Torque screwdriver settings

[gazdkw82]

I'm thinking of getting a torque screwdriver but unsure if it's worth it. Is it a regulation now or just good practice now for connections to be torqued? If so is it just for CU's?

 

[RWJ]

It's not a regulation as far as I'm aware. I haven't bothered myself after our area engineer told us about horror stories of terminals not done up tight enough when using a torque screwdriver.
While he is happy for us not to need them, so am I!!!

 

[gazdkw82]

That's my concern. Iv used one on a CU and I was a little surprised when it clicked to indicate it was tight enough. I just thought it highlighted how heavy handed I was

 

[Midwest]

There is not a regulation, as far as I'm aware, that you have to use a torque driver to tighten terminals, but there is reg 134.1.1, .....good workmanship......take account of manufactures instructions, and as most CU manufacturers detail torque settings for MCB's etc, it something to consider.

I have one and use it on MCB's etc, but I also been known to use my wrist torque settings!

Issue with them, is they need annual calibration, and without the current manufacturers instructions, how do you know the settings for an older MCB etc?

 

[gazdkw82]

So who does the calibration? Let's say your changing a CU or putting a new circuit in, do you think it's a necessary tool to have?

 

[Midwest]

That's my concern. Iv used one on a CU and I was a little surprised when it clicked to indicate it was tight enough. I just thought it highlighted how heavy handed I was

Overtightening can have similar effect as under tightening (incorrect terminology)

 

[gazdkw82]

That's why I'm considering getting one. Iv seen one that goes from 0.8-2.0Nm, is that a large enough range?

 

[Midwest]

So who does the calibration? Let's say your changing a CU or putting a new circuit in, do you think it's a necessary tool to have?

If you have spare cash, it could be useful. If you haven't, its a luxury. That said, if your CU has 'issues' 'cos you've overtightened it, you could be scrutinised 'cos you haven't a torque driver.

They'll be some old sweats along shortly, to shoot me down in flames

 

[Midwest]

That's why I'm considering getting one. Iv seen one that goes from 0.8-2.0Nm, is that a large enough range?

Think 1-5 would be a better range. Just found this, re my other post;
http://www.elecsa.co.uk/documents/c...l-downloads/manufacturer-torque-settings.aspx

They ain't cheap;
http://www.screwfix.com/p/wiha-vde-...gclsrc=aw.ds&dclid=CI-Npf2L_9QCFaIx0wodP7EJsA

 

[MisterE]

Iv seen one that goes from 0.8-2.0Nm, is that a large enough range?

Just had a quick "google" and spotted this :-
http://www.elecsa.co.uk/documents/c...l-downloads/manufacturer-torque-settings.aspx
It looks like the 0.8 to 2.0 is a bit limited

Edit :- Midwest is quicker on the keyboard than me :-(

 

[Davisonp]

That's my concern. Iv used one on a CU and I was a little surprised when it clicked to indicate it was tight enough. I just thought it highlighted how heavy handed I was

I started using mine regularly when a couple of MCB’s I was tightening split as I had over tightened.

 

[Davisonp]

Think 1-5 would be a better range. Just found this, re my other post;
http://www.elecsa.co.uk/documents/c...l-downloads/manufacturer-torque-settings.aspx

They ain't cheap;
http://www.screwfix.com/p/wiha-vde-torque-screwdriver-set-11-pieces/2581K?kpid=2581K&cm_mmc=Google-_-Product%20Listing%20Ads-_-Sales%20Tracking-_-sales%20tracking%20url&gclid=Cj0KEQjwy4zLBRCOg6-4h6vs3cUBEiQAN-yzfpjbadEDZZ3_YRtbSYKAPVQaB6U2nkeERF5Z5cKVtwoaAohT8P8HAQ&gclsrc=aw.ds&dclid=CI-Npf2L_9QCFaIx0wodP7EJsA

I have one of these, and ELECSA are happy. Should only be used AFTER safe isolation as not VDE.

“Sealey Tools, Draper Tools | Workshopping.co.uk - https://www.workshopping.co.uk/product/draper-expert-torque-screwdriver-kit-1-5nm/75170/”

I also have a set of these.

“CK 422001 SET OF 2 x MODULO SCREWDRIVER INSERT BITS (SIZE 1 & 2) - 1/4" HEX | eBay - https://www.ebay.co.uk/i/300832659311?chn=ps&dispItem=1&adgroupid=43111904323&rlsatarget=pla-379771106047&abcId=1128936&adtype=pla&merchantid=7258374&poi=&googleloc=1006474&device=c&campaignid=857338014&crdt=0”

 

[gazdkw82]

Really? So any torque screwdriver will do then?

 

[telectrix]

bloody things . fit for limp wristed poouufs. if you can't tighten a screw down properly, maybe time for a career change to lawyer/accountant/politician/shelf stacker.

 

[gazdkw82]

it's not about that telectrix, it's about wanting to provide a professional and safe service. No matter how good you think you are, you don't have a torque mechanism in your wrist and I bet you have over or under tightened a mcb before. No ones perfect but we can all try to be

 

[telectrix]

back to basics. tighten, wriggle, pull. tighten again. beats any fancy contraption going.

 

[SparkySy]

As has been said it's not regulation yet but the Stroma assessment guy said it is good practice and that it is worth doing as then you have a leg to stand on if something goes wrong, at least you have compliance with the manufacturers instructions! I have and use the wiha one, it has the range you need for almost all manufacturers. Is nice to use too
Sy

 

[Midwest]

it's not about that telectrix, it's about wanting to provide a professional and safe service. No matter how good you think you are, you don't have a torque mechanism in your wrist and I bet you have over or under tightened a mcb before. No ones perfect but we can all try to be

I've heard he's always doing them off his wrists

 

[telectrix]

we never had these new-fangled talking screwdrivers 50 years ago. and we never had loose terminations either. is it a catch22? the invention of the drivers propagates loose terminals, or is it loose terminals propagate the tools. don't matter a damn now anyway. we fit metal CUs, so poor termination is cured at a stroke.

 

[gazdkw82]

Things change. It was changed before me and there isn't much I can do about it. Some things were probably better back then but a damn sight more has improved over the years.

I'm new to the industry and I'm trying to work and adhere to what is current and what is going to improve standards.

 

[telectrix]

Things change. It was changed before me and there isn't much I can do about it. Some things were probably better back then but a damn sight more has improved over the years.

I'm new to the industry and I'm trying to work and adhere to what is current and what is going to improve standards.

you'll always get tghis banter off us old farts. jeez, it took me years to get used to these new-fangled meters with digtoes read out. kept tapping mine to try and see a needle move.

 

[Midwest]

we never had these new-fangled talking screwdrivers 50 years ago. and we never had loose terminations either. is it a catch22? the invention of the drivers propagates loose terminals, or is it loose terminals propagate the tools. don't matter a damn now anyway. we fit metal CUs, so poor termination is cured at a stroke.

Yep 50 years ago we moved from newspaper to this;

 

[gazdkw82]

It's all good

I just want to be positive and move forward

 

[Specialist]

I started using mine regularly when a couple of MCB’s I was tightening split as I had over tightened.

Told you Not to have Weetabix for breakfast

 

[Pete999]

Told you Not to have Weetabix for breakfast

You mean stopped using them don't you mate

 

[Specialist]

it's not about that telectrix, it's about wanting to provide a professional and safe service. No matter how good you think you are, you don't have a torque mechanism in your wrist and I bet you have over or under tightened a mcb before. No ones perfect but we can all try to be

Buying a torque screwdriver won't allow to provide a professional or safe service & if you think buying a torque screwdriver will help you become perfect at the job then God help you.
Give it a couple of years & they'll no doubt change their minds and say they shouldn't be used.

 

[Pete999]

Buying a torque screwdriver won't allow to provide a professional or safe service & if you think buying a torque screwdriver will help you become perfect at the job then God help you.
Give it a couple of years & they'll no doubt change their minds and say they shouldn't be used.

They push trainees into buying torque screwdriver sets during the Part P courses don't they?

 

[Midwest]

Pete, you gonna to have to let this Part P thing go

 

[Pete999]

Pete, you gonna to have to let this Part P thing go

Why?

 

[Wilko]

back to basics. tighten, wriggle, pull. tighten again. beats any fancy contraption going.

In support - I have a torque wrench and I can assure it does not settle the cable like Tel's technique. IMO it protects the MCB from damage but it doesn't guarantee a good connection.

 

[gazdkw82]

Buying a torque screwdriver won't allow to provide a professional or safe service & if you think buying a torque screwdriver will help you become perfect at the job then God help you.
Give it a couple of years & they'll no doubt change their minds and say they shouldn't be used.

Why won't it help me to provide a safer and professional service? It's a way of accurately and consistently measuring whats happening. If not for my own security and peace of mind but for any circumstances where a discrepancy may occur and proof of quality of work is required.

 

[Pete999]

Why won't it help me to provide a safer and professional service? It's a way of accurately and consistently measuring whats happening. If not for my own security and peace of mind but for any circumstances where a discrepancy may occur and proof of quality of work is required.

Nothing like the feel of a good old tweak with the driver to make you feel secure, there are some who admit to using an electric screwdriver to make connections

 

[telectrix]

Nothing like the feel of a good old tweak with the driver to make you feel secure, there are some who admit to using an electric screwdriver to make connections

i do use one. and it's got torque settings.

 

[Pete999]

i do use one. and it's got torque settings.

Shock. horror.

 

[telectrix]

Why won't it help me to provide a safer and professional service? It's a way of accurately and consistently measuring whats happening. If not for my own security and peace of mind but for any circumstances where a discrepancy may occur and proof of quality of work is required.

if you feel comfortable using one, then by all means, that's your preference. same as some like the notches in sidecutters for stripping, some don't.it's all down to persolnal likes.

 

[Specialist]

Why won't it help me to provide a safer and professional service? It's a way of accurately and consistently measuring whats happening. If not for my own security and peace of mind but for any circumstances where a discrepancy may occur and proof of quality of work is required.

Maybe you need to learn to tighten screws properly with a real screwdriver first, Incorrectly tightened connections are down to the operator not the tool used.
What's going to happen when your nice little torque screwdriver is in for calibration or won't reach the torque specified by a manufacturer ? Are you going to stop doing the job ? ( Very good old saying: Only a bad workman blames his tools for poor work). I've been doing this c**p for over 40 years & never had a problem with either loose or overtightened screws. Whether that be on CU's or accessories and truth be told I seriously doubt that Pete, Tel or any of the other guys have either.

 

[gazdkw82]

I'm sure your a fine electrician, sure sounds like your the perfect example.

I have never had any issues with loose or over tightened terminals however I am new to the industry and Iv heard it mentioned before about torque settings and iv also seen a few sparks using them. I was just intrigued.

I better go and speak with quickfit and tell them to get rid of the torque impact guns and use a socket/wrench and some old fashioned man power.

 

[telectrix]

as i said before, it's what you personally feel comfortable with.

 

[Midwest]

Installed some Hager RCBO's today. Dusted off me torque driver, give it a whirl I thought, prompted by this thread. Read the manufacturers instructions for the torque settings...................................tumble weed............................nothing, didley squat, zilch. So tightened it to a tight thing, then a little more.

The product data sheet on their web site has the details, not useful unless you got a 4g signal

 

[gazdkw82]

How old is the rcbo? Is it
New?