Don't shoot me, I need some clarification.

[Michelle Salt]

I'm not an electrician, I'm a chemist, and although I think I know the answer I need a clarified clear answer from someone who knows what they are on about.

Its not strictly electrical but my MS (multiple Sclerosis) nurse told me what MS was using this analogy.

Imagine you have a lamp... and a little mouse comes along a nibbles half way through the cable. The lamp wont work properly. Now imagine a rat comes and nibbles all the way through the cable, the lamp doesn't work at all. MS is like the mouse!!!

So I heard this, and aside from momentarily wanting to punch her in the face for being patronising, my brain went to the basic science. Am I right in thinking that we would have a dead mouse and a dead rat and that infact the lamp would either work or it wouldn't (obviously with a dangerous wire).

Sorry, don't yell for stupid questions, but this is bugging me and I am amidst writing a letter explaining why my medical team suck.

Also, where would one find a clear diagram to wire a cooker, my friend wired mine and the grill don't work along with the clock. I'm thinking the wiring oppose to a fault, any thoughts? How much is a general cooker wiring job?

 

[Wilko]

Hi M, sorry to hear of your troubles.
It certainly happens that we get called out to a fault and we find cables nibbled by rats and mice (or even nicked by two two legged rats). Personally I've not seen one zapped, as to stop the service working you only need to sever one of two wires, one of which is live and even that one is likely protected by the RCD safety switch these days. We are kind to all creatures .
Re your cooker, this is standard fare and so should not be hard to sort. Many good folks here if you want help.

 

[Rpa07]

Michelle, sorry to hear that you are going through something new and unknown.
The insulation on your wires that have nibbled in the analogy are the nerves losing some myelin sheath which is in fact the insulation to make sure the fire of nerve stays in that nerve and doesn't jump to another or not get to the axon on the end. The complete fire makes your muscle do what it should do when your brain thinks it or your automatic nervous system does it without you knowing. It's a good way to describe it, I guess you just may not like mice or rats!
Soya lecithin is one thing that makes up the fat that the body converts to myelin sheath. Don't know about any research round that but I do know that as my wife has depression issues due to meds taken for 18 years and I was thinking along these lines.
The cooker probably has internal issues if it's an all in one unless it's never worked from the start.
Anyway, welcome to the forum, if you want to take your mind off anything - hang out with us idiots. Regards Rob

 

[snowhead]

The cable analogy isn't that good the lamp will still work as designed.

I've got a more understandable one.

Imagine Railway lines are the nerves.

1 scrap man comes along and starts to take a small section of the track but fails leaving the track damaged.
Most of the time most of the train will get through, occasionally they'll be a crash.

Instead of the rat a Vauxhall Zafira comes along with several scrap men in it and they take a lot of the track.
None of the trains will get through.

 

[Michelle Salt]

Michelle, sorry to hear that you are going through something new and unknown.
The insulation on your wires that have nibbled in the analogy are the nerves losing some myelin sheath which is in fact the insulation to make sure the fire of nerve stays in that nerve and doesn't jump to another or not get to the axon on the end. The complete fire makes your muscle do what it should do when your brain thinks it or your automatic nervous system does it without you knowing. It's a good way to describe it, I guess you just may not like mice or rats!
Soya lecithin is one thing that makes up the fat that the body converts to myelin sheath. Don't know about any research round that but I do know that as my wife has depression issues due to meds taken for 18 years and I was thinking along these lines.
The cooker probably has internal issues if it's an all in one unless it's never worked from the start.
Anyway, welcome to the forum, if you want to take your mind off anything - hang out with us idiots. Regards Rob

Ha thank, you could replace my nurse

I understand what MS is though now, they just havent realised that after taking 5 years to get to the answer that google gave me 4 years ago. :-O I just wasnt sure her anaolgy explained it very well but I will stand corrected

Interesting about the Soy Lecithin, I will be looking into that

 

[Marvo]

Okay, here's my guess. The mouse is toast but the rat has a 50/50 chance of still being around to tell the tale.

Assuming the lamp is on when the rodents attack;

If the mouse nibbles halfway through the cable either he nibbles through the live wire in which case he gets a shock that kills him because he's standing on earth or he nibbles the neutral in which case he'll only get a shock when he actually severs the wire. The shock would probably occur from one side of his mouth to the other and seeing as his brain is in the middle I reckon he's toast or at least mostly lobotomised like Jack Nickolson in One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest. The lamp will already have stopped working.

Now the rat is a slightly different story. If he's the second wave of attack after the mouse has been then he'll survive if the mouse bit through the live wire already leaving him only the neutral to attack. If however the mouse bit through the neutral then the rat is also toast because he's going to succumb to a fatal amount of leakage current the moment he chomps the live wire.

Either way the lamp is completely non functional after the first wave of attack and you're absolutely correct that it's a poor analogy of how MS will affect a person. It's actually kinda worrying that a healthcare professional would even attempt to inform a patient over the age of 5 maybe with this type of story. If you would likea laymans explanation of MS maybe start with wikipedia or try here About MS | Multiple Sclerosis Society UK - https://www.mssociety.org.uk/what-is-ms/information-about-ms/about-ms.

**edit** Re-reading your opening post I think your biggest mistake here was not punching her in the face when she was clearly needing it.

 

[Michelle Salt]

Okay, here's my guess. The mouse is toast but the rat has a 50/50 chance of still being around to tell the tale.

Assuming the lamp is on when the rodents attack;

If the mouse nibbles halfway through the cable either he nibbles through the live wire in which case he gets a shock that kills him because he's standing on earth or he nibbles the neutral in which case he'll only get a shock when he actually severs the wire. The shock would probably occur from one side of his mouth to the other and seeing as his brain is in the middle I reckon he's toast or at least mostly lobotomised like Jack Nickolson in One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest. The lamp will already have stopped working.

Now the rat is a slightly different story. If he's the second wave of attack after the mouse has been then he'll survive if the mouse bit through the live wire already leaving him only the neutral to attack. If however the mouse bit through the neutral then the rat is also toast because he's going to succumb to a fatal amount of leakage current the moment he chomps the live wire.

Either way the lamp is completely non functional after the first wave of attack and you're absolutely correct that it's a poor analogy of how MS will affect a person. It's actually kinda worrying that a healthcare professional would even attempt to inform a patient over the age of 5 maybe with this type of story. If you would likea laymans explanation of MS maybe start with wikipedia or try here About MS | Multiple Sclerosis Society UK - https://www.mssociety.org.uk/what-is-ms/information-about-ms/about-ms.

**edit** Re-reading your opening post I think your biggest mistake here was not punching her in the face when she was clearly needing it.

Ha I was too shocked to move, and apparently its wrong to punch people in the face for stupidity!!

 

[Rpa07]

I've a feeling that the nurse was getting into more along the lines of insulation resistances and poor insulation but surely that can't be as unless they are the opposite of me where they were an electrician that then trained as a nurse! I did it the other way round - much more fun!

 

[Rpa07]

any body in the house called doctor bob.

Thats what my wife called me when we first met - she asked if i was a Doctor, I said 'No a nurse', She said 'Oh!' Still 8 years in!

 

[The Ghost]

Hi Michelle, I think that is a very poor analogy. However I think your grappling with it is a waste of time a complete red herring. Why do you not contact PALS and get assistance with communication in order to get the treatment you need. Most hospitals have a PALS office. They are very good at helping you with getting a clear diagnosis-prognosis. I think your time would be more effectively spent that way rather then grappling with mice and men, and maybe get an electrician for the cooker.

 

[GMES]

@buzzlightyear Please try and have a bit of respect, I won't repeat what you said as @darkwood already deleted it and rightly so, any more comments like that and you will be banned from the thread without hesitation.

@darkwood sorry for jumping in on the thread when you were already dealing with it but the forum is here to help people not come out with comments like that.

 

[Michelle Salt]

Thanks guys, I am a aware some people seem confused and or offended by my question. I heard the anaolgy and genuinely wanted to know if the lamp would work or the mouse and rat would be dead.


@Vortigern mentioned that they think my time would be spent more effectively speaking to PALS which is exactly what the letter I mentioned in first post was, BUT I am also entitled to spend my time trying to find out the answer to a question I do not know regarding whether the lamp would indeed function. I just figured a sight full of electricians would be a good place to ask rather than somewhere random where people think they know. It may not be prudent to my health but it is prudent to my knowledge and the fact that I always try to find the answers to things I don't know. I need to fill my time with more than TV sometimes.

As for Doctor Bob, I chose to ignore, I was aware before I posted some people would get agitated by my question and chose to do it anyway

Thanks everyone who answered. I'm thinking I understand the answer to my question now, in ideal conditions (unless your a mouse and a rat), dead rodents and lamp (unless wires are miraculously left intact). I'm going to live with that answer and be grateful in the knowledge that my brain still works lol, even if my explanations suck!!

 

[GMES]

You're welcome Michelle and please don't be put off by the odd silly comment, please feel free to ask more questions in the future.
Good luck with everything.