voltage Optimiser - A Load Of Bull?!?!

[VMan]

Hi Guys,
Just reading through my spam and got an email for a voltage optimiser - claiming to save you money by reducing the voltage!!!

MyPlanet Voltis Voltage Optimiser

To me this is bull, if something need 1kW to work then it will consume 1kW..no?

My Math example:

At 240 volts:

1000watt appliance = 240 volts x 4.16Amps (240 / 4.16 = 57.7ohms)

My said appliance is heating a said volume of water and needs 1kw to boil. i.e 1000Watts for one hour

------------------------------

if i put a voltage reducer to 218V

At 218 Volts:
( V/R = I ) 218 / 57 = 3.77Amps

(P = I x V) 3.77 x 218 = 821.86 watts - ok customer maybe convinced and may buy one.


Now my said appliance still needs to boil the same amount of water, and will need the same amount of energy.

So 1 hour of the appliance on will only heat the water to 82% of needed value. there for will need to be on a total of 73mins to heat said water (deliver 1kW of energy to the water) - well maybe a bit more due to heat losses whilst heating the water.?!?!

so 1 Kwh will still be 1kWh regardless of voltage?!?!?

Am I right or wrong? or can anyone else explain how this may work -

(I believe a kW meter does not record Power factor(where a k/VA meter will) so even the power factor bull isn't right here.)

cheers

 

[Top Cat]

I used to fit industrial units like this. It was basically only for lighting, the idea being that a 15% reduction in Voltage meant that although there was a reduction in light level it was not noticeable.

This gave good savings on a multi story car park.

There are other units available that you have to split the circuits on what is of benefit and what is not. From what i gather from this is that it goes before C/U so no splitting of circs.

Do not know how long it would take to get your money back if the only thing of use is lights.

 

[electric-all]

We have had great success with the Voltis units (marshall tufflex) they will come and do a site survey (chargeable) and give you a calculation on payback time and savings. I have had 3 very large and reputable companies go through with the installation and so far feedback has been very positive, so worth a look into.

 

[sedgy34]

The unit is dropping the voltage to 220v numerous cycles throughout the day
by doing this over 12 months it gives you the saving of 10/17% appliances don't need 230/240v to work

 

[sedgy34]

The unit is dropping the voltage to 220v numerous cycles throughout the day
by doing this over 12 months it gives you the saving of 10/17% appliances don't need 230/240v to work

Another wholesaler I assume

 

[Knobhead]

So how many appliances aren't volage dependant to deliver a set output?

 

[ackbarthestar]

From the evidence produced so far is that these units in a domestic environment are a complete waste of money.
As stated, the only benefits would be lighting.
However, voltage liming and stabilization could prove to be useful as a possible anti-surge device.

 

[jdd]

My local wholesaler were flogging these about a year ago for £20 ish. Went in last week, now in the pound bin!

 

[Knobhead]

Wonder if they could make it a 2 for 1 offer. I’d try one then.

Still want free installation though. (Old thread)

 

[Thomas123]

they dont work on stuff like heating elements, as you still need the same amount of power to warm it up. its aimed more towards stuff like lighting/tv i thought?

 

[Geordie Spark]

they dont work on stuff like heating elements, as you still need the same amount of power to warm it up. its aimed more towards stuff like lighting/tv i thought?

It's aimed at getting fools to part with their hard-earned in my opinion.

 

[sedgy34]

So how many appliances aren't volage dependant to deliver a set output?

All appliances are European standard

 

[trev]

Is someone being paid to set up an account on here and bring up this topic every few weeks?
Electric-All's post is (Imho) a blatant piece of advertising spam designed to try to convince us that these things are worth looking at.
As my learned friend Tony said earlier, how many appliances are not voltage dependent to deliver a set output?
Funny how no one has tried to answer that one isn't it?
These things are snake oil. Nothing more nothing less

 

[Knobhead]

All appliances are European standard

What the hell has that got to do with thermal transfer rates or the torque at the shaft of a motor. KW in = KW out – efficiency.

Talk sense man!

 

[Jay Sparks]

I havent seen any other threads on this but today I got a call from a friend whos a free lance sales rep for conservatories, double glazing etc. Sometimes he asks the customer if they need any other work doing i.e gas, plumbing, electrics etc. So far Ive done two quotes for him which has led to over a £1000 worth of work for me. Anyway he calls today and asked about one of these "V Phase units".
I had never heard of one untill I come accross this thread (spoooky). I told him, if it fit after the meter, he would have to get the DNO to come and fit an ISO before I could fit it. This would of course incure a cost ££££££. After looking at the picture, you would also need alot of space to fit this monstrosaty, so I have told him, its not as simple as just selling it over the phone!! You need to look at the installation and see if it needs an ISO and if this thing will fit. Hopefully that has put him off trying to sell this crap but not put him off getting me more work. lol


Jay

 

[Knobhead]

Jay!

Hail the bridge, hard right rudder! (Didn’t save the Titanic).
Avoid at all costs.

Not being funny but if you get associated with selling (you will be a recommended installer according to the salesman) dodgy equipment the smell will stick with you for years.

Look for past posts on this site for them, I don’t think you’ll find a good word for them.

The fact that jdd’s wholesaler was flogging then off for at £1 a go says a awful lot.

 

[Silly Sausage]

I do have some sympathy with these guys.
As others have said, until a quantifiable study has been done, you can't offer a sensible opinion.
I thought about the idea a few years ago, saving 10 or 20 volts on the supply, would it make savings.
There must be something in it, don't dismiss it completely out of hand.
I wouldn't pay for one at home personally but I'm sure they have their use somewhere.
The price of energy these days, if one can save £s somewhere...

 

[Jay Sparks]

Jay!

Hail the bridge, hard right rudder! (Didn’t save the Titanic).
Avoid at all costs.
Not being funny but if you get associated with selling (you will be a recommended installer according to the salesman) dodgy equipment the smell will stick with you for years.

Look for past posts on this site for them, I don’t think you’ll find a good word for them.

The fact that jdd’s wholesaler was flogging then off for at £1 a go says a awful lot.

Hi Tony,

No way will I be trying to sell these things, (I cant even sell my body to my wife). It was my mate who asked me about them, he asked if they were easy to fit and whether they worked. All I would have done is fit them for the people that were silly enough to believe they worked but looking at this thread, im gonna tell my friend to get someone else to fit them if he still wants to try and sell em to folk.

Jay

 

[sedgy34]

Try solar Pv thread " Voltis"

 

[Brightspark2]

I used to fit industrial units like this. It was basically only for lighting, the idea being that a 15% reduction in Voltage meant that although there was a reduction in light level it was not noticeable.

This gave good savings on a multi story car park.

There are other units available that you have to split the circuits on what is of benefit and what is not. From what i gather from this is that it goes before C/U so no splitting of circs.

Do not know how long it would take to get your money back if the only thing of use is lights.

We have just bypassed 2 of the these units on a large warehouse, after 12 months in use they saved them no money, no promises where met. The company refused to take them out even with the evidence on paper infront of them, in the end after a lengthy process the company said "Oh you can just keep them then, or let your sparks take them out and they can have them". We kept them in and just switched them to bypass, all the information you can get up on the units screen is quite usefull though lol.

One problem we had was the low bay lamps wouldnt ignite with the reduced voltage, some manufacturers would, some wouldnt.

I think these units are total boll*cks, some equiment will just draw more current to get the same output, some equipment will take longer to do its job other equipment just wont perform the same.

 

[Knobhead]

Another nail in the coffin lid!

 

[trev]

Brightspark2 just proved the point that we have all been stating all along
Thanks mate

 

[Geordie Spark]

I do have some sympathy with these guys.
As others have said, until a quantifiable study has been done, you can't offer a sensible opinion.
I thought about the idea a few years ago, saving 10 or 20 volts on the supply, would it make savings.
There must be something in it, don't dismiss it completely out of hand.
I wouldn't pay for one at home personally but I'm sure they have their use somewhere.
The price of energy these days, if one can save £s somewhere...

Aye .... as a doorstop to stop the netty door banging in a gale.

 

[UNG]

Posted on this subject in another thread recently and the original poster in that thread was adamant that savings had been made using one of these units but could not provide any evidence that it was all down to the VO unit

The electricity bill that landed on my door mat in the last few days showed that in the last 6 months my electricity usage had fallen by 40 - 45% I know why and it has nothing to do with voltage optimisation but an electric shower being used a lot less since I finished remodelling an en-suite bathroom with a tank fed power shower. Having seen these figures it shows how consumption can alter quite easily showering for a minute less everyday would show quite a saving which some might attribute to VO units

Until I see some side by side tests that prove they do what they claim then these units have no credibility with me as there is no evidence they work and no quantifiable payback period. From the manufacturers claimed savings you could be lucky to achieve a payback in 4 to 5 years and that assumes the unit is maintenance free during that period but in the ever changing technology world is 4 - 5 years too long a payback period

Could I look a customer in the eye and sell them one of these units I don't think so

 

[Knobhead]

As an add on to UNG’s comment.

I think if someone installs one of these units they will enter a mindset of conservation, and so be frugal in their energy usage.

It’s just my theory, but it has as much validity as the claims of the VO manufacturers:
IE, nothing to back it up!

 

[SPARTYKUS]

Lights? Savings?


Just fit LEDS. forget the silly VO. The green halide in the garden will never ignite

 

[UNG]

If people are trying to be green with these VO units what is the carbon footprint of it's manufacture and installation and how big a saving do you have to make to offset this

 

[UNG]

As an add on to UNG’s comment.

I think if someone installs one of these units they will enter a mindset of conservation, and so be frugal in their energy usage.

It’s just my theory, but it has as much validity as the claims of the VO manufacturers:
IE, nothing to back it up!

If you installed an empty box it would be interesting to see what savings where claimed as there is obviously some placebo effect with these units

 

[Geordie Spark]

If you installed an empty box it would be interesting to see what savings where claimed as there is obviously some placebo effect with these units

Maybe that's exactly what these things are ??

 

[Knobhead]

If you installed an empty box it would be interesting to see what savings where claimed as there is obviously some placebo effect with these units

BBC’s watchdog filmed some one doing just that. An empty patress box with a blank plate and a bit of 1.5 T+E vanishing in to the CU. It wasn’t even connected to anything.