Help New Kitchen Ring on 17th

[linzilou72]

Hi Guys wondering if you could give me a bit of advice here.

I had been asked by a friend of a friend to do a last minute job on a kitchen as he had been let down by his previous sparks ( now I know why)

Its an old wylex board which is full in fact client had brother in law come round and fit the shower, he did this by removing the cooker circuit and using that but cooker was gas and only being used for ignition.

Thing is when I went to split the kitchen ring found (bloody knew it) that they only had one power ring for whole house inc recent loft conversion wtf. So JB ring back together and run new ring back to board. But now have nowhere to put cooker (changed to electric 4.9kw) and kitchen ring. Normally under 16th I would put in garage unit from separate tails , as I am still getting to grips with 17th is this still ok waddya think??

And also fiding hard to fing garage unit with big enough RCD 30mA as its two 32a circuits???

Actually let me revise above only ever used garage unit for loft conversions 1 x 6A and 1x20 or 32 depending on ring or radial etc. That was all ok as these rooms would not really have any large loads. But the kitchen in question is tiny only has one socket above counter and dishwasher thats it. wm in cupbard under stairs on house ring as is fridge.

So what do you recommend I did think about running away!

I did advise them to get new CU but they just don't have the money 3 kids blah blah lots of bills etc.


Can anyone advise please.

 

[EasyFox]

Hi Guys wondering if you could give me a bit of advice here.

I had been asked by a friend of a friend to do a last minute job on a kitchen as he had been let down by his previous sparks ( now I know why)

Its an old wylex board which is full in fact client had brother in law come round and fit the shower, he did this by removing the cooker circuit and using that but cooker was gas and only being used for ignition.

Thing is when I went to split the kitchen ring found (bloody knew it) that they only had one power ring for whole house inc recent loft conversion wtf. So JB ring back together and run new ring back to board. But now have nowhere to put cooker (changed to electric 4.9kw) and kitchen ring. Normally under 16th I would put in garage unit from separate tails , as I am still getting to grips with 17th is this still ok waddya think??

And also fiding hard to fing garage unit with big enough RCD 30mA as its two 32a circuits???

Actually let me revise above only ever used garage unit for loft conversions 1 x 6A and 1x20 or 32 depending on ring or radial etc. That was all ok as these rooms would not really have any large loads. But the kitchen in question is tiny only has one socket above counter and dishwasher thats it. wm in cupbard under stairs on house ring as is fridge.

So what do you recommend I did think about running away!

I did advise them to get new CU but they just don't have the money 3 kids blah blah lots of bills etc.


Can anyone advise please.

(1) split the tails as you say & install a bog standard 100a dp mainswitced cu then use RCBO's. check equip bonds are correct csa & in place

(2) change the existing cu

So what do you recommend I did think about running away!

See this attitude all to frequently on sparky forums now. Why run from the job, a little thought & knowing the regs & it's easily solved.
Falling at the first sign of something out of the ordinary seems to be the norm now.

Get on and do the job stop being a fairy

 

[stevie h]

Crabtree Starbreaker Garage Kit - NoLinkingToThis, Where the Trade Buys

Stick one of theses in with a 20a cooker and 32a ring

 

[wattsup]

change the board, £80 from screwfix, do them a favour -

 

[linzilou72]

Cheers stevie h thats exactly what I was thinking but because I have been too busy working not really examined 17th properly yet.

I was joking about the runnning away EasyFox did say about changing whole board and leaving them with spare ways in case they added extension etc etc. But they don't want to pay for updates trying to do everything on cheap. and I just know once you change from the ol rewirables it throws up a whole host of problems.

Problem is I still have to pay my bills and i have been caught out doing stuff for next to nothing before.

Gonna pop into screwfix today and have a look.

cheers fellas

 

[Shakey]

Cheers stevie h thats exactly what I was thinking but because I have been too busy working not really examined 17th properly yet.

I was joking about the runnning away EasyFox did say about changing whole board and leaving them with spare ways in case they added extension etc etc. But they don't want to pay for updates trying to do everything on cheap. and I just know once you change from the ol rewirables it throws up a whole host of problems.

Problem is I still have to pay my bills and i have been caught out doing stuff for next to nothing before.

Gonna pop into screwfix today and have a look.

cheers fellas

lets be honest, how many customers have you met who have said "i just want it right, money is no object where the safety of my family is concerned"

nope they are always broke

you know the story - the landlord who wants a PIR for his rental property but needs it 'on the cheap' because he's strapped and times are hard.

But he's rich enough to own two freekin houses though aint he!

 

[jibtech]

and I just know once you change from the ol rewirables it throws up a whole host of problems.

i wanted to comment on this but it took me so long to work out how to quote you i sorta forgot what....... gimme a break look at the time this was posted

i think it was from the angle of not problems potential faults or somesuch blither blather

personally i would try and find them the cheapest C.U you can. leave yourself time for a bit of fault finding maybe afterwards and knock up the two prices for them.

as you seem to have options pass them on to the customer with your bestest advice.....now bed thud zzzzzzzzzzz

 

[linzilou72]

Cheers guys for advice, it's just one of those houses, Put garage unit in, customer asked me to change kitchen light and guess what no earth at all. Old school wiring just twin. apparently the guy who owned the house before was an electrician.

They didn't want me to rectify problem complaining about money again, asked me to put up old flourescent back up I refused to do it stating that I will not install anything that could be potentially fatal.

I also ended up having an argument with them later on that day as they had 3 lighting circuits in one 6A rewireable, I said it wasn't done to 16th ed regs they said it was as they had loft conversion in 2002 and building control signed it off

I thinkthe sparks that done it just sent the certs in and it was accepted. Told them 16th has been in for 15 years and they suddenly went silent. The house is full of bad wiring, everything done on the cheap, brother in law put in shower circuit which melted the switch.

Tried to explain that the regs were in place for their safety not to increase cost. what the hell are you supposed to do with clients like this????

I think it's a shame we can't be like corgi guys and slap a disconnection notice on it.

Oh and Easyfox I do know the regs pretty well 16th anyway I always put protect socket outlets with RCD's etc and am ultra safety aware.
I think the reason I put the orginal post was because some teenage boys had stolen money from my purse my sim card and memory stick from my phone!, I had been kept up all the previous night by the ol man stumbling home drunk, snoring farting and breathing on me with breath like a pint left in the sun for a month. I was tired, hungry and been harranged into taking the job by a mate. Run into wholesalers in morning to pick up materials got a quick look at a new 17th cu with 3 sections and suddenly thought am I missing something???? Do I need to add additional protection I wasn't aware off. So you could say it was temp insanity. But all the same being a sole trader it's good to get feedback from others.

 

[EasyFox]

Linzilou please dont think I was having a go at you as that wasnt my intention.

Oh and Easyfox I do know the regs pretty well 16th anyway

17th will be a doddle if your ok with 16th.

I had been kept up all the previous night by the ol man stumbling home drunk, snoring farting and breathing on me with breath like a pint left in the sun for a month

I have the same problem with her indoors, gawd bless her

They didn't want me to rectify problem complaining about money again, asked me to put up old flourescent back up I refused to do it stating that I will not install anything that could be potentially fatal.

Fair play to you, on reflection I'd have done the same or offered a cheap class2 fitting. But hey what can you do when they start whining about cost....indeed cost or safety the mind boggles dont it

I think it's a shame we can't be like corgi guys and slap a disconnection notice on it.

Boy can you picture the customers faces " yes sir I can re-energise but only after it's re-wired"

I think the reason I put the orginal post was because some teenage boys had stolen money from my purse my sim card and memory stick from my phone!

My wife had her wedding & engagement rings taken last weekend. Taken from the kitchen windowsil sad thing is it has to be someone we know as all that were there were family & freinds.

So you could say it was temp insanity

We've all been there

But all the same being a sole trader it's good to get feedback from others.

Couldn't agree more none of us know it all (except you shaker me old mate ), like the old BT ad used to say "It's good to talk".

 

[dazsafc]

what is a class 2 fitting - is it plastic

 

[KFORDHUNTER]

Not really mate, its a double insulated fitting, no chance of the conductors connecting to earth, hence there is no need for an earth connection, ideal if you have no earth at fitting

I think that is right, i know i will be corrected if i am wrong

 

[mpfisher@hotmai]

You know you're right mate

Mark

 

[bigal]

Lovely end to a lovely thread
Big Al