Question: Worrying incompetance or just minor niggles in the last minute rush??

[Worcester]

Couple of other points having just read your latest post

1) According to the 2nd edition guide (3rd not yet ratified) there should be a second isolator lockable in the off position only by means of a padlock, near the aditional CU.
2) Have they earthed the array? - There should be an earth cable coimg from the rails to either an earth spike or the main earth depending upon your incoming supply type. (PME etc)

They are clearly incompetent and will just bodge the fixes to look right. - I know we're not perfect, your installation however would make a good case study for 'cowboy builders' or 'rogue traders'

 

[Earthstore]

I am sorry, but even though it has been difficult times, I would not let that installer back in the house. It really does not look safe!
Just pay somebody else to refit the whole job.

Are the panels different sizes? or does it just look that way in the photo?
The bottom row look like they are clamped on the short side too.

Also noticed that there is no lockable AC isolator by consumer unit.

The sad thing here is how many other installs have this company completed for customers, that may believe they have a quality install because, as its not their profession, do not know any different.

 

[VMan]

circuit not labelled either, circuit diagrams? schematic? installer details?

 

[moggy1968]

I would offer to do it but we're stacked until the new year I'm afraid. I would definately say don't get the original guys back. this isn't sloppy work, it's incompetence, and that won't change when they come back.

 

[SolarCity]

The photos of the loft installation are an absolute abortion. Absolutely jaw dropping. The lack of effort to get this right in the first place is hugely depressing.

I agree with what has been said above. The installation is clearly in such a state that I wouldn't let them anywhere near your house.

I worry for this firm's other customers and I would strongly urge a phone call to someone at MCS. Strictly speaking, you should be giving them a chance to put these things right but they are so far off the mark that I really don't think they should be given the opportunity. I'd urge you to take Worcester's offer up. You will be getting a good job, peace of mind, and you will not be paying any more than you should have in the first place.

 

[moggy1968]

I think a call to trading standards would also be in order

 

[mjanesuk]

Just to add, if you look closely at the labels they put on the main CU and the smaller PV CU, they have put the inverter sticker on the main CU!! and the DC isolator sticker on the PV CU.

Thanks for all the comments and suggestions of locking the doors and keeping them out.

BUT
I have a concern with the FIT and MCS cert. 1. could they void the MCS cert if I dont pay the rest? The one thing B. Gas said needd not to change was the MCS cert number.. 2 the panels on the MCS cert are not the correct type, manufacturer or BABT (full house!), as they put down the ZNShine details (long story read early posts). H have tracked down the new details from the German co. who are rebadging them (they were certificated last Fri). Do I need this on the MCS Cert? Y/N Can only the previous installer do this? Y/N by going to MCS are they likely to say its all bobbins so I cant get the FIT as the install was not to MCS standards.

I have 3 scratched panels, one 50cm+ (on top of everything else) any ideas how to get these replaced then tell them to go away?

Ideas to resolve this? Concerns? Light at end of tunnel...?

 

[MorganPVI]

So long as your FiT form is accepted, you'll hopefully be able to work through the issues. TBH every single part of the install and paperwork is FUBAR. You should hold on to the reamining money and use it to get one of the nearer installers on this forum to sort it out for you - at least you'll know its been done right. Minor scratches on the panels are the least of your worries.

 

[moggy1968]

ask yourself, is someone from the feed in tariff team going to climb onto my roof and remove a panel to check it is correct?

 

[SolarCity]

I think your best course of action now would be to speak to the MCS with your concerns. The FITs deadline is an issue so you do need to be careful. If you explain this to the MCS then they should be able to offer a solution. If you don't want these panels to end up on your front lawn then I'd make the phone call now. Explain to them that you have urgent concerns which have been confirmed by other installers and that you have had an offer from another installer to put it right.

The correct solution from them, I would imagine, should be a swift site visit from the certifying body responsible for the installing company followed by them agreeing to arranging another installer to come in an sort it. However, I suspect that the response from the MCS may be a little less straightforward.

 

[moggy1968]

I reported a contractor to ELECSA a while ago for multiple breaches of 1771 and leaving an installation in a dangerous condition.
they weren't interested, at all. They said it is not their responsibility to police their members. which concerned me somewhat!!

 

[BruceB]

Be very careful and do not get emotional on this.
You have a number of objectives, which may contradict each other at times.
I suggest you want to:
- protect you entitlement to FIT at 43.3p
- protect your £3K retention - you may need it to sort out the problems
- protect your legal position as it may end up in the small claims court, by either you or them
- sort out your installation
not necessarily in that order.

I could write a small essay on each, but will just do a few points as you need to think through the detail yourself.

On the 43.3p. The MCS certificate is vital. You do not want the installer to mess it up before you have your contract with the FIT supplier. The installer can change the details at will and have it reissued. I suggest try to get them to put correct panel details on it and re-issue it to you. Send that to your supplier and keep a copy. You will also need to provide your supplier with proof of ownership. Have you already done so? Have they accepted it? If not you may need a receipted invoice.

On the £3K. Say what you need to but do not part with it until you are absolutely happy. It is your main leverage.

On the legal side. If you want to succeed in the small claims court you will (almost certainly) need to give the firm's complaints procedure a chance. So make some specific complaints and invite them to correct them. One of the requests should be that they pay for an independant engineer's inspection as there is so much wrong with it. If they will not, then do so yourself and deduct from retention monies. You may get someone here willing to inspect it for you.

On the sorting out, first give them a chance, it only has to be one chance. Get an independent report. And find someone reliable with a good reputation.

Regards
Bruce

 

[Scooby]

What a hellish situation, mjanesuk.

You do need to be a little careful, tho'. My understanding is that - by law - you need to give the original installer an opportunity (possibly as many as three...) to put things right. If you don't, you could leave yourself open to being sued by them to recover their losses - final payment, in this case. Mind you, I also understand that there are some cases where, if you can prove that the standard of the work was sooo bad - including being unsafe, for instance, then you could be justified in telling them to get lost and getting someone else to complete/fix the job. Should they then try and sue you, the judge will almost certainly come down in your favour. From what I've seen from your catalogue of errors, I think I know what the judge would say. It ain't writ in stone, tho', so perhaps it's worth getting some legal advice?


(IGNORE THIS POST - DO AS BRUCE^ SAYS!!!)

 

[moggy1968]

This claim (if taken as the whole value of the job) is almost certainly too large to be within the scope of the small claims court, which is unfortunate as you may have a case against them for more than the amount outstanding given the appaling standard of work. Under the terms of the sale of goods act, which applies to the supply of services as well as goods, the goods supplied must be of 'merchantable quality'. An installation with numerous breaches of the regulations clearly isn't.
The goods must also be 'as described' which again they clear aren't.
From your installers point of view the outstanding balance is within the limits but I don't know if the limits apply to the whole invoice amount or just the claim amount.
do you perhaps have legal aid on your house insurance, credit card or similar. I think you need proper advice on this

 

[BruceB]

Small claims court currently goes to £5K I believe, which ought to be able to cover the claim for any remedial work in this case. It is normally the size of the claim that matters not the overall value of the job in determining which track the claim procedes along in the county court.

But do not rush to legal action. Make simple clear requests for mistakes to be recified at this stage so you do not prejudice some of your other objectives.

 

[moggy1968]

yep, £5000 i believe

 

[solarsavings]

Perhaps you should consider speaking to these people How to complain about goods and services : Directgov - Government, citizens and rights

 

[pogson6]

I think this is a classic case of how NOT to do a job. I really hope you get it sorted out to your satisfaction.
Do give the company notification of all these problems as they may be as horrified as most of the installers reading this post!

Whether right or wrong a lot of companies sub contract installs under their name, so give them chance to at least respond to your concerns, before taking any knee jerk reaction!

 

[SolarCity]

Whether right or wrong a lot of companies sub contract installs under their name, so give them chance to at least respond to your concerns, before taking any knee jerk reaction!

I agree to a certain extent. However, this install is SO bad that I have a certain amount of anger for the clowns that employed them. In all honesty, from the roof down - roof hooks, panels, rails, inverters, cabling, stickers, trunking - is there anything that doesn't need redoing?

 

[Earthstore]

I wholeheartedly Agree with Biggs on this one, from what I can see, not one part of the installation is correct, my opinion would be, wait and see if your FIT has been accepted at 43.3p, maybe chase your supplier gently on this one, once that is confirmed contact MCS and explain your position, if your installer does not ask for the money (£3000), well you do have a receipt that says paid, use this money to pay to have it put right, maybe use someone from this site.
Forget the court approach, that is a long way off, as you are not in dispute yet.
Hope this helps
Earthstore Energy