Outside Socket

[Bright spark]

Hi All
Recently came across an interesting situation whereby a client wanted some extra sockets and lights in the garden. The current lights are fed from a spur run in 2.5mm SWA and buried for approx 3m across a lawn to existing installation of two single sockets and some floods in the borders connected as a radial. The thing is the outside socket is connected as part of the ring circuit and the externals spurred off using the 2.5mm SWA. Is this allowable ? Ring main can be any number of sockets as long as area served is no more than 100m2 but looks like client is running small hot tub (4kw) from outside socket which is RCD protected. Concern is loading on that part of the ring. I have suggested it would be better to disconnect spur and join to new SWA run back to the CU and put on separate breaker. Any thoughts ?

 

[telectrix]

agreed. a 4kW load should be on it's own dedicated circuit. you couls argue some diversity as the 4kW is mainly the heater which will cycle on/off on it's stat, but if I were doing it, min. would be 20A MCB and 2.5mm cable (dependent on installation method).

 

[timhoward]

I also agree that's pushing it. Is there currently only the one ring final circuit for the house?
Looking at fault tolerance between circuits would be another consideration as with that lot outside it's only a matter of time before something gets too wet, and it would be better if the internal sockets stayed on (e.g. freezer and especially the telly !)

The 100 sq. m is guidance in appendix 15 btw and even there it is vague, so not written in stone. As you say it's all about loading anyway.

 

[littlespark]

OP, can you confirm something.

At first, you say there’s a 2.5 SPUR going outside in SWA….
then later you say the outside socket is part of the ring, with other things spurred off it.

Can you clarify.

 

[Petej999]

Hi All
Recently came across an interesting situation whereby a client wanted some extra sockets and lights in the garden. The current lights are fed from a spur run in 2.5mm SWA and buried for approx 3m across a lawn to existing installation of two single sockets and some floods in the borders connected as a radial. The thing is the outside socket is connected as part of the ring circuit and the externals spurred off using the 2.5mm SWA. Is this allowable ? Ring main can be any number of sockets as long as area served is no more than 100m2 but looks like client is running small hot tub (4kw) from outside socket which is RCD protected. Concern is loading on that part of the ring. I have suggested it would be better to disconnect spur and join to new SWA run back to the CU and put on separate breaker. Any thoughts ?

4kw should a DEDICATED CIRCUIT ,DON'T WANT THE RFC tripping every time the hot tub is in use do we?

 

[123]

Not sure a 4kW load plugged into a socket will last too long

 

[Bright spark]

OP, can you confirm something.

At first, you say there’s a 2.5 SPUR going outside in SWA….
then later you say the outside socket is part of the ring, with other things spurred off it.

Can you clarify.

Outside RCD socket is under cover and connected to the house ring, one circuit for upstairs and downstairs off a 32A MCB in board and then lights / sockets etc spurred off unfused from RCD socket. Connections to ring 2.5mm T+E spur run in 2.5mm SWA.

 

[Bright spark]

Has anyone come across this before where an Outside socket is connected as part of the ring rather than being spurred off ?

 

[littlespark]

Ive done it before where an existing spur (unfused) to external double socket. Customer wanted a second outside socket away from the house. (outside socket back to back with internal socket)

Options were to fuse the spur to outside and make it a radial, or rewire the existing external onto the ring, and spur the new one off it.

Customer opted for second choice... he didnt want another fuse or switch on the wall inside.

 

[pc1966]

Not sure a 4kW load plugged into a socket will last too long

Not a 13A one for sure! Probably not a 16A commando either.

At 17.4A that is going to need either a 32A commando or probably best be hard-wired to an isolator.

 

[telectrix]

or direct to incoming side of meter. ???

 

[DPG]

How long have they had the 4kw tub plugged into the 13A socket? Is there no sign of any heat damage?

 

[telectrix]

How long have they had the 4kw tub plugged into the 13A socket? Is there no sign of any heat damage?

maybe not, but significant signs of wallet damage.