Discuss The weirdest problem you have ever heard: slight input voltage increase seems to affect my pc performance drastically in the Electrical Forum area at ElectriciansForums.net

Welcome to ElectriciansForums.net - The American Electrical Advice Forum
Head straight to the main forums to chat by click here:   American Electrical Advice Forum

Reaction score
1
So for the longest time I had issues in this location while gaming. I am on a second pc build that exhibits the same weirdness that made me actually quit playing Fifa though I loved the game. To use a simple clear example of weird behaviour, a game like Rocket League (maybe some have heard of this) just feels weird 99 % of the time. I play it using a controller (currently using a xbone controller) and the only requirement is being precise and almost every millisecond counts. On some rare occasions the game is way more responsive, long story short, its a night and day type difference won't go into detail, the important thing is that it's clear and I notice the change right away

So today for a couple of hours it was that rare good game-play. And I think for the first time I caught what was different from the rest of the time: I think it's a lower voltage being supplied. I know this because recently i started using a sine-wave UPS. It has a display that shows about 10 values. The first one is called INPUT and it displays a number labeled V so I assume it\s the outlet input voltage (probably butchering the terms but that's what I know). Usually it's 228-230. Today for the first time I've seen a value of 218! I played 2-3 hours everything was just great and smooth and responsive. I monitored the value and it was around 218-222 Later it started feel weird again; checked the value fast and it's 226. That moment the game even reported packet loss for a couple seconds (I have the router connected to the ups as well). I think I played for 3 hours and this was the first time the package loss was reported, too high of a coincidence... The voltage went to 227 and then it climbed to 228 and stayed there. I checked in offline gameplay for 5 minutes and it was trash again.

Assuming this was not a huge coincidence and that the voltage could be causing this, Is there any reasonable explanation
I understand the 230 V was introduced in the last years, before we had 220. I live in a old apartment complex and this was surely built when the standard was 220. My only guess as a complete novice is that the wires clearly are not replaced and the electrical company started supplying at some point 230 instead of 220. Maybe when it approaches 230 it can be somehow unstable and feed some junk into my ups who in turn screws up in a minor way that is visible only when using high demand games. Or maybe monitor slightly out of sync. It's the weirdest thing and I cannot state what goes wrong in what way but I can state with 100 % certainty that I see the difference in the game in 5 seconds. Feels like the inputs are rushing and not very consistent

Is anything I'm saying making any sense from an electrical perspective, have you ever heard of this? Help me out, what could I do where do I start. I know that the UPS is grounded even though all the outlets in the house were not, I called an electrician and he used a free spot in the electrical home panel that is not connected to the rest (thats how he explained it to me) to draw a cable and outlet that powers the UPS. Of course the home panel wires that come from the building were not touched.
 
The switch mode PSU in your PC will work on a much wider voltage range than the examples you have given. This variation in supply voltage will not cause packet loss or unresponsiveness.

I suppose if your machine is running right at the extreme if its max operating temperature then there is the ever so slight chance that a higher supply voltage may just push it into overheating.
 
The switch mode PSU in your PC will work on a much wider voltage range than the examples you have given. This variation in supply voltage will not cause packet loss or unresponsiveness.

I suppose if your machine is running right at the extreme if its max operating temperature then there is the ever so slight chance that a higher supply voltage may just push it into overheating.
I actually thought about this and was cursing myself for not checking if there is any major change using Ryzen Master to check the temp but it was not a main concercn in the back of my head because the gpu is undervolted and works great and the cpu is around 70 when playing RL so it has a long way from reaching 95 and it has never happened even in games like COD that hammer the cpu.

I am not saying that the variation is causing anything directly. For now from my perspective I can only say I identified a clear factor that aligns with good gameplay, the first time since I have acknowledged that I have a reoccurring problem. That voltage value that I saw yesterday is an outlier just as my smooth gameplay is an outlier .

I'm not claiming any causation for now I am looking at it as a correlation and I'm trying to describe the issue in hope it would make sense from an electrical perspective because I have eliminated so many other factors I would bore you telling you about.

The system works great overall and is a massive improvement and even helped stabilize somewhat the issue I have but it is not perfect. Yesterday it was perfect. We are not talking about borderline not working, a mere de-sync for a random value of 15 to 30 milliseconds lets say somewhere could throw off the entire system when you play something that require your fastest reaction time and your greatest accuracy. Like I said maybe the monitor is the one taking a hit because of bad current or something and it translates to a small random delay etc etc

I would love to know if there can be general issues caused by improper wiring or old wiring or poor electricity etc.

Is the 220 v 230 v standard change that I described totally nonsensical in explaining why did the gameplay would feel more stable around 220 v instead of 230 v?
 
As I say, the power supply in your PC will maintain regulation over that input voltage range. You could prove this if you want by using a decent multimeter to measurec the 5V and 12V outputs while the PC is in use.
 
If it's a good quality on-line UPS you may be able to adjust the output voltage... from the sounds of it though it's an off-line one which only kicks in when the power disappears completely.

As @DPG says, I might be inclined to monitor the voltages coming out of the power supply paying particular attention to the 3.3v, 5v and 12v. The 3.3v because I think that is the base of the supply to the CPU and the 12v because that what is supplied to the graphics card I believe.

I might also be inclined to change the PC power supply. As DPG stated, these units are capable of delivering with a massive range of input voltages, far beyond the fluctuations you are seeing. Spend money on the PSU if you haven't already, this is one of the components I never buy cheap.
 
If the PSU is actually faulty, then it might have an influence. As stated above though, a normal PSU will handle anything from aboutt 90 to 250V while staying within specification. The power for some of the most critically voltage-sensitive parts of the PC is converted twice, once in the PSU and once on the board adjacent to the chipset, so even minor fluctuations in PSU output won't have any impact.
 
If it's a good quality on-line UPS you may be able to adjust the output voltage... from the sounds of it though it's an off-line one which only kicks in when the power disappears completely.

As @DPG says, I might be inclined to monitor the voltages coming out of the power supply paying particular attention to the 3.3v, 5v and 12v. The 3.3v because I think that is the base of the supply to the CPU and the 12v because that what is supplied to the graphics card I believe.

I might also be inclined to change the PC power supply. As DPG stated, these units are capable of delivering with a massive range of input voltages, far beyond the fluctuations you are seeing. Spend money on the PSU if you haven't already, this is one of the components I never buy cheap.
Hi I have a pretty good PSU Corsair RMx Series RM650x, 650W, 80+ Gold
I watched those values, since getting the UPS they are rock solid, before when I was connecting to the wall outlet the 12 V was fluctuating like crazy all the time (not by huge percentages it was in range but not stable as now)

Also maybe I am not describing the problem correctly. The game runs great 300+fps looks good. Nothing breaks. System is not overheating. BUT I am playing a different game when the 'smooth gameplay' happens. It just is slower visually and the inputs are fast.

Let's look at it differently, can we have in theory a location where the current is 'bad'? A PC would work but the PSU is receiving a either a fluctuating current or a bad wave form etc (I know the terms are ridiculous but I know nothing about this just that the current comes as a wave or something like that)? Let's ignore the PC, can the monitor be influenced by this in theory, same unit can it work in one way in a location and have a small delay in another location giving the wiring at the location? This is the only angle I can tackle this as I have eliminated everything else and I can't just move to test it :)

Also if I understand you correctly the PSU outputs what it receives right? Gets 228 from the wall outlet it will send 228 to the PC something like that? If yes I can't adjust that. I have this thing: CyberPower CP1300EPFCLCD with Pure Sine Wave output

I cant help but think about this, if the apartment complex wiring was made when the standard in the country was 220V but years later it was changed to 230v and the electrical companies started supplying more or howeve the hell this was accomplished, is that wirring still doing a top notch job with this difference or something could in theory be a bit off?
 
Last edited:
I am wondering if as the input voltage to the UPS increases above a certain voltage, if the ups is becoming active and supply the pc with a poor quality (but correct voltage) supply.

if your computer is modified as it appears to be, it may be far more susceptible to variation to the supply waveform.
as you seem to have a poor quality power supply to the building that is changing
voltage, I would suggest a good quality double conversion, online UPS. (Pure sine wave output)
 
And also maybe try it without the UPS in the system for a while. See if you notice any difference.
 
And also maybe try it without the UPS in the system for a while. See if you notice any difference.
I did think about that, but with a highly modified pc, I would not like to run it without some form of protection on the input side of things.
it would be a case of try it at your own risk!
some of the better quality surge protector extension leads may give good enough over voltage protection.

just an after thought, if you are running the computer through a UPS, especially one that uses a modified sine wave output, I would not recommend having any form of surge protection extension lead between the UPS and the computer.
I doubt the electronics in the lead will be able to cope well with the waveform coming out of the UPS.
If you must have a surge protector for your own peace of mind, put it before the UPS.
 
After some more testing I think it was a coincidence sadly

I have a somewhat unrelated question though, I noticed on the outside of the block 5-6 electrical cables that go right along the wall of the room where the pc is. Would this be a possible cause for some electro-magnetic field causing some interference or this is not a concern in any case whatsoever?
 
It's more likely a concern than the voltage drop. If you are getting 5% voltage drop, sounds like something is placing a demand on the line. If you are gaming, I'm guessing you're using ethernet, not wireless. Check that you haven't run your cable alongside the power cable.

When running your data cables next to power, you should try and separate by at least 200mm or 8" to avoid picking up interference on parallel runs, or just use a different route. More so of an issue is you are running gig ethernet. You will start getting line errors and packet drops and retransmits that will hit your throughput.

Edit: you can check if this is an issue using a free hosted checker such as Packet Loss Test – Test Your Connection Quality - https://packetlosstest.com

Wouldn't normally be a concern, and data cable is often run within 50mm of power in final delivery, with no to little impact. But it is worth checking for. Run a test when input is reading normal, and another when it drops.
 
Last edited:
It's more likely a concern than the voltage drop. If you are getting 5% voltage drop, sounds like something is placing a demand on the line. If you are gaming, I'm guessing you're using ethernet, not wireless. Check that you haven't run your cable alongside the power cable.

When running your data cables next to power, you should try and separate by at least 200mm or 8" to avoid picking up interference on parallel runs, or just use a different route. More so of an issue is you are running gig ethernet. You will start getting line errors and packet drops and retransmits that will hit your throughput.

Edit: you can check if this is an issue using a free hosted checker such as Packet Loss Test – Test Your Connection Quality - https://packetlosstest.com

Wouldn't normally be a concern, and data cable is often run within 50mm of power in final delivery, with no to little impact. But it is worth checking for. Run a test when input is reading normal, and another when it drops.
I have optical fiber coming into the appartment and I am using an Ethernet cable from router to pc. I guess the power cable coming from the electrical panel is quite close as the pc is near it. But maybe you meant by power cable the ones that run outside apartments buildings

Anyway I did a test, I stopped the power to the UPS so the PC ran on the UPS battery. Shockingly it feels way better, I had about 10 minutes of gameplay offline and a bit online and it just feels like I have around 5-8 % more time to react, like everything is a bit slowed down and even the picture feels more clear, it's hard to describe. This is so weird :(
 
I have optical fiber coming into the appartment and I am using an Ethernet cable from router to pc. I guess the power cable coming from the electrical panel is quite close as the pc is near it. But maybe you meant by power cable the ones that run outside apartments buildings

Anyway I did a test, I stopped the power to the UPS so the PC ran on the UPS battery. Shockingly it feels way better, I had about 10 minutes of gameplay offline and a bit online and it just feels like I have around 5-8 % more time to react, like everything is a bit slowed down and even the picture feels more clear, it's hard to describe. This is so weird :(

You ideally need to do more testing than that. It could just be psychological. Blind A/B testing with the help of an assistant would be the way to prove it.
 
You ideally need to do more testing than that. It could just be psychological. Blind A/B testing with the help of an assistant would be the way to prove it.
This. Try and get some metrics. Run some benchmarks, on and off UPS. Then try turning on possible sources of demand. Showers, kettles, microwaves, heaters or aircon. See if that changes anything.

With human reflexes being in the 150ms to 500ms kind of range, any performance affecting technical factors should be very visible on the metrics where technical variation is expected in the single digits to tens of microseconds range.

A very simple test would be to open a command prompt (windows key and type 'cmd' in run bar, then enter) and type 'ping 8.8.8.8 -t' and press enter. This will give you a running round trip time to your nearest Google DNS. I would expect a good connection to be in the 15ms-25ms range, and to be varying in the +5 to -5ms to average. Try changing stuff, see if it varies. If it stays below 40ms, I would say you have not got an issue with your connection. Then try the PC benchmark software, see if you are getting a performance rate drop in framerate under different conditions.

Novabench - Free Computer Benchmark Software - https://novabench.com/ - PC performance benchmark
Speedtest by Ookla - The Global Broadband Speed Test - https://www.speedtest.net/ - network connection benchmark
Packet Loss Test – Test Your Connection Quality - https://packetlosstest.com/ - network connection quality test
 
You ideally need to do more testing than that. It could just be psychological. Blind A/B testing with the help of an assistant would be the way to prove it.
No need, it's a very clear problem

You could argue that in any casual games but not for those where input is precise and where you can see how well you can perform simple moves or not while having hundreds and hundreds of hours of experience right? Also it's not like it's an obvious issue where something does not outright work and I can pinpoint it, if it's a small delay in the monitor output for example it will through off all your gaming based muscle memory, how do you measure that with someone who doesnt even know there is a problem?

I'm only interested in a general sense I'm not here to prove to you something doesnt work on my system but to ask, if a game looks different while the pc + monitor + router are all running on the UPS battery and it was running different 15 seconds ago on electricity, what should I infer from this and are there any steps I could take or any general knowledge from an electrical perspective? If I call an electrician what would he be looking at?

The main point is that if the test is true, this eliminates any connectivity issue (i am testing offline as well you can play around and check at any point anyway), any software related issue, any hardware related issue (because the PC cannot simply function different in the span of a couple seconds for 10 minutes straight if something would be wrong with a component) and any peripheral issue(the XBOX ONE gamepad cannot simply start working better if it was having some input delay 15 seconds ago) and any monitor issue(the monitor cannot simply start working better if it was having some issue 15 seconds ago)

All I did was I only pressed an electrical switch that cut the power off and for 10 minutes gameplay was different that's all I know. If there is no logical explanation from an electrical perspective the question becomes , what easy steps could I take to the same test but for at least 2-3 days let's say (the battery only lasts for 15 minutes or so). Maybe I could avoid using the current wiring and an electrician could get a cable dirrectly from the main power panel. Mind you the entire electrical wiring was made back in the day so that all outlets in all apartments ARE NOT GROUNDED
 
Last edited:
No need, it's a very clear problem

You could argue that in any casual games but not for those where input is precise and where you can see how well you can perform simple moves or not while having hundreds and hundreds of hours of experience right? Also it's not like it's an obvious issue where something does not outright work and I can pinpoint it, if it's a small delay in the monitor output for example it will through off all your gaming based muscle memory, how do you measure that with someone who doesnt even know there is a problem?

I'm only interested in a general sense I'm not here to prove to you something doesnt work on my system but to ask, if a game looks different while the pc + monitor + router are all running on the UPS battery and it was running different 15 seconds ago on electricity, what should I infer from this and are there any steps I could take or any general knowledge from an electrical perspective? If I call an electrician what would he be looking at?

The main point is that if the test is true, this eliminates any connectivity issue (i am testing offline as well you can play around and check at any point anyway), any software related issue, any hardware related issue (because the PC cannot simply function different in the span of a couple seconds for 10 minutes straight if something would be wrong with a component) and any peripheral issue(the XBOX ONE gamepad cannot simply start working better if it was having some input delay 15 seconds ago) and any monitor issue(the monitor cannot simply start working better if it was having some issue 15 seconds ago)

All I did was I only pressed an electrical switch that cut the power off and for 10 minutes gameplay was different that's all I know. If there is no logical explanation from an electrical perspective the question becomes , what easy steps could I take to the same test but for at least 2-3 days let's say (the battery only lasts for 15 minutes or so). Maybe I could avoid using the current wiring and an electrician could get a cable dirrectly from the main power panel. Mind you the entire electrical wiring was made back in the day so that all outlets in all apartments ARE NOT GROUNDED

None of your socket outlets have an earth? Are you using any class I equipment, ie does any of your kit require an earth connection?

I would check this before going any further.
 
No need, it's a very clear problem

You could argue that in any casual games but not for those where input is precise and where you can see how well you can perform simple moves or not while having hundreds and hundreds of hours of experience right? Also it's not like it's an obvious issue where something does not outright work and I can pinpoint it, if it's a small delay in the monitor output for example it will through off all your gaming based muscle memory, how do you measure that with someone who doesnt even know there is a problem?

I'm only interested in a general sense I'm not here to prove to you something doesnt work on my system but to ask, if a game looks different while the pc + monitor + router are all running on the UPS battery and it was running different 15 seconds ago on electricity, what should I infer from this and are there any steps I could take or any general knowledge from an electrical perspective? If I call an electrician what would he be looking at?

The main point is that if the test is true, this eliminates any connectivity issue (i am testing offline as well you can play around and check at any point anyway), any software related issue, any hardware related issue (because the PC cannot simply function different in the span of a couple seconds for 10 minutes straight if something would be wrong with a component) and any peripheral issue(the XBOX ONE gamepad cannot simply start working better if it was having some input delay 15 seconds ago) and any monitor issue(the monitor cannot simply start working better if it was having some issue 15 seconds ago)

All I did was I only pressed an electrical switch that cut the power off and for 10 minutes gameplay was different that's all I know. If there is no logical explanation from an electrical perspective the question becomes , what easy steps could I take to the same test but for at least 2-3 days let's say (the battery only lasts for 15 minutes or so). Maybe I could avoid using the current wiring and an electrician could get a cable dirrectly from the main power panel. Mind you the entire electrical wiring was made back in the day so that all outlets in all apartments ARE NOT GROUNDED

It does sound like your supply is not the cleanest if you are having frequent voltage drops and have no ground. This opens you up more to the risk of EMI issues. It sounds like your UPS is single conversion rather than double conversion, in that it doesn't isolate the power supply. With mains connected, it is probably the case that power is going straight through rather than being corrected by the UPS.

It may be worth having a read through this forum, see if anything sounds familiar or can help.
[Power/EMI] I discover why sometime PC become fast and low input lag and otherwise feel high input lag - Blur Busters Forums - https://forums.blurbusters.com/viewtopic.php?t=6498

Asking for help from an electrician will be difficult if you cannot evidence the issue. That is the only reason the suggestion was there to collect metrics. To give them something to go on whether you need a power conditioner or a sports psychologist. I appreciate the whole competitive gaming aspect of incremental gains, and it may be the case that you can stop a stop watch on 2.87 seconds, give or take a hundredth, 9 times out of 10. Or it maybe the case that you have in your head that there is a difference, and the aspect of expecting, or looking for the difference is affecting your reactions. And there is no disrespect to your skills or experience in saying that, sports psychology of stuff like that is relevant to the highest levels. If you are picking up a definite difference when running on just UPS, drop the model of the UPS in chat, and we can try and work out whether it is double conversion model, and rule that out if necessary. What country are you based in?
 
Last edited:
None of your socket outlets have an earth? Are you using any class I equipment, ie does any of your kit require an earth connection?

I would check this before going any further.
I have only one grounded connection installed by an electrician from the home electrical panel by connecting a power strip there and the cable reaches the UPS in the room so

I only mentioned that to say that the electrical work that was done is not the best to say the least. Maybe it was done who knows... 50 years ago by some half drunk workers. This is why I am questioning wtf is going on in that electrical panel. The new cable still comes from that old wires that are in the wall

I am not sure what a class 1 equipment is. My setup is

newly installed power strip (grounded, all 3 wires connected) -> UPS -> PC+monitor router
->some lg tv

old electrical outlets (not grounded only 2 wires connected) >- fridge lights etc

The one thing I noticed was that when the UPS was delivering from battery the output was a solid 230 V, just remembered that.
Is that power strip creating any field, is the monitor or some peripherals wires susceptible if its inside the 1 meter range of that. Just shooting in the dark I have no idea what can happen with electronics and this problem comes and goes it's just weird. I would tend to think that it's actually not the pc but rather the monitor or the controller acting a bit weird because it's a new pc and the old one had the same issue
 

Reply to The weirdest problem you have ever heard: slight input voltage increase seems to affect my pc performance drastically in the Electrical Forum area at ElectriciansForums.net

OFFICIAL SPONSORS

Electrical Goods - Electrical Tools - Brand Names Electrician Courses Green Electrical Goods PCB Way Electrical Goods - Electrical Tools - Brand Names Pushfit Wire Connectors Electric Underfloor Heating Electrician Courses
These Official Forum Sponsors May Provide Discounts to Regular Forum Members - If you would like to sponsor us then CLICK HERE and post a thread with who you are, and we'll send you some stats etc

Electrical Forum

Welcome to the Electrical Forum at ElectriciansForums.net. The friendliest electrical forum online. General electrical questions and answers can be found in the electrical forum.
This website was designed, optimised and is hosted by Untold Media. Operating under the name Untold Media since 2001.
Back
Top
AdBlock Detected

We get it, advertisements are annoying!

Sure, ad-blocking software does a great job at blocking ads, but it also blocks useful features of our website. For the best site experience please disable your AdBlocker.

I've Disabled AdBlock