Am I being taken for a ride?

[surreygirl]

I had an electrician come to do a safety check at my property that I let out last week and he has recommended that remedial work should be done at a cost of 2,100 pounds, These are:-

Upgrade of eco 7db
Upgrade of 2 x circuits to RCD protection
Install of isolation point for underfloor heating
identification of points where required
Fusing of points
Enclosure of exposed wiring - these are wires that are not in trunking
Investigation of supply wiring and condition of main isolator and repair
Retermination of required points
cable enclosures

Nothing listed but the sub total is 1,750 plus VAT comes to 2,100

Is that a lot! I last had a test done five years ago, true the wire of the economy 7 is in a situation which is not assessable, however he wants to run a wire from it across the lounge and into the kitchen!

But the amount seems excessive and it is through the Agents who manage the property for me.

Any suggestions would be very helpful.

Many thanks Surreygirl

 

[Octopus]

Without seeing the property it's almost impossible to say.

Try and find another local spark and get their opinion.

 

[telectrix]

seems on the high side to me, but without being physically there, it's hard to tell the extent of the work required. my advice would be to get a second opinion; a local spark .w

 

[telectrix]

SNAP !

 

[Octopus]

Don't get electricians through estate agents either. They probably get a kick back.....

 

[SparkyChick]

Hi Surreygirl and welcome to the forums

It's very hard to tell from just what you've posted as the guys have already said. Do you have the EICR (the report) electronically? If so, could you send me a copy via a private message/conversation?

It would also help if you could post pictures of the items involved (I'm assuming he showed you the problems)?

But as a first shot...

Upgrade of eco 7db - What reason did he give for wanting to upgrade this? Just because it's old, it doesn't mean it is neccessarily unsafe for continued use.

Upgrade of 2 x circuits to RCD protection - Which circuits and what reason did he give? Again, if it's say the lighting circuits... just because they don't have RCD protection, doesn't mean they are not safe for continued use.

Install of isolation point for underfloor heating - If the underfloor heating is on it's own circuit within the consumer unit, it already has an isolation point.

identification of points where required - I'm guessing there are some circuits which are not identified in the fusebox/consumer unit?

Fusing of points - What does this mean?

Enclosure of exposed wiring - these are wires that are not in trunking - It is unlikely that this is needed to b e honest. If the cables insulation is not damaged and they are double insulated (the grey cables we mostly use are), then they don't need further enclosure generally. Post some pictures.

Investigation of supply wiring and condition of main isolator and repair - An investigation of the supply wiring... if he's talking about the cable before the main distributors fuse, all he has to do is comment. The cables between the service head (the main fuse) and the meter are not your responsibility, only the cables after the meter are your responsibility. But recording the condition of all of this is part of an EICR. Post some pictures of your meter cupboard.

Retermination of required points - What does he mean by this?

cable enclosures - Same as exposed wiring?


But as the guys have said, giving you a full answer is difficult from afar. Find a local spark from the forums and get a second opinion. I've done this for someone before, been given an EICR and worked through it figuring out which items actually needed attention and which were just padding to make money.

 

[Pete999]

Agree with Murdock get some more quotes, is the Sparks you have contacted a member of any of the CP Schemes NICEIC, NAPIT etc? Did the Sparks issue you with an EICR Certificate outlining all these issues you have mentioned? What does he mean by "fusing of points". There are several descriptions of work required, that either you have misunderstood or he is in my opinion trying it on with you, best advice get an EICR Electrical Installation Condition Report done, by a competent Electrician, don't know what the price of works are in your area but it should be around £200 to £300, sorry for the ramble but you didn't mention any certificates, make me wonder a bit.

 

[surreygirl]

Hi Surreygirl and welcome to the forums

It's very hard to tell from just what you've posted as the guys have already said. Do you have the EICR (the report) electronically? If so, could you send me a copy via a private message/conversation?

It would also help if you could post pictures of the items involved (I'm assuming he showed you the problems)?

But as a first shot...

Upgrade of eco 7db - What reason did he give for wanting to upgrade this? Just because it's old, it doesn't mean it is neccessarily unsafe for continued use.

Upgrade of 2 x circuits to RCD protection - Which circuits and what reason did he give? Again, if it's say the lighting circuits... just because they don't have RCD protection, doesn't mean they are not safe for continued use.

Install of isolation point for underfloor heating - If the underfloor heating is on it's own circuit within the consumer unit, it already has an isolation point.

identification of points where required - I'm guessing there are some circuits which are not identified in the fusebox/consumer unit?

Fusing of points - What does this mean?

Enclosure of exposed wiring - these are wires that are not in trunking - It is unlikely that this is needed to b e honest. If the cables insulation is not damaged and they are double insulated (the grey cables we mostly use are), then they don't need further enclosure generally. Post some pictures.

Investigation of supply wiring and condition of main isolator and repair - An investigation of the supply wiring... if he's talking about the cable before the main distributors fuse, all he has to do is comment. The cables between the service head (the main fuse) and the meter are not your responsibility, only the cables after the meter are your responsibility. But recording the condition of all of this is part of an EICR. Post some pictures of your meter cupboard.

Retermination of required points - What does he mean by this?

cable enclosures - Same as exposed wiring?


But as the guys have said, giving you a full answer is difficult from afar. Find a local spark from the forums and get a second opinion. I've done this for someone before, been given an EICR and worked through it figuring out which items actually needed attention and which were just padding to make money.

I agree he seems to want to do as much as possible.I have two safety checks and no one has mentioned a thing about what he has pointed out. The "exposed wiring" in in grey cable in the airing cupboard. It did have a board up against it to hide the wiring at one point but he wants to put trunking, however it is only a small job. Yes the underfloor heating has its own line to the main box and you can just turn it of. The main box is modern and was only put in 5 years ago.

He wants to bring in a cable from the economy 7 through the lounge to the main box in the kitchen. At the moment it has its own box in the lounge to turn it off or on completely. You know a switch box. He says that it must be old and as it runs behind a wall be cannot get at it but even so he wants to run it to the main switch board in the kitchen along the ceiling and wall.

Yes I agree workman coming from an Agent can be a bit dodgy as they are out for work. Also his web is not up to date and he doesn't show up on rated people.

I cannot upload any photographs or the report as I am only on a small note pad. I will try somewhere else though.

I have sent an email to him to say I want a second opinion and copied and pasted your questions. Obviously editing it.

Thank you for your help and all those who have posted with comments. I am most grateful

 

[SparkyChick]

As a side note... not showing up on Rated People, CheckATrade or any of the other trademan finding sites, doesn't mean they are dodgy.

I'm not listed on any of them, many of the guys aren't either.

From a tradesman point of view, they are just making money from us because we have to pay to purchase leads and such like, before we spend time and money providing quotes.

Without seeing the cables in the airing cupboard... I can think of no reason they need to be enclosed, but I have recommended on an EICR that additional protection be added to a cable in an airing cupboard... because it was pinned to the floor close to the door into the cupboard.

Again, without knowing his reasoning... if the underfloor heating is on it's own circuit, I can see no reason why additional isolation is required.

It will be interesting to see what he comes back with, and it will be good if you can post pictures and the report.

 

[Pete999]

As a side note... not showing up on Rated People, CheckATrade or any of the other trademan finding sites, doesn't mean they are dodgy.

I'm not listed on any of them, many of the guys aren't either.

From a tradesman point of view, they are just making money from us because we have to pay to purchase leads and such like, before we spend time and money providing quotes.

Without seeing the cables in the airing cupboard... I can think of no reason they need to be enclosed, but I have recommended on an EICR that additional protection be added to a cable in an airing cupboard... because it was pinned to the floor close to the door into the cupboard.

Again, without knowing his reasoning... if the underfloor heating is on it's own circuit, I can see no reason why additional isolation is required.

It will be interesting to see what he comes back with, and it will be good if you can post pictures and the report.

You read my mind SC

 

[surreygirl]

As a side note... not showing up on Rated People, CheckATrade or any of the other trademan finding sites, doesn't mean they are dodgy.

I'm not listed on any of them, many of the guys aren't either.

From a tradesman point of view, they are just making money from us because we have to pay to purchase leads and such like, before we spend time and money providing quotes.

Without seeing the cables in the airing cupboard... I can think of no reason they need to be enclosed, but I have recommended on an EICR that additional protection be added to a cable in an airing cupboard... because it was pinned to the floor close to the door into the cupboard.

Again, without knowing his reasoning... if the underfloor heating is on it's own circuit, I can see no reason why additional isolation is required.

It will be interesting to see what he comes back with, and it will be good if you can post pictures and the report.

Well they are just a few grey cables. It had a board up once, but no other electricians giving a safety report have mentioned it nor the up date to the economy seven and he seems to be fishing for work. But they were not from the Agents. Having said that his quote was a lot he then said he could update the kitchen lights for me!!

I will do my best to upload his report!

Thank you so much for your help. OK I appreciate not everyone is on rated people I didn't realise they charged!

 

[Octopus]

If you do up load the report please don't include your or the contractors details...

Edit: you won't find me on the sites you mention either ... I get about 80% of my work from referrals and recommendation.

 

[Pete999]

If you do up load the report please don't include your or the contractors details...

Good point Murdoch

 

[surreygirl]

If you do up load the report please don't include your or the contractors details...

Edit: you won't find me on the sites you mention either ... I get about 80% of my work from referrals and recommendation.

OK no I will not put his name on the upload

 

[surreygirl]

Agree with Murdock get some more quotes, is the Sparks you have contacted a member of any of the CP Schemes NICEIC, NAPIT etc? Did the Sparks issue you with an EIR Certificate outlining all these issues you have mentioned? What does he mean by "fusing of points". There are several descriptions of work required, that either you have misunderstood r he is in my opinion trying it on with you, best advice get an EICR Electrical Installation Condition Report done, by a competent Electrician, don't know what the price of works are in your area but it should be around £200 to £300, sorry for the ramble but you didn't mention any certificates, make me wonder a bit.

I typed in what exactly as he has written it. He did do a report he says this Absence of warning notices

Absence of RCD (411.5.2; 531.2 C3
Absence of RCD 421.4.9; 543.2 C3
Accessory damaged 421.1.3 c2
Inconsistent resistance values for ring circuits F1
Characteristic of supply do not conform to industry standards 612.3.2 F1
Insulated cable not taken inside the enclosure of an assessor 412 C2
Unsatisfactory electrical connection 526 C2
Unused entry holes allow access to live parts 416.1 C2

 

[surreygirl]

Absence of RCD (411.5.2; 531.2 C3
Absence of RCD 421.4.9; 543.2 C3
Accessory damaged 421.1.3 c2
Inconsistent resistance values for ring circuits F1
Characteristic of supply do not conform to industry standards 612.3.2 F1
Insulated cable not taken inside the enclosure of an assessor 412 C2

This what he has said in the report for a safety certificate

 

[surreygirl]

Absence of RCD (411.5.2; 531.2 C3
Absence of RCD 421.4.9; 543.2 C3
Accessory damaged 421.1.3 c2
Inconsistent resistance values for ring circuits F1
Characteristic of supply do not conform to industry standards 612.3.2 F1
Insulated cable not taken inside the enclosure of an assessor 412 C2

This what he has said in the report for a safety certificate

 

[Octopus]

Absence of RCD on what circuits?

 

[Phil Thompson]

Is he rewiring the ring final circuit for that price?
Is there a new consumer unit being fitted?

 

[westward10]

411.5.2 indicates a TT system and if this is the case I would think a C3 inappropriate.
421.4.9 is not a Regulation at all unless my eyes deceive me.
543.2 has nothing to do with rcds.
421.1.3 has little do do with damaged accessories.
612.3.2 makes no reference to characteristics of the supply.