Electrical Installation Level 3 Course - Distance Learning?

[Charlie_Don't_Surf]

Hi,

Just wondered if anyone knows whether there is such a thing as a distance learning version of the level 3 (C&G or EAL) Electrical Installation course, but which isn't one of the '8 week wonder' type courses, i.e. is an actual full year of study. As I understand it, the 8 week wonder type courses aren't really viewed by employers as being legitimate. At least that's what members here advised me on previous threads some years back

For context, I have just completed my level 2 Elec Installation EAL course, and I've been scouring the colleges in the local area as well as father afield for a level 3 to get on to, sadly the provider which I did my level 2 with doesn't offer a level 3 evening or part time course starting next September. Nor are there any other colleges within a feasible distance who are offering level 3 part time / on an evening study basis

One of the other students on our course mentioned that a friend of his is studying level 3 via distance learning, but wasn't able to elucidate about where or with which provider this was with. He mentioned that because the level 3 is apparently mainly theory, the bulk of it is able to be done via distance learning (including zoom meetings I guess?) and that there is then also a residential week/ weekend in which the practical aspects can be completed by students attending the college.
I'm really keen to get on a level 3 course. I see so many vacancies on job sites which require both level 2 and 3 and it seems I need to get the level 3 under my belt (plus more practical experience in the field, which I am getting as I'm now employed as an electrician's mate with a local firm) to be able to look to move up in terms of better salary.

Any feedback gratefully welcome

 

[rewireIT]

Hi,

Just wondered if anyone knows whether there is such a thing as a distance learning version of the level 3 (C&G or EAL) Electrical Installation course, but which isn't one of the '8 week wonder' type courses, i.e. is an actual full year of study. As I understand it, the 8 week wonder type courses aren't really viewed by employers as being legitimate. At least that's what members here advised me on previous threads some years back

Nobody asks where you got your certs from.

The info on the course is the info on the course, doesn't matter how long it takes you to absorb it.

One of the other students on our course mentioned that a friend of his is studying level 3 via distance learning, but wasn't able to elucidate about where or with which provider this was with. He mentioned that because the level 3 is apparently mainly theory, the bulk of it is able to be done via distance learning (including zoom meetings I guess?) and that there is then also a residential week/ weekend in which the practical aspects can be completed by students attending the college.
I'm really keen to get on a level 3 course. I see so many vacancies on job sites which require both level 2 and 3 and it seems I need to get the level 3 under my belt (plus more practical experience in the field, which I am getting as I'm now employed as an electrician's mate with a local firm) to be able to look to move up in terms of better salary.

Sounds like a little place near a place that rhymes with 'Bartford'.

What's your end goal - Is it to become 'fully' qualified ie NVQ + AM2?

If you're already employed as a mate, the level 3 isn't gonna get you work as an actual electrician and the only reason to get it in terms of job opportunity would be to progress onto the NVQ no questions asked. If you don't have the level 3 you have to prove 5 years experience to get onto the NVQ.

So imo if you wanna become fully qualified then it's best to just get it by any means necessary and then progress onto the NVQ, just know that the work you're doing as a mate will be much more valuable than the level 3 in terms of experience and skill.

Just know it alone won't lead to job opportunities other than what you're already doing.

 

[Charlie_Don't_Surf]

Nobody asks where you got your certs from.

The info on the course is the info on the course, doesn't matter how long it takes you to absorb it.

Sounds like a little place near a place that rhymes with 'Bartford'.

What's your end goal - Is it to become 'fully' qualified ie NVQ + AM2?

If you're already employed as a mate, the level 3 isn't gonna get you work as an actual electrician and the only reason to get it in terms of job opportunity would be to progress onto the NVQ no questions asked. If you don't have the level 3 you have to prove 5 years experience to get onto the NVQ.

So imo if you wanna become fully qualified then it's best to just get it by any means necessary and then progress onto the NVQ, just know that the work you're doing as a mate will be much more valuable than the level 3 in terms of experience and skill.

Just know it alone won't lead to job opportunities other than what you're already doing.

Hi

Thank you for the reply and advice. Re end goal - I'm not sure really. At the moment my goal is to be earning better money and continue learning. But earning more comes with time I suppose. Yes I would like to get the level 3, NVQ (or I'm told it's now called a portfolio? either way) and AM2 under my belt. So perhaps just biting the bullet and getting onto a lvl 3 course near, well, the place with the tunnel/crossing near london, which is what I presume you mean, if I can find that place, or a 8WW course if not, sounds like it might well be the way to go. Because I'm not getting any younger and frankly the uncertain state of the economy at the moment makes me feel a sense of urgency around getting qualified. After all, inflation and/or economic turbulence/collapse could render my savings worth far less, whereas if I can convert that into a qualification, well the value of that qualification can't be watered down by inflation. Basically I suppose I see it as a way of diversifying my assets, if nothing else.

I'm just thinking out loud really. I appreciate some of what I'm asking might seem rather confused - I've been seeking a mentor for quite a while, and have been unable to find one. There's so much to consider I kind of feel like I'm groping around in the dark a bit. Perhaps this is how it felt for a lot of now accomplished electricians, whether self employed in domestic, or working in industry, when they were at an earlier stage in their careers.

Surely though, if I see a job opportunity for better money than what I'm now on, which requires a couple of years experience in domestic, as well as a level 2 and 3, and the only aspect of that which I don't have is the level 3, then getting a level 3 would potentially make a difference to my salary? Even if I was only able to use it to negotiate a better rate with what I'm already doing?

Interesting to see you say that no-one asks where you got your certs from, but if I was to do a 8WW level 3 course and approach an employer with that on my CV, surely they would look at that less favourably than they would someone who had done a level 3 over the course of an academic year?

 

[rewireIT]

Hi

Thank you for the reply and advice. Re end goal - I'm not sure really. At the moment my goal is to be earning better money and continue learning. But earning more comes with time I suppose.

Ok so you can do that as a mate. Get your 18th edition and ECS/CSCS and IPAF and you'll be on around £16-£18/hr as a mate.

Yes I would like to get the level 3, NVQ (or I'm told it's now called a portfolio? either way) and AM2 under my belt.

The NVQ is comprised of a portfolio of all the jobs you will need to evidence you can do. So it will have eg pictures of you making off a socket, and a write up about how you did it, what you took into consideration, why you chose the cable size, what health and safety risks were there etc. You do that for various jobs and it forms your portfolio.

So perhaps just biting the bullet and getting onto a lvl 3 course near, well, the place with the tunnel/crossing near london, which is what I presume you mean, if I can find that place, or a 8WW course if not, sounds like it might well be the way to go. Because I'm not getting any younger and frankly the uncertain state of the economy at the moment makes me feel a sense of urgency around getting qualified. After all, inflation and/or economic turbulence/collapse could render my savings worth far less, whereas if I can convert that into a qualification, well the value of that qualification can't be watered down by inflation. Basically I suppose I see it as a way of diversifying my assets, if nothing else.

You'll get this stability as a mate. On site the mates/improvers are usually on 2 or 3 quid an hour less than the sparks. You should easily be able to get around £15+ / hr.

Surely though, if I see a job opportunity for better money than what I'm now on, which requires a couple of years experience in domestic, as well as a level 2 and 3, and the only aspect of that which I don't have is the level 3, then getting a level 3 would potentially make a difference to my salary? Even if I was only able to use it to negotiate a better rate with what I'm already doing?

I've never seen any adverts for unqualified sparks which demand level 3. You have to do some blagging in this game. Can you do the job? Then you put more experience on your CV than you have.

Interesting to see you say that no-one asks where you got your certs from, but if I was to do a 8WW level 3 course and approach an employer with that on my CV, surely they would look at that less favourably than they would someone who had done a level 3 over the course of an academic year?

You wouldn't put where you got it, just what quals you have.

I don't put that i got my 18th edition by figuring out the book and going straight for the exam. Most people claim you need to do a 3 day training course. I had lads at work telling me i needed to do one otherwise i'd fail. I got like 98% lol.

But importantly is on my CV it just says i've got my 18th, nothing about where or how.

It's only people online that scoff at where or how you did the qualification. In the real world nobody cares as long as you've got the actual skill to go with what your paperwork says. There are plenty of time served tradesmen who are utterly hopeless - apprenticeships are set up so you can't fail them, due to funding. (If there's a high failure rate, establishments have their funding pulled.)

If you can fix stuff to things, take instruction and not stand on your phone while someone's trying to hoist a 32mm armoured into the air, you can easily get a job on site making decent money. I knew one mate with no quals making £900 a week on site.

 

[nicebutdim]

You can of course blag your way to a decent wage, if you have the practical skills and some knowledge, but I don't seem any long term gain in that approach.

From what the OP has posted, it seems as though they've only recently begun working in the industry and wish to improve their earnings. As such, blagging a better wage may well backfire and leave quickly leave them without work.

I know from previous work that a could of options exist for distance learning, but I can't comment on the quality of training provided. While an evening or day release course would be preferable in terms of learning, distance learning would be preferable to a short course as it allows you to take the time needed to learn and understand the theory which underpins this course.

We all want more money, but I'd caution against focusing too much on short term earnings and take this opportunity to learn as much as possible in terms of practical skills and theoretical knowledge, in order to maximise future earnings.

It's interesting that the only respondents to this thread are both unqualified and took very different approaches to entering this industry later in life. There used to be another member of this forum who posted from numerous different accounts and was adamant that blagging your way through life was a much better option than the adult apprenticeship route I choose. We both started at the same time and I can't help wondering how they've progressed toward qualifying as a card carrying spark.

Perhaps some other members might weigh in, but in the meantime I'll point out that gaining initial verification and testing qualifications could add a few pounds to your hourly rate as a mate.

 

[nicebutdim]

- apprenticeships are set up so you can't fail them, due to funding. (If there's a high failure rate, establishments have their funding pulled.)

Failure in apprenticeships is by degree. Those who don't pass exams and assessments don't make it through each year, trending to drop out, lose jobs (and therefore apprenticeship) or get thrown out. This is why failure rates are low as those who make it to their final year tend to have the acquired knowledge and ability, not to mention dedication, required to complete the course.

As apprenticeships are completed with the independently assessed AM2, I see fail to see any substantiation for your claim that they are rigged. Adult apprenticeships are funded to the tune of course fees and no contribution toward wages is available beyond the age of 24.

Even if funding did exist, there is no benefit to any employer in carrying dead weight for the sake of having a wage partly paid. A useless apprentice is just that and will be dropped by an employer regardless of age or available funding, as carrying them costs a company money far more than any benefit gained through funding.

It is most certainly the case that there are poor electricians out there who've completed an apprenticeship, but a more pertinent question for the OP is how often people make the leap out of the domestic sector after completing an 8 week course? It does happen, but is it common?

If you can fix stuff to things, take instruction and not stand on your phone while someone's trying to hoist a 32mm armoured into the air, you can easily get a job on site making decent money. I knew one mate with no quals making £900 a week on site.

32mm SWA?

A good work ethic is essential for anyone wanting to earn a decent wage and have long term employment prospects, but I'd caution against aiming to be the exception who earns a good unskilled wage and focus instead on getting to the point where better pay is a given.

 

[Charlie_Don't_Surf]

Many thanks to you both for your replies. Honestly the number of options and cost/benefit analyses at this stage can be daunting, and I genuinely value the time taken by people like yourselves to help those at earlier stages in their career like me. It is helpful to read contrasting views on how others view and have experienced the journey to becoming a more experienced person within the electrical field.
There is much food for thought with what you've both shared, I will consider your feedback and it will help me to decide how to progress from here. Thank you

 

[Penguin]

Hi,

Just wondered if anyone knows whether there is such a thing as a distance learning version of the level 3 (C&G or EAL) Electrical Installation course, but which isn't one of the '8 week wonder' type courses, i.e. is an actual full year of study. As I understand it, the 8 week wonder type courses aren't really viewed by employers as being legitimate. At least that's what members here advised me on previous threads some years back

For context, I have just completed my level 2 Elec Installation EAL course, and I've been scouring the colleges in the local area as well as father afield for a level 3 to get on to, sadly the provider which I did my level 2 with doesn't offer a level 3 evening or part time course starting next September. Nor are there any other colleges within a feasible distance who are offering level 3 part time / on an evening study basis

One of the other students on our course mentioned that a friend of his is studying level 3 via distance learning, but wasn't able to elucidate about where or with which provider this was with. He mentioned that because the level 3 is apparently mainly theory, the bulk of it is able to be done via distance learning (including zoom meetings I guess?) and that there is then also a residential week/ weekend in which the practical aspects can be completed by students attending the college.
I'm really keen to get on a level 3 course. I see so many vacancies on job sites which require both level 2 and 3 and it seems I need to get the level 3 under my belt (plus more practical experience in the field, which I am getting as I'm now employed as an electrician's mate with a local firm) to be able to look to move up in terms of better salary.

Any feedback gratefully welcome

Depending on your age, if you’ve got your Level 2, then try and get a full apprenticeship with an electrical company, which means you get paid for one day release college level 3 course. (42 months) and earn money whilst studying.

 

[rewireIT]

Depending on your age, if you’ve got your Level 2, then try and get a full apprenticeship with an electrical company, which means you get paid for one day release college level 3 course. (42 months) and earn money whilst studying.

Personally i would do the level 3 course at college and work as a mate instead. Why spend 3 and a half years doing a single level 3 qualification (which is only the same level as an A Level let's not forget) on garbage money when you could get the same qual in 1 year of night school and learn on the ropes on site, earning £10/hr more than you will on an apprenticeship?

 

[nicebutdim]

You may have already seen it, but another recent thread contains quite a bit of back and forth in response to a similar question. A few other members had expressed opinions and it might assist you in deciding what move to make next.

Trade Skills 4 U waste of time?

I'm 24 and looking for a career change into the electrical industry. Could anyone advise me on the practicality of undertaking a fast track level 2 course with trade skills 4 u? I'm by no means expecting to be a fully qualified electrician by the end of this, I'm hoping to get the level 2...

www.electriciansforums.net

 

[Penguin]

Personally i would do the level 3 course at college and work as a mate instead. Why spend 3 and a half years doing a single level 3 qualification (which is only the same level as an A Level let's not forget) on garbage money when you could get the same qual in 1 year of night school and learn on the ropes on site, earning £10/hr more than you will on an apprenticeship?

Doing the Level 3, as well as working for a qualified tradesmen is the ideal route.

If you can do an 8-10 hr day on the tools then do an evening online course, then I applaud you for your focus and drive.

I’ve had apprentices who have taken the fast track sit down course and have the certification, AM2 but can’t do the NVQ as their on site skills and on site abilities are very poor.

 

[rewireIT]

Doing the Level 3, as well as working for a qualified tradesmen is the ideal route.

Personally i don't think the course is all that. I've read the whole thing, and understood it, and it definitely didn't make me an electrician. Everything i know how to do i picked up on site. I knew one guy who had got top marks in the Level 3 but in the real world couldn't do 2 way lighting.

Literally the first third of the Level 3 EAL book is red tape, statutes, acts of parliament, how to do job sheets, etc. Very little to do with actual electrics and zero to do with installation. Overall there is very little in the book that is going to make someone even half knowledgeable.

I’ve had apprentices who have taken the fast track sit down course and have the certification, AM2 but can’t do the NVQ as their on site skills and on site abilities are very poor.

You can't do your AM2 without your NVQ. Did you get them the wrong way round?

 

[Penguin]

Personally i don't think the course is all that. I've read the whole thing, and understood it, and it definitely didn't make me an electrician. Everything i know how to do i picked up on site. I knew one guy who had got top marks in the Level 3 but in the real world couldn't do 2 way lighting.

You can't do your AM2 without your NVQ. Did you get them the wrong way round?

With any Apprentice who’s approached me, I’d have a good chat, then given him/her/non-binary…. the following task.

A piece of A4 paper and ask them to draw out a 2x way lighting switch diagram..!!!

THEN I’d ask them to draw out the ‘2nd method’ of wiring a 2x way lighting switch diagram.!!!

IF THATS CORRECT

NOW I’m interested in them!!! And would ask them to include an intermediate switch.

And ask how MANY intermediate switches can I have in a lighting circuit and what do I have to have at the start and finish of that circuit.

It’s very disturbing that a lot of these freshly qualified people don’t know !!!!!

 

[rewireIT]

then given him/her/non-binary

I thought i was safe from that on here lol

A piece of A4 paper and ask them to draw out a 2x way lighting switch diagram..!!!

THEN I’d ask them to draw out the ‘2nd method’ of wiring a 2x way lighting switch diagram.!!!

IF THATS CORRECT

NOW I’m interested in them!!! And would ask them to include an intermediate switch.

And ask how MANY intermediate switches can I have in a lighting circuit and what do I have to have at the start and finish of that circuit.

The common? Unlimited switches?

It’s very disturbing that a lot of these freshly qualified people don’t know !!!!!

Mate i know fully qualified sparks who can't cut label and wrap cable properly.

 

[Penguin]

I thought i was safe from that on here lol

The common? Unlimited switches?

Mate i know fully qualified sparks who can't cut label and wrap cable properly.

I’m starting to like you.!

Please answer:-

Do Solar Panels just work in sunshine???

Can I receive an electrical shock when the Main Isolator is OFF.?

 

[rewireIT]

I’m starting to like you.!

Please answer:-

Do Solar Panels just work in sunshine???

Nope. They register voltage even when it's cloudy it just drops significantly. I don't know about at night since i've never tested panels at night.

Can I receive an electrical shock when the Main Isolator is OFF.?

What, from solar? Yes because it's fed from the panels not the main incomer.

 

[Penguin]

Nope. They register voltage even when it's cloudy it just drops significantly. I don't know about at night since i've never tested panels at night.

What, from solar? Yes because it's fed from the panels not the main incomer.

WELLDONE,

You can receive an electrical shock from solar panels, even at NIGHT with a full moon.

Also removing OLD fluorescent tube units through the Capacitor.

DC battery units..!!! (EV cars) etc

And obviously ‘lightning’ discharge up into your MET.

What is your career am, and where are you at in your quals, and what are you wishing to know.????

 

[rewireIT]

WELLDONE,

You can receive an electrical shock from solar panels, even at NIGHT with a full moon.

Also removing OLD fluorescent tube units through the Capacitor.

DC battery units..!!! (EV cars) etc

And obviously ‘lightning’ discharge up into your MET.

What is your career am, and where are you at in your quals, and what are you wishing to know.????

Right now I want to get qualified properly. I'm working as an improver, got my 18th, ipaf etc and work in commercial. Have a fair bit of solar experience (roughly 100 installs solo). Been doing basic electrics for nearly 20 years but until the late 2010s was only doing them here and there. Then I decided to specialise and do only electrics full time.

I have a lot of silly questions since I look at stuff and think 'hmm how does that actually work' which led me to signing up here. I'll often know how to wire something but nit know how it works internally or whatever.

Got my T+I next which in hoping to book on at the end of the year.

 

[Penguin]

Right now I want to get qualified properly. I'm working as an improver, got my 18th, ipaf etc and work in commercial. Have a fair bit of solar experience (roughly 100 installs solo). Been doing basic electrics for nearly 20 years but until the late 2010s was only doing them here and there. Then I decided to specialise and do only electrics full time.

I have a lot of silly questions since I look at stuff and think 'hmm how does that actually work' which led me to signing up here. I'll often know how to wire something but nit know how it works internally or whatever.

Got my T+I next which in hoping to book on at the end of the year.

Hi rewireIT,
You sound like you’ve got plenty of hands on experience, and installing roughly 100 solo installs of Solar, is all good examples of competence. If you haven’t done your I&Testing, then WHOs signing off this work.??

There’s NO such thing as a silly question!!!

Electrical installs are changing all the time.

We never had ‘Dirty Electrics’ 20yrs ago, but due to DC controlling units in modern appliances were now dealing with this.

Why can’t you just complete an online level 3, and keep learning with the company that is giving this work??!!

 

[rewireIT]

Hi rewireIT,
You sound like you’ve got plenty of hands on experience, and installing roughly 100 solo installs of Solar, is all good examples of competence. If you haven’t done your I&Testing, then WHOs signing off this work.??

The QS. He personally trained me in how to test the installs so he knows my testing was how he wanted it. I was only required to Ze and PFC the board and Zs the circuit.

Why can’t you just complete an online level 3, and keep learning with the company that is giving this work??!!

Would have to do my Level 2 first and i'm not prepared to do 2+ years at college when i'm eligible to go straight for my Experienced Worker Route NVQ 2346.