

Please can someone tell me what causes these things and most importantly, what I can do to stop it from happening.

Because I am in rented accommodation, I have no control over the kitchen, the fuse box, the boilers or the wifi.

Many thanks.
 
get your landlord inolved into his issue. he is responsible for youyr safety and the safe working of electrics, gas. etc.
 
Have you asked your doctor?
back reading your other posts, I think it would be a good place to start, in case you are hyper sensitive to some of the normal fields around the house.
 
I've just realised you say you have only been in this property for 3 weeks. But yet 2 years ago you were having similar problems in a different location. This means it is highly unlikely to be related to the property.

As above, I would seek medical advice rather than electrical.
 
Have you asked your doctor?
back reading your other posts, I think it would be a good place to start, in case you are hyper sensitive to some of the normal fields around the house.


Would you ask your doctor about red hot kettle cabling, or would you ask an electrician?

I'm sure you must know, if you're an electrician, that there's a British Standard (7161, if I recall correctly) that prohibits the installation of electrical wiring alongside plumbing pipes because the former can cause the latter to electromagnetise, so forming electromagnetic fields. This is particularly so if the pipes are insufficiently grounded. Well, my previous abode had just that - lousy plumbing and dodgy wiring and the result was a nasty field formation.

I wonder if you think that might also be something a doctor should consider.

Quite frankly, I had hoped that there might at least be some intellectual curiosity and some relish at problem-solving as to the cause of these problems and solutions to them. But alas, not a bit of it.

Just look at the world today, compared to the world when houses were built in the 1970s - 50 years ago. Today, we are surrounded by wifi in multiple devices and from our neighbors. Everything is electric/electronic. Motion detectors are everywhere (and they emit pulsed radiation in the form of microwave, infrared, etc.) The sheer number of electrosmog-emitting devices and industries should at least cause some concern.

Here's another titbit light can electromagnetise. EMFs which criss-cross with different polar orientations can cause vibration. Electronic items these days oftentimes don't even have an earth pin. Overhead electrical cables have proliferated. Electric energy escapes from cabling and from terminals, (because terminals have non-insulated wires). Stud wall detectors can detect live wires. How could they do that if no current escaped.

These are just a handful of many items that should be considered.

Yes, I might well be electromagnetically hypersensitive, but if I am, then I am the canary in the coalmine, because radiation is cumulative.

Gov.uk says that electromagnetic hypersensitivity is rare, but then that article was written at least 5 years ago, which is when I first read it. Since then, electronic andfrequency-emitting devices andindustries have proliferated.

How can an electrician not be concerned?

An electrician I hired some months ago wore electrostatic protection during the day andused a grounding sheet at night for that very reason. He advised me to do the same.
 
To start ruling out things... which part of your kettle lead gets "red hot"? plug end or just the entire thing? is the socket hot as well?

I've seen that before and it's caused by janky wiring, bad splices, rusty contacts...

The floor getting hot is an odd one but if it's wooden there could be junction boxes below and that's getting hot, as far as we know it could be a leak going on there but neither the MCB or RCB are detecting it. Voltage might be too high or there could be a phase tapped to neutral in the distribution board.

The room vibrating, look... I'm no expert but that's bad, like, really bad. Is there a factory, industrial warehouse or truck depot right next to your building? vibrations could be caused by nearby machinery.
 
I ask again, where in the U.K. are you?

some of the phrases you have used in the above post remind me of some really misleading sales literature for special products that were said to protect against a whole host of nasty effects from all things electrical.

there is a big industry that is dedicated to playing on peoples fears, amplifying them and using very misleading half truths about electricity, field generation, radiation, etc. Finally they will point you towards some products that appear to be independent of the “research / advice article “
the products are almost always being sold by someone connected to the ”advice” article, they have little to no scientific merit and are usually not marked with any of the usual standards to show safety or compliance with product safety regulations.

do you have a current EICR for the property?
if so can you post a copy here with the personal details removed?
 
Are there any hot water/heating pipes under the floor? These could cause the floor to get hot in certain areas and if there was an air lock also possibly cause vibration.
 
If you think the floor is getting hot beg, borrow or buy a thermal camera or failing that an infra red thermometer .there are many items you have mentioned in your post today that are either not true or taken out of context and or misleading.

i have seen other stating the same things on social media and i wonder where you are getting your information from?
 
Would you ask your doctor about red hot kettle cabling, or would you ask an electrician?

I'm sure you must know, if you're an electrician, that there's a British Standard (7161, if I recall correctly) that prohibits the installation of electrical wiring alongside plumbing pipes because the former can cause the latter to electromagnetise, so forming electromagnetic fields. This is particularly so if the pipes are insufficiently grounded. Well, my previous abode had just that - lousy plumbing and dodgy wiring and the result was a nasty field formation.

I wonder if you think that might also be something a doctor should consider.

Quite frankly, I had hoped that there might at least be some intellectual curiosity and some relish at problem-solving as to the cause of these problems and solutions to them. But alas, not a bit of it.

Just look at the world today, compared to the world when houses were built in the 1970s - 50 years ago. Today, we are surrounded by wifi in multiple devices and from our neighbors. Everything is electric/electronic. Motion detectors are everywhere (and they emit pulsed radiation in the form of microwave, infrared, etc.) The sheer number of electrosmog-emitting devices and industries should at least cause some concern.

Here's another titbit light can electromagnetise. EMFs which criss-cross with different polar orientations can cause vibration. Electronic items these days oftentimes don't even have an earth pin. Overhead electrical cables have proliferated. Electric energy escapes from cabling and from terminals, (because terminals have non-insulated wires). Stud wall detectors can detect live wires. How could they do that if no current escaped.

These are just a handful of many items that should be considered.

Yes, I might well be electromagnetically hypersensitive, but if I am, then I am the canary in the coalmine, because radiation is cumulative.

Gov.uk says that electromagnetic hypersensitivity is rare, but then that article was written at least 5 years ago, which is when I first read it. Since then, electronic andfrequency-emitting devices andindustries have proliferated.

How can an electrician not be concerned?

An electrician I hired some months ago wore electrostatic protection during the day andused a grounding sheet at night for that very reason. He advised me to do the same.

Some of the facts you state in this post are flawed. You also get confused between electromagnetic and electrostatic fields.

It's not that people aren't interested or concerned, it's probably the fact that you don't answer questions readily, and you don't reveal the full story.

We do know about the BS 7671 wiring regs yes. We also know the reason for gas pipes being bonded (not earthed), and it is not for the reason you state.

I suspect you are getting a lot of your information from non reputable sources.
 
Would you ask your doctor about red hot kettle cabling, or would you ask an electrician?

It would depend on whether I was the only person who thought the cable was hot. During normal operation kettle leads and plugs can warm up... this is perfectly normal. They can also get really hot (usually the fitted plug end that plugs in to the wall) due to poor connections either between the pin and the contacts in the socket or the contacts of the integrated fuseholder. This is usually a death spiral as when they get hot they are more likely to oxidise, which means the contact will get worse meaning it will get hotter under load, more oxidisation, gets hotter etc. etc. until it fails or becomes unsafe due to melted plastic.

If I was the only person who felt the cable was red hot whilst everyone else didn't feel it I would be questioning my own view of the world and considering options where a doctor is perhaps more qualified to assist than a spark.

There is also a certain amount of psychology at work with such suggestions. I have recently had cause to feel the meter tails and service head at a clients property whilst investigating severe voltage fluctuations. He and I were both convinced that one of the tails was hotter than the other but the evidence collected by our DNO over the last few weeks suggest there is actually a fault in the cable/cable join in the road. Yet, we were both convinced, due to a perceived difference in temperature, that there was a loose connection in the service head. I've also felt an appliance cord at home at a place that looked to be slightly discoloured and it did feel like it was warmer than elsewhere... a quick wipe with the cloth however and the discolouration disappeared and, despite the appliance being in regular use, it has not returned... so did it actually feel warmer than elsewhere or was my concern about a possible cable fault tainting my sub-conscious and making me believe it felt warmer there?

I'm sure you must know, if you're an electrician, that there's a British Standard (7161, if I recall correctly) that prohibits the installation of electrical wiring alongside plumbing pipes because the former can cause the latter to electromagnetise, so forming electromagnetic fields. This is particularly so if the pipes are insufficiently grounded. Well, my previous abode had just that - lousy plumbing and dodgy wiring and the result was a nasty field formation.

The actual magnetic field generated by typical twin and earth cables as used in most domestic installations is relatively small because the cable consists of two primary conductors (the line and the neutral). In operation because the current is typically equal in both conductors, but in opposite directions, the magnetic fields generated by one conductor will be largely cancelled out by the magnetic field of the other.

We tend not to run cables in close proximity to heating pipes because of the radiant heating effect of hot water running through the pipes... this will heat the cables and result in them having a reduced current carrying capacity. Extended periods of heat may also degrade the insulation resulting in premature ageing (crispy cable syndrome). Having had a quick read of what I believe is the relevant section (528.3), there is no mention about electromagnetic effects from the cables affecting the pipework, it's more a case of making sure the cables are not subjected to (to use their term) 'deleterious' effects caused by the pipework (such as heat, condensation etc.).

Quite frankly, I had hoped that there might at least be some intellectual curiosity and some relish at problem-solving as to the cause of these problems and solutions to them. But alas, not a bit of it.

Nope, I have no interest in wasting my time trying to find explanations for things I have never experienced and am unlikely to ever experience because I don't believe they are an issue.

Just look at the world today, compared to the world when houses were built in the 1970s - 50 years ago. Today, we are surrounded by wifi in multiple devices and from our neighbors. Everything is electric/electronic. Motion detectors are everywhere (and they emit pulsed radiation in the form of microwave, infrared, etc.) The sheer number of electrosmog-emitting devices and industries should at least cause some concern.

Most domestic movement detectors emit nothing. They work by monitoring patterns of infrared light reflected from the environment by the various items within their view. Yes there are some microwave based movement detectors but in my experience they are rare in domestic situations.

Here's another titbit light can electromagnetise. EMFs which criss-cross with different polar orientations can cause vibration. Electronic items these days oftentimes don't even have an earth pin. Overhead electrical cables have proliferated. Electric energy escapes from cabling and from terminals, (because terminals have non-insulated wires). Stud wall detectors can detect live wires. How could they do that if no current escaped.

Electricity does not 'escape' from uninsulated terminals. It can, but this would imply much larger voltages capable of ionising the air around them to form a path to earth. This requires many thousands of volts, certainly not something that would be happening in the back of your light switch or socket outlet. You can often see and hear this occurring on overhead lines where the voltages (upwards of 11,000 volts) are such that the air between the conductor and the metalwork of the support structure (which is typically earthed) can ionise causing tiny blue arcs and the associated fizzling and crackling.

Stud detectors do indeed detect live wires... using the tiny magnetic fields they generate (see above as to why these fields are typically small). The small fields are the reason they can't detect live cables over great distance.

Yes, I might well be electromagnetically hypersensitive, but if I am, then I am the canary in the coalmine, because radiation is cumulative.

Ionising radiation is cumulative... electromagnetic radiation is typically not ionising, yes you can generate x-rays and gamma rays using electricity, but this is unlikely to be happening in your home.

How can an electrician not be concerned?

Because we understand that there is little in the way of conclusive, peer reviewed, evidence to support what you believe to be the case. I know this to be the case because I've specifically gone looking and all I could find was as James suggested... articles written by people you've never heard of, often linked to sites selling products of dubious efficacy that claim to help you find and block these fields... they are there for one purpose and one purpose only... to suck people in and part them from their money.

An electrician I hired some months ago wore electrostatic protection during the day andused a grounding sheet at night for that very reason. He advised me to do the same.

If you hired him to investigate what you believe is happening, did he specialise in such activities? Did you find him online because of this speciality? If so, I would suggest he is not an electrician but a charlatan who's aim is to amplify your fears with silly claims on the basis that you may end up purchasing products and services from websites he may recommend to you.

So, when was the first time you encountered this sort of thing in your home? What was going on at the time? Had you read about it before you experienced it? I presume you were in the same property for a while before you started believing these things... so what changed? Why had you not experienced them before that? Why had you never experienced any of this prior to that? Has anyone else in the house experienced any of it? Physical things such as heat and vibration will be present for everyone, so I would expect more than just you to feel them. If no one else has, then perhaps the suggestion about consulting a doctor isn't such a bad idea.
 
I am renting a room and at night, the floor gets searing hot (or feels that way) in places. I have noticed that this is where the ceiling light cabling runs on the lower floor. Similarly, where the ceiling light cabline runs on my ceiling, heat belts down. This happens whether the lights are on or not.

I have noticed that this tends to happen when the outside motion detecting light is triggered.

Also a burning sensation seems to emanate from appliances whether they are switched on or not. My kettle's cable gets red hot after I have boiled water.

I have only been in this abode for 3 weeks, and none of my appliances have behaved this way before.

I'm thinking that somehow there is a surge of electricity into the cabling.

Please humour me and don't tell me that it isn't happening. :) Instead, can someone tell me how it is possible to cause this to happen?

Also, at night, there is a nasty vibration coming from the ceiling above the window and also from the floor diagonally opposite. By morning, the vibration is so bad that the entire room is vibrating.

All the while, there is an irritating high-pitched hiss that might be due to wifi or RF.

Please can someone tell me what causes these things and most importantly, what I can do to stop it from happening.

Because I am in rented accommodation, I have no control over the kitchen, the fuse box, the boilers or the wifi.

Many thanks.

Op :I have only been in this abode for 3 weeks, and none of my appliances have behaved this way before.

Except it seems it happened at another place ?


Op: By morning, the vibration is so bad that the entire room is vibrating.

And no cracks or anything ? And I then assume it stops completely ?


Op: I'm thinking that somehow there is a surge of electricity into the cabling.

But no bulbs blown ? + a surge isn't very likely to cause a kettle cable to get hot.

Op: where the ceiling light cabline runs on my ceiling, heat belts down. This happens whether the lights are on or not.
Op: I have noticed that this tends to happen when the outside motion detecting light is triggered.
Which is it ? all the time or sometimes or not at all :)


So I assume you have been up in the attic to know this ? Cables hot enough for you to feel in a room below ?

So, is everything OK when you're not in this place, other places ? Outside is OK ? In a car, bus, OK ?
 
Last edited by a moderator:
My previous remark /post was deleted .... So what can i say that wont be deleted ? Its obvious there is a lot more going on here .Many have given a "recommendation " to see a Doctor etc etc . I fully agree . Ive met a few people who share similar "life issues" . One has well known parents and she is 100% on the ball with pulling their chain . They bought her a lovely house but she had melt downs as she claimed the Consumer board mounted in the room next to her bedroom was giving her the "vibes" . They asked me to assist and I gave her the "Copper shielding " with" super secret Squirrel earth bonding" sales pitch . The mother just wanted her off their back ..so said "what ever it costs " . I told the mother it would be 2 days work but would charge her for 1 hour and be doing NOTHING . The daughter came back to her home and said it was all "Magical and lovely" and moved onto the next thing to "cling to" .
 
How can an electrician not be concerned?
Reading your posts and taking a peek at your previous posts on this forum, I suspect that the the root cause for concern is not an electrical one. All your questions have been answered, and electrical concerns explained.

Unfortunately we are unable to help you out, and I suggest you are better off seeking advice from professionals who can help.
 

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