Ever feel as though your being setup to fail.

[RDB85]

I’ve been in the Fire and Security Industry arounf 3 years now and have my qualifications. I was given an Install of a Panel change and Keypad and Speaker.

Now our so called supervisor of 30 years said it’s only half a day. Long story short it was a full day. Lots of issues, took a whole day and a cable being completely down on cores didn’t help.

So I know I’m not the quickest, but I do my best, alway leave the premises better than I found it and do thing to standards. Our manager then phoned and said we’ve lost money on that job. Now correct me if I’m wrong but that not all my fault. I just feel as though they set you up to fail. Plus the training is none existent, it’s basically get on with it and work it out.

Feedback welcome.

 

[oscar21]

Tell him to do the next one himself then. Seriously work for yourself as quickly as you cant, don't be a wage slave so someone else makes the big bucks and if the manager is an idiot nick their customers along the way as well.

 

[littlespark]

Happens all the time.

Manager doesnt know how long jobs take.... takes supervisors estimate. Job takes longer, its not your fault, its the supervisor for not pricing properly.

Its a ploy by management to get more work out of their staff by saying theyre too slow. You’re not too slow, your doing what needs to be done in a safe and sensible manner.


A lot of jobs are priced on software guidelines.

They say it takes x amount of time to fit, say, a socket... its an average, so some jobs will take longer, some quicker.

 

[nicebutdim]

I just feel as though they set you up to fail.

That's how life is from the moment we're born. Just have to keep your head down and keep moving forward.

 

[RDB85]

That's how life is from the moment we're born. Just have to keep your head down and keep moving forward.

Very true indeed.

 

[RDB85]

It’s just annoying as you feel as though you are being used as a scapegoat. All they say is we lost money on that job. You need to speed up or do things quicker.

End of the day someone is paying a professional to do a job. Good work is not cheap and cheap work is not good.

But you’ve never had to revisit the job or go back to it or have any issues reported when doing maintenance.

I just want to leave. It’s a bit difficult at the moment.

 

[nicebutdim]

Seems as though your idea of an acceptable job and what your employers price for are very different.

I've made a few facetious remarks about alarm installers on this forum, but those remarks were based in truth. The sad reality is that a lot of installations are horrendous and most likely this is due to the issues you're up against.

If you'd gone in and thrown stuff at walls, lashed cables from A to B and shown little regard for the standards you've been taught to work to, provided everything worked, your employer would probably have heaped praise upon you.

I'm sure there are some very professional installers out there, but most of the work I see (well known, national companies)m leaves much to be desired. If that's what you're up against, then you have some tough choices to make: become what I've described above, be prepared to continue taking flak or look elsewhere (perhaps even outside of alarm installation). You will get faster in the fullness of time, but it may be that it's impossible for anyone to achieve a decent standard of work and still meet your employers expectations with regard to time.

 

[MJPD29]

Seems as though your idea of an acceptable job and what your employers price for are very different.

I've made a few facetious remarks about alarm installers on this forum, but those remarks were based in truth. The sad reality is that a lot of installations are horrendous and most likely this is due to the issues you're up against.

If you'd gone in and thrown stuff at walls, lashed cables from A to B and shown little regard for the standards you've been taught to work to, provided everything worked, your employer would probably have heaped praise upon you.

I'm sure there are some very professional installers out there, but most of the work I see (well known, national companies)m leaves much to be desired. If that's what you're up against, then you have some tough choices to make: become what I've described above, be prepared to continue taking flak or look elsewhere (perhaps even outside of alarm installation). You will get faster in the fullness of time, but it may be that it's impossible for anyone to achieve a decent standard of work and still meet your employers expectations with regard to time.

The well known national alarm installers here are, in my experience, absolutely horrendous. Their rats nests of cables or as the crow flys cable routes are beyond belief and it amazes me they get away with it whilst still having such an arrogance about them.

On another note, the job takes what it takes. I don’t and won’t let anyone rush me. No one has a crystal ball and sometimes estimates of time etc from companies including ones I have worked for are laughable. There’s no point getting down about it, just deal with each issue a it comes and if it doesn’t work out there’s 100s of other jobs out there.

 

[RDB85]

I agree with that everyone is saying. Our place have the habit of thinking I should work to the same speed as someone with over 20 years experience.

Which I’ve had multiple arguments about as not everyone is the same or works the same and just because someone says it should take this long shouldn’t mean it’s set in stone. They don’t consider any factors that could alter as the job progresses. I think it’s a case of go in cheap get the job and then make up on the maintenance for any shortfalls in cost.

 

[nicebutdim]

I doubt you'll change their minds and, ultimately, it's up to the company's owners to determine how they run their business.

Better to ask yourself if you can accept their practices and plan accordingly.

 

[RDB85]

I doubt you'll change their minds and, ultimately, it's up to the company's owners to determine how they run their business.

Better to ask yourself if you can accept their practices and plan accordingly.

I probably won’t change their minds. As they aren’t open to suggestions. I do try and plan the jobs but when your given no real spec and a hopeless deadline, only so much can be done. Also pay is not even salary it’s NMW. Expecting an awful lot for min wage. Even an engineer when I mentioned it to him said it was unreasonable.

 

[westward10]

Was it your only job for the day.

 

[RDB85]

Was it your only job for the day.

No apparently they booked other jobs in. As the supervisor said it should take half a day after a brief but short visit.

 

[nicebutdim]

Some people fail to comprehend that their estimate of time, after taking a cursory glance at a job, may not be as accurate as they'd like to believe. Sometimes a job comes together and runs much more smoothly than planned, although the opposite is more often true. A sensible employer will understand this and be able to determine the difference between unforeseen challenges and slow work.

My assessment of the alarm industry still stands and the standard of work on display attests to this. There are exceptions, but most installers I meet seem to have settled into an easy life with a desire to do the bare minimum and treat every day like early retirement.

Moving out of this specialised area could significantly broaden your range of skills and also future work prospects. Any spark can move into alarm installation, and most would find it an easy life, but few alarm installers would last a crack if working in general electrical installation. You're young and hopefully have many years ahead of you - make the most of them.

 

[OnlQQker]

I just want to leave. It’s a bit difficult at the moment.

---

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Your thread is obvious that you give a dam about your work ethics, punctuality, standard of work, dress code, honor, etc etc.

I don't like companies, I was amongst one when I left school. They charge you out at 150 quid a day, and give you 12 quid a day back, and take tax from that, leaving you £54.07 a week. Whilst they got £695.93 a week for you.
This was back in the late 80's

You pick it up quickly, go for quality and not quantity and get hassled for not rushing about like a lunatic.

Until one day, you'll find a customer recognises this as well, and they'll ask for you to come back and do a job for them.

This is the point you start building your own customers, a database for your future customers, unless the company notices this as well and ups your pay.

The question is, do you want to to the job you're currently in, or are you having to do it because you feel trapped?

Is this the field you're happy in, or is there an underlaying passion that you'd like to do, but have convinced yourself you can't do it for however many various reasons?

 

[timhoward]

They charge you out at 150 quid a day, and give you 12 quid a day back, and take tax from that, leaving you £54.07 a week. Whilst they got £695.93 a week for you.

I was thinking about exactly this when I read something earlier in the thread. If they are paying MW and claiming they lost money if a job took a day instead of a morning then that is saying about £40-£50 plus employers NI tipped the balance. (assuming the OP is over 23 years old)
Surely the margins can't be that tight to run a company with staff, vans, premises, admin people etc.
I'd take the comment they lost money with a large pinch of salt. If they really did then it was a job they should have turned down in the first place!

 

[mainline]

I was thinking about exactly this when I read something earlier in the thread. If they are paying MW and claiming they lost money if a job took a day instead of a morning then that is saying about £40-£50 plus employers NI tipped the balance. (assuming the OP is over 23 years old)
Surely the margins can't be that tight to run a company with staff, vans, premises, admin people etc.
I'd take the comment they lost money with a large pinch of salt. If they really did then it was a job they should have turned down in the first place!

They probably mean they should have made £1000 and only made £800 so count it as a £200 loss.

 

[RDB85]

Regarding the if I’m happy doing the job. It’s okay and I prefer doing the CCTV side of it and wouldn’t mind moving into Home Automation. There isn’t many companies around Liverpool that do it as a service. It’s expensive and specialist. I do have my Level 2 and 3 2365 and only moved to Fire and Security as an Apprentice to get a start. I’m still looking to pursue the Electrical career. No one is willing to take on someone in their 30s with no Electrical experience.

 

[nicebutdim]

Regarding the if I’m happy doing the job. It’s okay and I prefer doing the CCTV side of it and wouldn’t mind moving into Home Automation. There isn’t many companies around Liverpool that do it as a service. It’s expensive and specialist. I do have my Level 2 and 3 2365 and only moved to Fire and Security as an Apprentice to get a start. I’m still looking to pursue the Electrical career. No one is willing to take on someone in their 30s with no Electrical experience.

They are and they do, although it's likely to be more difficult than at 16.

 

[MJPD29]

Regarding the if I’m happy doing the job. It’s okay and I prefer doing the CCTV side of it and wouldn’t mind moving into Home Automation. There isn’t many companies around Liverpool that do it as a service. It’s expensive and specialist. I do have my Level 2 and 3 2365 and only moved to Fire and Security as an Apprentice to get a start. I’m still looking to pursue the Electrical career. No one is willing to take on someone in their 30s with no Electrical experience.

If that is the case and you have identified a gap in the market in your local area, and can’t follow the path you want to (apprenticeship), then a domestic installer course with an eye on domestic home automation could be an option?