Do you need to be CPS member to do EICR ?

[UNG]

Thanks, that answers the question, but blimey............................................

<SNIP>

How do I find a ‘qualified and competent person’ to carry out the test?​

Guidance has been produced by the electrical safety industry that covers how landlords can choose a qualified and competent inspector and tester. This includes, but is not limited to:

• Electrical Safety Roundtable
• Registered Competent Person Electrical single mark and register

The electrical safety industry has established competent person schemes. Membership of these will not be compulsory to ensure there is no further pressure placed on the industry, nor undue burden placed on inspectors and testers.

When commissioning an inspection, in order to establish if a person is qualified and competent landlords can:

• check if the inspector is a member of a competent person scheme; or
• require the inspector to sign a checklist certifying their competence, including their experience, whether they have adequate insurance and hold a qualification covering the current version of the Wiring Regulations and the periodic inspection, testing and certification of electrical installations.

How can you expect landlords to compile a checklist of what qualifications, experience and insurances are required. This is just ridiculous........​

One of noticeable things is all these documents refer to "person" in the singular and takes no account of a registered company with a number of operatives any one of which could be asked to carry out an EICR without having the necessary qualifications or experience

One thing is clear though none of these documents set any standard for the qualification, skill and experience of any person who carries out EICR's

 

[Deleted account]

So what's the point of me being a member?

There is no point if all your doing is EICRs.

 

[Babs]

So what should it be skilled or qualified or both.
The question then is what is skilled and / or qualified and / or competent

My basic answer would be
Skilled...Capable of completing any electrical job without requesting further advice/instruction.
Qualifed... been awarded exam certificates
Competent... having the ability and knowledge to completely install an electrical system into a building from zero, which I would expect every electrician on this forum to be capable of doing.

 

[UNG]

My basic answer would be
Skilled...Capable of completing any electrical job without requesting further advice/instruction.
Qualifed... been awarded exam certificates
Competent... Experienced... having the ability and knowledge to completely design and install an electrical system into a building from zero, which I would expect every electrician on this forum to be capable of doing.

Corrected that for you
The word competent means something else to me since the introduction of the CP schemes

 

[Michaelwgroves]

So, assuming I don't need the kudos of being a CPS member, how do I go about notifying the council of my work, and is there a cost?

 

[Deleted account]

So, assuming I don't need the kudos of being a CPS member, how do I go about notifying the council of my work, and is there a cost?

You contact local building control prior to works proceeding.

They visit site on 3 occations.
before works start. During works and after works.

yes there is a charge. £250 round my way. So registration would pay for itself within 3 notifiable jobs.

 

[Tony Baker]

The 2020 PRS legislation says "qualified person” means a person competent to undertake the inspection and testing required under regulation 3(1) and any further investigative or remedial work in accordance with the electrical safety standards;"

I think the use of the highlighted "and" is very important. My reading is the qualified person needs to be competent to do the EICR and remedial work. This could be a consumer unit. So to replace the Consumer unit you must be a members of CPS. Therefore, a qualified person must be a member of a CPS?

The provision or change of a consumer unit requires notification to building control. This means that a 'qualified' electrician can do the work and he/she does not have to be in CPS BUT the client (not the electrician) will have to notify building control. The building control may send someone to check the work and charge the client. I've seen this happen and it is a bit of fiddle as the person checking charges a large fee for very little. The client should ask for qualification to do the job (change/provide the board). CPS is NOT a qualification. I have lapsed my CPS as I am retiring and only doing small works and odd jobs. I am still fully qualified and up to date on regs and also insured. It is up to the client to decide based on good evidence. I often get asked to do visual inspections and there is nothing that could legally prevent me from a full inspection unless the client demanded CPS or another reason, such as specific insurance company requirements. It's sort of the same with PAT testing. Anyone can be trained for PAT, often in-house but they are rarely CPS. It's double-edged. We don't want cowboys doing work and yet the statements of NICEIC and NAPIT are not always in positioned properly. If in doubt, don't take a change and get a CPS person. A CPS assessment rarely covers Full Inspect and test

 

[Tony Baker]

So what's the point of me being a member?

A question many ask. It means you have been 'assessed' by an approved body such as NICEIC or NAPIT and carry a 'badge of honour'. You also get access to notify your work directly to building control. This means you are likely to win more work and the customer confidence will be higher. You are also more likely to be 'up to date' and therefore a safer bet in terms of quality of work. Then again............. It depends on the clients, the specific jobs, the costs, your capability and knowledge. It is a bit over the top to have an annual on-site assessment and this means some steer away from it. I would always register for membership if I was full time. Now I'm part time and do only work for known clients, so yes, what's the point is a good question. There is also no law that specifies that owned domestic properties must have an EICR. Insurance may demand it. Rentals yes, every 5 years. Some local commercial units have no record of any tests!!! It's a mess!

 

[i=p/u]

When comes to commercial buisness or renting etc for a profit, they become the duty holder and are responsible for what is done, they have duty to make sure staff, tenants etc are safe. where as domestic is" I didnt know I just got a spark.

So when you see all those comercial jobs, letting agents etc that's look like dog po o. when something bad happens they have to prove they have done everything reasonably practical to keep persons safe. It's all within health and safety at work act and electricity at work regulations one way or another...

 

[Michaelwgroves]

The provision or change of a consumer unit requires notification to building control. This means that a 'qualified' electrician can do the work and he/she does not have to be in CPS BUT the client (not the electrician) will have to notify building control. The building control may send someone to check the work and charge the client. I've seen this happen and it is a bit of fiddle as the person checking charges a large fee for very little. The client should ask for qualification to do the job (change/provide the board). CPS is NOT a qualification. I have lapsed my CPS as I am retiring and only doing small works and odd jobs. I am still fully qualified and up to date on regs and also insured. It is up to the client to decide based on good evidence. I often get asked to do visual inspections and there is nothing that could legally prevent me from a full inspection unless the client demanded CPS or another reason, such as specific insurance company requirements. It's sort of the same with PAT testing. Anyone can be trained for PAT, often in-house but they are rarely CPS. It's double-edged. We don't want cowboys doing work and yet the statements of NICEIC and NAPIT are not always in positioned properly. If in doubt, don't take a change and get a CPS person. A CPS assessment rarely covers Full Inspect and test

I just checked 18th Edition Amd 2.

We now need to be;
Skilled Person (electrically). Person who posses, as appropriate to the nature of the electrical work to be undertaken, adequate education, training, and practical skills, and who is able to perceive risks and avoid hazards which electricity can create.

 

[Intoelectrics]

It's a mess!

Got it right there!

 

[Bill Anderson]

The 2020 PRS legislation says "qualified person” means a person competent to undertake the inspection and testing required under regulation 3(1) and any further investigative or remedial work in accordance with the electrical safety standards;"

I think the use of the highlighted "and" is very important. My reading is the qualified person needs to be competent to do the EICR and remedial work. This could be a consumer unit. So to replace the Consumer unit you must be a members of CPS. Therefore, a qualified person must be a member of a CPS?

You do not need to be a memeber of a cps to replace the comsumer unit. Although this is notifiable work, as long as you are competant in electrical work, all you need to do is notify your local Council Building Control and they will send someone out to certify it as being compliant. I have done this and my install passed with no problems. Stop giving out misleading information.

 

[DPG]

You do not need to be a memeber of a cps to replace the comsumer unit. Although this is notifiable work, as long as you are competant in electrical work, all you need to do is notify your local Council Building Control and they will send someone out to certify it as being compliant. I have done this and my install passed with no problems. Stop giving out misleading information.

A lot of local authorities do not have the appropriate staff to certify electrical installations unfortunately. And also some charge the best part of £400 for this service, which isn't very cost effective.

 

[Bill Anderson]

This question has been raised several times in the past, I thought it was now a requirement, but there still seems to be some confusion in the industry, or at least with me.
18th Edition now says you need to be skilled to complete EICR, but that does not make CPS a requirement.
NICEIC says only registered electricians should complete EICR. https://www.excel-elec.co.uk/images/docs/checked-electrics.pdf
Even if regulation does not require membership, I should have thought your PI insurance would require it.

For what its worth, I think membership should be a requirement, otherwise, how does anyone know you are skilled.

Does anyone have any definitive documentation?

Hi Micheal,

There is not a requirement in any regulation to be a member of a cps. I was made redundant in Sept 21 and so started to work for myself. Unfortunately the regulations for joining a cps changed on the first of sept so I was told that I couldn't join. When I said that I was a member in the past, they said I wasn't, it was the company I workrd for that was the member, and although I was a working electrician I did not have the two years needed to join as I have not been working for myself for this period of time.

I ask myself at the age of 65, do I really want to join a scheme like this when all I have to do is notify building control. Ok I take the hit for the payment but I pass this on to the client and to be honest I don't really do that much notifiable work anymore. I suppose the jury is out as to this question, but until it is made a requirement by statutary regulation I probably will not be joining a CPS any time soon. I will however keep working for as long as I'm able to. No plans to retire yet and become a vegatouble.

 

[newfutile]

Hi Bill,Was you a QS at the time this happened ?
NiCEIC told me a QS has 2 years to reapply before this lapses

 

[lozarus]

But surly the insurance would want membership, otherwise how do they know you are skilled, have you noticed any requirements on your insurance, I'm gonna check mine now.

I'm sure the 2391 qualification would more than evidence competence - certainly more so than being a scheme member

 

[DPG]

I'm sure the 2391 qualification would more than evidence competence - certainly more so than being a scheme member

It only proves you've passed the course. It doesn't prove you've got the necessary experience.