Do you not feel that the term Electrical Trainee is derogatory

[Meggerman]

Okay, here's how it's going to work.

When a thread descends into handbag swinging and general bickering I'm going to go back through the thread and identify the posts that started it and the posts that caused it to escalate. The members responsible for those posts will be dealt with accordingly.

If you feel someone is out of their depth or doing something dangerous you're welcome to say, but, and this is a big 'BUT', keep it civilised and keep it polite. Insinuating you'd 'feel like a dick' if you'd asked this question is not acceptable. Calling them an 'idiot' is not acceptable. There's also lots of threads about the deskilling of the industry so keep general discussions about domestic installers or Electrical Trainee's in those threads.

Iamelectric, you need to stop addressing members directly with personal comments. If your 'bait' contributes to an already contentious thread going South then you'll get banned for trolling.

My best advice to one and all is read my signature and follow the advice in it.

Do you not feel that the term Electrical Trainee is derogatory?

 

[Silly Sausage]

Re: Cannot get RCD test to work?

Do you not feel that the term Electrical Trainee is derogatory?

It's a term that has been used in a Parliamentary Select Committee debate, so, you could argue it's quite acceptable.

 

[Marvo]

Re: Cannot get RCD test to work?

Do you not feel that the term Electrical Trainee is derogatory?

Not being a part of the UK electrical industry, in fact not being anywhere near the UK even, the term has very little meaning to me but it does seem to be one that's in wide usage and seems to be fairly accepted as far as I've seen. You are the first member to raise this question as far as I know.

Please don't pursue a debate about it in this thread for two reasons, firstly I'd rather people took notice of the actual message in my warning rather than getting sidetracked by the syntax or terminology, secondly it's off-topic in this thread. If you feel it warrants discussion please start a new thread in Chit-Chat.

 

[NickD]

Re: Cannot get RCD test to work?

Do you not feel that the term Electrical Trainee is derogatory?

I think it's unfortunate that it labels everyone who's done the short-route-to-full-scope-Part-P type courses with the same brush. I think there are probably many Electrical Trainee's who do a good job working competently within the scope of their competence, and others who don't even have any competence to work within. Just as I'm sure there are both excellent and completely useless time served electricians. Just because you've got twenty years on the insulated screwdrivers man and boy, doesn't mean you've been holding the right end. ;-)

(Sorry Marvo, only just saw the tail end of your last post, apologies.)

 

[Marvo]

Off topic posts from another thread moved here.

I can see that others may be itching to have input so I've made this into a thread of it's own.

Keep it civil and keep it tidy please.

 

[Sintra]

Do you not feel that the term Electrical Trainee is derogatory?

How would you categorise someone who has done one of these 5 week courses?

 

[Octopus]

This thread needs to be deleted before it becomes a nightmare for the mods!

 

[trev]

So what other terms would you consider derogatory? In the early part of my career the short course route took 2 years, these people were referred to as diluteys.
As Nick says above, I know of many really good people who have followed the Electrical Trainee route and realised they were out of their depth who then made suure they went out and got the knowledge they needed before letting themselves loose on unsuspecting members of the public. I hold no grudge against these people.
The ones I object to are the ones who "graduate" from these courses and then come on here asking the simplest of questions but still considering themselves to be the font of all electrical knowledge. I'll mention no names but one of these was partly responsible for my prolonged holiday from the forum.
Even then, I hold these people only partly responsible. They have been sold a lie by the very organisations who are supposed to be upholding standards within the trade and deemed competent solely by opening their bank accounts to these charlatans

 

[Badged01]

Having never done one of these course Im not to sure if its derogatory or not!

You could put a positive spin on it and say its quite complimentary. You did a 5 week course and learnt so much you are wonderful ..... all the rest of us took years to get the same level of knowledge!

 

[dazza1981]

so what other terms would you consider derogatory? In the early part of my career the short course route took 2 years, these people were referred to as diluteys.
As nick says above, i know of many really good people who have followed the Electrical Trainee route and realised they were out of their depth who then made suure they went out and got the knowledge they needed before letting themselves loose on unsuspecting members of the public. I hold no grudge against these people.
The ones i object to are the ones who "graduate" from these courses and then come on here asking the simplest of questions but still considering themselves to be the font of all electrical knowledge. I'll mention no names but one of these was partly responsible for my prolonged holiday from the forum.
Even then, i hold these people only partly responsible. They have been sold a lie by the very organisations who are supposed to be upholding standards within the trade and deemed competent solely by opening their bank accounts to these charlatans

enough said !!!!!

 

[Silly Sausage]

Having never done one of these course Im not to sure if its derogatory or not!

You could put a positive spin on it and say its quite complimentary. You did a 5 week course and learnt so much you are wonderful ..... all the rest of us took years to get the same level of knowledge!

You're one of those glass half full types! :smilielol5:

 

[NDG Elecs]

How would you categorise someone who has done one of these 5 week courses?

Inexperienced....probably!

I am fairly new to the industry, only do domestic and light commercial stuff.... I initially approached college 10 years back expecting I could do a 'short course' and bingo, away I go... I ended up doing full 3yr 2330 and am I glad. I completely and overwhelmingly utterly under-estimated the knowledge and experience required to be a decent electrician. I still consider myself to know not a lot about electrics.

In fairness to some of the so called Electrical Trainee, many are probably misled into thinking it's a doddle by the short course providers.. and many of the lads/ladies will have families to support etc. So need to pay the bills. The Electrical Trainee's have been allowed to occur due to other forces at work, namely training providers and the schemes that accept them.

EDIT: Just read Trevs post.....I was not plagiarising, honest!

 

[NickD]

The way I look at it, sort of, is calling a Electrical Trainee a crap electrician is like calling a licensed conveyancer a crap solicitor or a highways patrol officer a crap policeman.

 

[NDG Elecs]

crap electrician...aint they normally the ex-council bashers!!

Disclaimer: Mirth!

 

[Adam W]

The way I look at it, sort of, is calling a Electrical Trainee a crap electrician is like calling a licensed conveyancer a crap solicitor or a highways patrol officer a crap policeman.

Probably a good job nobody's saying that then.
Using your examples, calling a Electrical Trainee an electrician would be like calling a PCSO a policeman, a legal secretary a solicitor or a GP's receptionist a nurse.

 

[NickD]

Using your examples, calling a Electrical Trainee an electrician would be like calling a PCSO a policeman, a legal secretary a solicitor or a GP's receptionist a nurse.

Yes, which is why I think the term domestic installer has a place. If one says the term doesn't exist then all you're left with is "electrician" and then people who feel they've spent a decade or two earning that title get narky about it being applied to someone who's spent a lot less time training. What I will say is that I think someone going in for the short courses with essentially no electrical knowledge is a recipe for disaster, probably.

 

[Rockingit]

You buy (literally) into a FIVE WEEK course, and feel WONDERful when you 'graduate'. Where's the poor etymology in that? Perfectly acceptable descriptor as far as I'm concerned.

 

[pepparz]

of course its derogatory, its a sarcastic term.

 

[Badged01]

I would hope that most people on the site, whichever route they have taken to get to where they are, are fairly thick skinned and able to handle some 'light' ribbing and stick!

 

[R G]

I would treat the term as a compliment , because they did it all in 5 weeks ,,, Lol,,,