Fitting an Oven

leslie · Oct 23, 2012

I am having a new oven fitted, the new one is a single oven, that runs off a 13amp plug. The existing oven is hard wired into a cooker point which runs directly into the main fuse board .my question is can the existing cooker point be used to plug the new oven in, or is it best to do away with this completely , and extend the ring main and add a double plug socket.I do understand that the existing cooker cable is 6mm.
Regards

Taylortwocities · Oct 23, 2012

It depends on the makers instructions.
It is very likely that they REQUIRE the oven to be fused at 13amps (like the fuse in the plug).
If you cut the plug off and connect the oven direct to the cooker point then the fuse wil be whatever is in the consumer unit (32amp/40amp?).

So, if there is a fault in the cooker and it goes bang then also bang goes your warranty.

It would be best to take off the cooker connection plate on the wall and swop it for a 13amp single socket (unswitched would be best). Then plug your oven in.
PS turn the power off and carry out safe isolation routines before you get busy with a screwdriver.

Richard Burns · Oct 23, 2012

If the cooker point that you have is the isolator for a cooker and has a socket integrated with the switch then you could just plug the cooker into that socket (and make sure that the old cable from the switch to the cooker is disconnected).

Otherwise I agree with what TTC says; socket in place of CCU, not recommended to remove the plug.

Engineer54 · Oct 23, 2012

How many more times do we have to state on this forum ...the fuse within plug tops is for the protection of the supplied flexible cable, ...NOT the appliance!!! And NO the warranty of the appliance would not be void if a fault within the appliance goes bang!! These manufacturers supply the exact same appliances all over the world, and most such countries do NOT have fuses within the plug tops!! There is absolutely nothing stopping the OP from using a double connection plate fed from the cooker control unit to supply both cooking appliances.

All this crap about cutting a moulded plug of a cable voids the warranty is total bull, it is just a ploy by some of the so called warranty providers, to illegally fail to perform their duties under the manufacturers warranty terms. Any appliance connection to the utility supply conforming to BS7671 by a competent person/electrician cannot be deemed as misuse or alteration to void a warranty, ...End Of!!!

Taylortwocities · Oct 23, 2012

Ouch!
We have a difference of opinion. Its true that a fuse is there to protect the cable. Also some manufacturers WILL specify the fuse for their appliance. That's why, at the start of my response, I said

It depends on the makers instructions

SO, I don't have the MI's, so I've covered the base.

Just to cover the other point from the OP

leslie said:
is it best to do away with this completely , and extend the ring main and add a double plug socket.

Do not do this. Firstly, ring final circuits are not designed for long-term loads like a 3KW oven. The recommendation from BS7671 is that it is not good practise for loads of more than 2KW to be connected to a ring final circuit.

So, use that cooker circuit, that's what it is for - and follow the MI's !

Engineer54 · Oct 23, 2012

We have a difference of opinion. Its true that a fuse is there to protect the cable. Also some manufacturers WILL specify the fuse for their appliance. That's why, at the start of my response

If an appliance requires a fuse for it's protection, (ie PC circuit boards etc) then the manufacture will include that fuse or cut-out devise within the appliance. Plug top HRC fuses do not comply for appliance protection purposes, they are there purely to protect the appliance cord, and sized according to the CSA of the conductors of the flexible cable provided...

sparks1973 · Oct 23, 2012

Engineer54 said:
If an appliance requires a fuse for it's protection, (ie PC circuit boards etc) then the manufacture will include that fuse or cut-out devise within the appliance. Plug top HRC fuses do not comply for appliance protection purposes, they are there purely to protect the appliance cord, and sized according to the CSA of the conductors of the flexible cable provided...

yes...hense fast-acting fuses placed within certain appliances...

Lucas · Oct 23, 2012

Cut hold of the 6mm that goes into the oven, cut it off, put a single socket there and plug the oven into it

Engineer54 · Oct 24, 2012

Lucas said:
Cut hold of the 6mm that goes into the oven, cut it off, put a single socket there and plug the oven into it

Brilliant, so where's he now going to connect electric his hob too then??

MDJ · Oct 24, 2012

LOL, just buy a double connection unit which can still be switched from the cooker switch above the worktop and connect both the oven and hob into it, if your really worried about cutting the plug connect a single socket to the double connection unit along side the hob cable and fit it somewhere accessable.

AndyL · Oct 24, 2012

Engineer54 said:
How many more times do we have to state on this forum ...the fuse within plug tops is for the protection of the supplied flexible cable, ...NOT the appliance!!! And NO the warranty of the appliance would not be void if a fault within the appliance goes bang!! These manufacturers supply the exact same appliances all over the world, and most such countries do NOT have fuses within the plug tops!! There is absolutely nothing stopping the OP from using a double connection plate fed from the cooker control unit to supply both cooking appliances.

All this crap about cutting a moulded plug of a cable voids the warranty is total bull, it is just a ploy by some of the so called warranty providers, to illegally fail to perform their duties under the manufacturers warranty terms. Any appliance connection to the utility supply conforming to BS7671 by a competent person/electrician cannot be deemed as misuse or alteration to void a warranty, ...End Of!!!

Does this not contradict itself, if you remove the plug top how is the supplied flexible cable now protected?

Engineer54 · Oct 24, 2012

AndyL said:
Does this not contradict itself, if you remove the plug top how is the supplied flexible cable now protected?

The same way, as in all the other countries that DON'T have fused plug tops !!! An oven cannot be subject to overloading, only short circuit, to which the correctly sized protecting MCB/HRC fuse is more than capable of clearing!!!

Taylortwocities · Oct 24, 2012

Engineer54 said:
Brilliant, so where's he now going to connect electric his hob too then??

So, where did Leslie (or anybody, on this thread) mention anything about a hob?

clematis432 · Oct 24, 2012

Taylortwocities said:
So, where did Leslie (or anybody, on this thread) mention anything about a hob?

MDJ did !

MDJ · Oct 24, 2012

I probably got mixed up reading all the other posts, anyhow my point is if there is another appliance whether an hob or an oven the OP could fit a new dual outlet and connect the existing plus a bit of T&E from the other part of the dual outlet to a new single socket as well if he didn't want to cut the plug off. if no other hob or oven then yeah just change the existing outlet for a single socket

Taylortwocities · Oct 24, 2012

clematis432 said:
MDJ did !

Nope, It was Eng54 :chinese:

Engineer54 · Oct 24, 2012

MDJ said:
I probably got mixed up reading all the other posts, anyhow my point is if there is another appliance whether an hob or an oven the OP could fit a new dual outlet and connect the existing plus a bit of T&E from the other part of the dual outlet to a new single socket as well if he didn't want to cut the plug off. if no other hob or oven then yeah just change the existing outlet for a single socket

Yep, it seems i made the same mix-up with other threads that are running at the moment!!! Sorry All!!! lol!!

p11jor · Oct 24, 2012

Just smash the single cooker point into a double and put one of them isolated/13amp outlet plates on.

Rifleman · Mar 2, 2020

Another question regarding the cooker circuit. Currently I have a cooker control unit with a plug as part of the fixture which has the normal 6mm cable in and out feed. I need to move this lower and put it in a cupboard but under 18 Ed it does not seem this is allowed.
Can I leave the fixture were it is then place a dual cooker outlet from the current fixture and with 6mm running to a switched socket or can I use 2.5mm to socket fixture. Then I can just use the plug already fitted to the cooker.

Taylortwocities · Mar 2, 2020

There is no regulation about the placement of a cooker control switch, other than being suitable for the environment. In fact you do not need to have one.
(where did you find this in the 18th? Regulation number please!)
It can go in the cupboard, or do as you propose from dual connect unit.
2.5mm cable to socket is fine.

Rifleman · Mar 2, 2020

Taylortwocities said:
There is no regulation about the placement of a cooker control switch, other than being suitable for the environment. In fact you do not need to have one.
(where did you find this in the 18th? Regulation number please!)
It can go in the cupboard, or do as you propose from dual connect unit.
2.5mm cable to socket is fine.

Thanks for fast reply
[automerge]1583147551[/automerge]

Rifleman said:
Thanks for fast reply some one winding me up at work regarding 18th ed

Taylortwocities · Mar 2, 2020

There is a “Dummies Guide to BS76761” called the On Site Guide. This used to refer to cooker isolation switch positioning, but it’s a guide and some of the stuff in there is historic and is no longer current.

Ask your colleague for the regulation number!