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Discuss I get it, FAST TRACK courses are more than frowned upon.......BUT; in the Electrical Forum area at ElectriciansForums.net

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Good avo people,
As the title states; I know I'm going to be the victim of negativity and stone throwing here but I would be extremely grateful if you guys, the professionals and experts, could shed a touch of light on this subject for me.

I have read sheds loads of posts, forums, stories, etc, regarding this subject and agree that fast tracking is an insult to those who have worked their knackers off through years of apprenticeship schemes and college.
Fast tracking does not allow for the info/learning to be absorbed over 2-3 years college study and probably isn't nearly as practical regarding the.....practical.
However, in theory......both fast tracking and college effectively give the student the qualifications needed to get their foot on this career ladder irrespective of course length. Both sets of students will have next to no onsite/practical experience and both have will have only applied the practices in a workshop environment.
Either way, the newly 'qualified' person (fast track or 2 years at college) will still need to pursue invaluable experience alongside a time served sparky.
So, are the pros just p****d off that fast tracking deducts the need for years of study that eventually (and as far as the qualifications governing body are concerned) gets them to the same point? Or is it because, effectively, these fast track courses could flood the market with potential electricians and so devaluing the trade?.......serious questions.

The reasons for the above; I would love to turn the clock back to when I was 16-24 and jump on an electrical installations apprenticeship but that ship sailed a long time ago. Night college is potentially a root but why do it in 2 years when I can do it in 10 months?.......will I find it easier to get a job as a newly qualified spark, in my late 30's, with no experience, for doing the course over years rather than months???

Electricians jobs on Indeed.co.uk state experience alongside the relevant qualifications (nothing mentioned about fast tracking or college root). So I was wondering what your thoughts are on the subject.

Sorry for digging the subject up for the millionth time across the internet but sometimes an answer other than,
"I wouldn't waste my money on fast tracking, you learn nowt and no one in the universe is gonna employ you!"
Or is it a way to show a potential employer that, while apprenticeships are out of reach, spending a few grand on the course and studying while holding down a full time job shows initiative and an eagerness to better yourself?!
 
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richy3333

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Dont agree. My apprentice does block release. Yes he works in a booth similar (I guess) to the Electrical Trainee courses doing practical, but the theory he learns far exceeds what a short course could ever give. In his first year he has worked plastic and galvanised conduit, tray and plastic and galvanised trunking. I just dont believe these short form courses give you this?

Plus he works with me when not at college and therefore gets real world experience. I really don't think you can compare the two anywhere near an equal footing. BTW he's also 27 and on a wage below minimum because he has the drive to make the sacrifice to do it properly.

At the end of it he will have far superior qualifications and experience to a short course attendee.
 

snowhead

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Apprentices do (well did when I was one in the late 60's ) get site experience, it's not all college.
I did Block release (6 wks work, 6wks college,, repeat.) for the first 2 years, plus employers own training courses within the work periods.
Day release (plus 1 evening) for year 3.
At that point classed as competent and allowed to work without direct supervision.
2 Evenings for years 4 and 5.
 
T

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The simple fact is you have no other way. Because you will always be second best you will just have to try harder and maybe you will exceed the cognoscenti eventually. Shame you will have to learn on other peoples houses though. Clearly there is a vast difference between a one off five week course covering the essential basic science and a structured working environment with block release over two years the two items cannot be compared they are light years away from each other. When I say you I really mean the general population who take the five week route. It really prepares you for domestic electrician only. Which while there is a lot of regs and laws to follow is doable. I have always maintained I could teach anyone the science to wiring a house in 24 hours. But I could not train them the method to do so that would take a couple of years practice. I have had a few people work with me that have done the 3 year course (C&G2365) who make me feel like I am losing the will to live they are so hopeless. Then there are some who at 2 years into the course are completely great at working so it is very much to do with the person in question. Let us be clear whether you have done a century long course or a two minute course it seems in the real world it has no bearing on how good you are as I have seen all levels at work some are impressive and I know I will never be as good as them others on paper are better but in the real world are crap. Just get on with it.
 
Had loads of apprentices with me,they have done the 3 years,& are complete useless out in the real world,where real decisions have to be made.
 

littlespark

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At the end of it he will have far superior qualifications and experience to a short course attendee.
Identical qualification, superior experience. That's the whole point of the OP's question.

It can be down to the individual. I'm sure there are short course sparks out there who really know their stuff. Likewise there are guys who did the same apprenticeship route I did, but have dumped the career and fell back into filling shelves and sweeping floors because they couldn't get their head around the theory OR the practical.
 

TJ Anderson

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This is gonna sound really harsh, but......Some people are really thick and some people are really smart. There are folks out there that could do a 10 year apprenticeship (hypothetically ) and still be useless lol. If you are smart then, figure it all out, time is a bit against you. See what quals the employers ask for, that's what you need to achieve. In this trade there is always new things, for everyone, no matter how long you have been in it, you never stop learning new stuff.
 
I'm with @Vortigern. Just get on with it. This reminds me of a previous life in the RAF where going through training, 3/4 years on site as mechanic further training and then as technician. They introduced Direct entry (DE) where you could just join as a technician and it upset the world, well all the other mechanics - someone with little experience can easily be made to look a fool by those with it - that doesn't make it right. Would I be a better driver if I did a 40 hr week intensive or over weeks / months? No. Passing the test is when you start to learn. Get the qualification and then never forget to start learning... again.
 
Short courses are okay for people who already have experience in construction (builders, plumbers, etc) or advanced diy'ers looking for a career in domestic installation.
 

7029 dave

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I am livening proof, done my gas safe training in 2017, 16 weeks got my ticket at the age of 53. Do I feel qualified? no not really because I have not done a full apprenticeship in this field experience etc , however 40 years in the electrical industry yes have the confidence to say yes this is my game.

Times have changed, my point is as above the world has changed so push on.!! ( cannon fodder)
 
I was 26 when i started my level 2. 3 kids and a mortgage. I did level 2 2 days a weel and worked part time in a non electrical role...so basically i gave up full time work for it. After my first year i got an apprenticeship and 2 years later i passed and im now reaping the benefits.
On my first ever job with the company who took me they also had an agency worker help me and the electrician who had done a short course he was early 50's...utterly useless, couldn't wrap his head around loop in loop out lighting (didnt even know switch fed) or how to wire a ring circuit as it was too confusing to him (i wish i was joking) and this man actually advertised himself out to the general public.

As well as the experience and knowledge you gain from being an apprentice its also the reward of gaining that qualification at the end.
To many people are too quick to find the fast route around things nowadays and dont wanna put the hard work in.
 

AJshep

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Short courses serve a purpose and I believe if you are a good trades person then you can benifit from these short courses, and will probably work to a good standard.
My main issue is that many people that take these short courses dont care, they will just go out and advertise themselves electricians after 6 weeks, some work outside their comfort zone. The short course only gives the basics needed to work on domestic installations, and it can be a really good way of getting your foot in the door but unfortunately its open to abuse. If your thinking of trying to get a job working for a good wage on a company after completing a Part P course it might be harder than expected as people advertising for electricians are after electricians (not domestic installers) so its worth bearing that in mind. Many people are forced to go self employed after taking the course because the training centre's did not explain this to them properly.

Articles like this really get my back up, especially the final thoughts...
Electrician: Domestic Installer - https://electricianqualifications.info/electrician-domestic-installer/

Good luck whatever you choose.
 
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