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Discuss Jumper keeps cutting out faster progressivly in the DIY Electrical Forum area at ElectriciansForums.net

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Hi all, thank you for reading my post.
My first one so I hope it is in the right spot.

I just bought a house in Thailand. I moved in a week ago and 3 days ago a jumper started cutting out. Since then it has been doing so more frequently and now I am unable to put it in the on position.
I am a qualified electronics technician but tbh have not used in in my work since leaving school, so I forgot nearly everything but am quick to understand once explained. It is some kind of safetyjumper in the beginning of the fusebox right next to the master jumper, to try to find the possible circuit I have switched off all following jumpers, which I thought presumably are on that main circuit. This has not helped, even with all following jumpers off, it still doesn't let me switch on the safety jumper.

I include some pictures, the zoomed in pic is the actual safety jumper, the others I have switched off myself.

Thank you for any tips to shed some light on this headscratcher.

20190912_145204.jpg

20190912_145148.jpg
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Anyone here who might be able to tell me what kind of jumper this is and what it cutting out at first and not being able to switch on might indicate?

Any help is greatly appreciated, thanks
 
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  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #2
I just realised I should have used the word "breaker". English is not my first language, I mistranslated.

Is the first breaker a LIM?
 

Pete999

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I just realised I should have used the word "breaker". English is not my first language, I mistranslated.

Is the first breaker a LIM?
What do you mean "is the First Breaker a LIM"?
 
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #4
What do you mean "is the First Breaker a LIM"?
Hi Pete999, thank you for your question.

I meant is the first breaker which is in the off position, and which is also the one that keeps on cutting out a "Line Insulation Monitor"? If I look at the wiring diagram, which is visible between the wires above the breakers, it is connected to the yellow block which says RCBO on it.
I wonder if I have a leak or short somewhere.

20190912_175658.jpg
 

pirate

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Please can you tell me, what is that bundle of black cable wrapped with insulating tape, lying at the bottom of the board?
 

Pete999

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Please can you tell me, what is that bundle of black cable wrapped with insulating tape, lying at the bottom of the board?
Yeah I noticed that as well, to polite to ask though, OP your best bet is to get some testing done by an electrician, it's almost impossible to say what the problem is, and it would only be guesswork, some testing is required.
 
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #7
Thank you both for your replies and questions.
Looking at the size of the cables wrapped in insulation tape my guess is that is the main cables coming into the house.
The problem with electricians here is that they many times have low standard and there are no officials checking or certifying the wiring.

Could you, by looking at these pictures tell me what those breakers are? It is obviously a safety breaker and not a typical overload breaker as I have switches off all following breakers.
If I would have the correct name I could understand better what it does and it might help me.

Thank you for your replies, it is much appreciated
Post automatically merged:

And final question:
If all the following breakers for separate branches like lights, plugs etc are switched off. How can this affect the main safety switch from that entire circuit from tripping out?
 
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Pete999

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Thank you both for your replies and questions.
Looking at the size of the cables wrapped in insulation tape my guess is that is the main cables coming into the house.
The problem with electricians here is that they many times have low standard and there are no officials checking or certifying the wiring.

Could you, by looking at these pictures tell me what those breakers are? It is obviously a safety breaker and not a typical overload breaker as I have switches off all following breakers.
If I would have the correct name I could understand better what it does and it might help me.

Thank you for your replies, it is much appreciated
Post automatically merged:

And final question:
If all the following breakers for separate branches like lights, plugs etc are switched off. How can this affect the main safety switch from that entire circuit from tripping out?
If you mean by "main safety switch" which looks as though it is a RCD or RCBO then which ever circuits that switch covers throws up a fault it will trip, thus rendering all circuits covered by that switch will be cut OFF. individual RCBOs for each circuit, will be the way forward RCBO (rcd with overload protection) the best of both worlds but with it comes extra costs.
 
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davesparks

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From the left of the board you have a double pole circuit breaker which is switched on in the pictures, this feeds to the next circuit breaker.
The next circuit breaker/device is a combination of items built up to make one protective device, it appears to consist of a shunt trip couple to a double pole breaker then an adjustable residual current unit.
This is probably what is described as LIM on the diagram,though in the UK we don't use that terminology.

The residual current unit measures the current flowing out through the live and the current returning through the neutral, if there is a difference between them it sends a signal to the shunt trip which operates the circuit breaker.
This difference in current could be caused by someone receiving an electric shock (the usual reason for using residual current devices is this protection) or from any fault causing current to flow to earth.
Because it works on very small currents a fault between neutral and earth can cause it to trip.

The circuit breakers after it are single pole devices, so they only break the live, the neutral remains connected whne they are off.
If there is a fault between neutral and earth then it will still cause the RCD to trip even with the circuit breakers turned off.

Without any test equipment to identify the fault it is going to be very hard to find it.
First unplug or disconnect every appliance and try resetting the RCD to see if it is an appliance causing it.

If it is not an appliance an disn a fault in the wiring then you could, if you are very careful to work safely and not put yourself in any danger, disconnect the neutral from one circuit at a time to find which one causes the rcd to trip. But be aware that you must never switch on the circuit breaker for a circuit which has the neutral disconnected, this can be extremely dangerous. Also you should insulate the exposed end of the disconnected neutral wire in case it does become live when another circuit is switched on.
 
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