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boatnik1: Just noticed your from Belfast may I ask where you done your apprenticeship, and whats the work situation like for a spark in N. I at minute? I really want to get into the trade but just not sure if a apprenticeship is best route for me as I am a qualified electrical engineer working on 115v, 440v and various other systems, I currently do alot of fault finding on my gear and just dont see the point in going back down the route of being an apprentice and getting a crap wage and all the crap jobs when alot of the knowledge is in there?
 
hello to all at electriciansforums.net have been reading peoples posts now for about six weeks and thought it was very helpfull i am from the uk but moved over to ireland about five years ago and decided to do a electrical apprentership as have been in and out of this type of work for a long time and wanted to get the paper work to prove to myself that i should of done it a long time ago instead of putting it off
 
boatnik1: Just noticed your from Belfast may I ask where you done your apprenticeship, and whats the work situation like for a spark in N. I at minute? I really want to get into the trade but just not sure if a apprenticeship is best route for me as I am a qualified electrical engineer working on 115v, 440v and various other systems, I currently do alot of fault finding on my gear and just dont see the point in going back down the route of being an apprentice and getting a crap wage and all the crap jobs when alot of the knowledge is in there?

Hi Andyd55. Apprenticeship in H.J. Scott (Now Defunct) back in '61 to '66 so a long time back. Winding and repairing Transformers up to sub station size and Motors and Gen sets from fractional to 500HP. Then on to outside contracts, mostly commercial and some house bashing.
Glad to say I'm retired now, my last 18 years as a factory maintenance spark and engineer along with H&S duties. Been out of the game for 10 years now so not too sure how things are, but work seems to be falling off with the decline in house moves and newbuilds and factory closures. Now work is a hobby playing around with generators and selling off surplus gear.
 
my advise is:
although 2330 is good starting point for electrical theory a lot of it is of no use and the qualification on its own (although it is certainly the best route) has no real impact.
follow it up with 2382 and 2391, these 2 quals alone will get you into the industry, even just as a mate/labourer then with 12 months on job doin the donkey work you will be qualified and experienced. In the meantime use your garage to build circuits and test boards etc, although not ideal it will give you a good idea of wiring different circuits up....
Best of luck and if your stuck ask, a good electrician does not know everything but he knows when to check...

just as an afterthought, I am now leaving the industry, meter installation is gonna be as exiting as it gets for me from now on, but good bye crawling around lofts and under floors etc ... :)
 
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I totally agree with Boatnik1! These 6 week courses are undermining the tried and tested method of apprenticeships, if these 6 week courses were worth the paper they were wrote on, then they would have taken over as a method of training new electrical professionals, in which case; full 4 or 5 year apprenticeships would now be defunct!


boatnik1: Just noticed your from Belfast may I ask where you done your apprenticeship, and whats the work situation like for a spark in N. I at minute? I really want to get into the trade but just not sure if a apprenticeship is best route for me as I am a qualified electrical engineer working on 115v, 440v and various other systems, I currently do alot of fault finding on my gear and just dont see the point in going back down the route of being an apprentice and getting a crap wage and all the crap jobs when alot of the knowledge is in there?

andyd55: I dont think boatnik1 is aiming his previous posts at people like you, i assume hes aiming it towards people who arnt in the trade and who want to re-"train". im assuming you work in industry? and you have a BTEC ONC maybe even HNC/HND or maybe even a degree? this shows that you have put in the time and effort to learn the principles and techniques of working with electrical/electronic systems and have not been on a mickey mouse "skills" course

rant over ;)
 
and i agree with wot he said,
a lot of people already have knowledge and experience so a short course can help them get a qualification and entry into the trade prob is there a far too many guys with no knowledge at all doing these short courses and then going around calling themselves electricians with no idea what they are doing.
I know a guy who did a course joined a part p scheme is now working as an electrician and does not know a ohm from his ahole.....
 
Been out of the game for 10 years now so not too sure how things are, but work seems to be falling off with the decline in house moves and newbuilds and factory closures.

This is what I feared, hopefully will pick up again soonish!!

Sparky-Tom: I am in the industry yes, I have a fd degree think its equivalent to the old HND. Is the best route for someone like myself then to do one of these courses or is it more acceptable to do go through and try to do an apprenticeship (with my age against me? are they just for school leavers?) but fast tracking what work I have covered??

I know a guy who did a course joined a part p scheme is now working as an electrician and does not know a ohm from his ahole.....

:D:D:D:D:D:D:D
 
Sparky-Tom: I am in the industry yes, I have a fd degree think its equivalent to the old HND. Is the best route for someone like myself then to do one of these courses or is it more acceptable to do go through and try to do an apprenticeship (with my age against me? are they just for school leavers?) but fast tracking what work I have covered??

By my reconing, you shouldnt have to do one of these micky mouse 6 week courses or have to serve a full apprenticeship. Did you serve an apprenticeship or did you do it all in college/uni? Either way, you have already proven you are capable and that you are willing to put in the time, possibly 4 to 7 years depending on whether you did a HNC first?

Dont you feel that these 6 week "training" courses are undermining your hard work and effort over all them years?
 
SPARKY-TOM
andyd55: I dont think boatnik1 is aiming his previous posts at people like you, i assume hes aiming it towards people who arnt in the trade and who want to re-"train". im assuming you work in industry? and you have a BTEC ONC maybe even HNC/HND or maybe even a degree? this shows that you have put in the time and effort to learn the principles and techniques of working with electrical/electronic systems and have not been on a mickey mouse "skills" course

Correct on that. I just have the horrors when theory people enter the game. I had the misfortune to be stuck with two graduates sent over to me from HQ (ASW. S. Wales) for practical experience.
The female one was terrified of electricity and refused point blank to go near an open Dist. Board and the male who wouldnt use hand tools in case he hurt himself. Both of them refused to use a ladder as they felt no one should be working from a ladder and that proper scaffold should be used. Neither of them would assemble scaffold as that was some one else's job. They quoted H&S about everything and invented it where it didn't exist. It wasn't part of their job to chase brickwork or to clip cables, that was a labourers job.
Practical people and theory people do not mix.
 
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SPARKY-TOM


Correct on that. I just have the horrors when theory people enter the game. I had the misfortune to be stuck with two graduates sent over to me from HQ (ASW. S. Wales) for practical experience.
The female one was terrified of electricity and refused point blank to go near an open Dist. Board and the male who wouldnt use hand tools in case he hurt himself. Both of them refused to use a ladder as they felt no one should be working from a ladder and that proper scaffold should be used. Neither of them would assemble scaffold as that was some one else's job. They quoted H&S about everything and invented it where it didn't exist. It wasn't part of their job to chase brickwork or to clip cables, that was a labourers job.
Practical people and theory people do not mix.

In many cases you might be right but be careful not to tar everyone with the same brush :). I have an hons degree and two post grad qualifications, but have spent donkeys years doing practical plumbing and electrical jobs for myself. Finally decided that being a properly qualified electrician might help keep the wolf from the door in my retirement . Even with my experience though, i decided that a six week course was not appropriate for me, and so am doing the two year full time C&G 2330 and then doing the wiring regs and inspection and testing. Would like to think that if i do eventually undertake work for someone else that i will be sufficiently qualified and experienced to do a good job.:p;)
 
pushrod: I speak of those I know. Congrats on the Degree & Quals. You are clearly one of the practical breed who also excell in theory and wii fit in well as this is the combination achieved by most sparks. (No piont being able to swing a hammer if you don't know the effect)
Those of whom I speak are the theorists who with no practical experience yet feel they know the game wihtout having a clue about the practical nature of the job. Government offices are full of them. They write all the directives, rules and regs that are clearly the product of a University and not of practice. My brother in law is one of them and a more useless creature has not been put on this earth since the slug. His boss is equally dense as he sent the B i Law to Harvard in the States to study company law, at the tax payers expense, even though the US law has no relevance in the UK. Only when he returned did he realise that Harvard would not be tutoring in UK law. Isn't our Government wonderful.
 
I get the feeling if some people had their way wed soon be in a massive labour shortage across construction trades seeing ans the number of apprenticeships offered no where near meets labour market demand. Some people may do their courses and think they are king of the world but not everyone is the same, i dont know who people think they are to say that someone shouldnt be able to get out of a dead end career because they cant get apprenticeship training.
 

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