Markc
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Hi GPack
I think you may have some issues which might not be overcome. Slat is naturally brittle add into this years on the roof and every slate nailed I would say there's little chance in getting them off in one piece. There are some so called slate mounting brackets out there but form what I have seen in demonstration they still look to be quite thick so lifting the slate up.
Not having worked on a slate roof (Not to many round my way thankfully) myself I certainly not looking forward to doing so. I would suggest having a chat (Or visit) with Wind and Sun in Leominster. They can be found online from a Goggle search. They supply and install and have a eco education centre with a slate roof with PV on it. Worth a try.
I think you may have some issues which might not be overcome. Slat is naturally brittle add into this years on the roof and every slate nailed I would say there's little chance in getting them off in one piece. There are some so called slate mounting brackets out there but form what I have seen in demonstration they still look to be quite thick so lifting the slate up.
Not having worked on a slate roof (Not to many round my way thankfully) myself I certainly not looking forward to doing so. I would suggest having a chat (Or visit) with Wind and Sun in Leominster. They can be found online from a Goggle search. They supply and install and have a eco education centre with a slate roof with PV on it. Worth a try.
S
solgen
Hi,
Did you find a solution to the slate problem? I'm now faced with a similar situation and wondered if you could provide any tips. The cottage is about 100 years old and so is the roof slate. Any ideas/tips would be welcome.
Did you find a solution to the slate problem? I'm now faced with a similar situation and wondered if you could provide any tips. The cottage is about 100 years old and so is the roof slate. Any ideas/tips would be welcome.
J
JulianC
Have a word with Dulas Solar Roof Fixings - Dulas
We recently installed a couple of systems on slate roofs, using their Unirac post mount systems. Our roofers liked this system and found it quick and easy to install. They removed any nails in the slates with a ripper, removed the slate where the post was to be fixed to the rafter and replaced it with a specific sheet of alu flashing which has a rubber sealed hole in the centre to fit over and seal against the post. Then it's a simple case of fixing brackets to the top of the posts and bolting the rails to the brackets.
We recently installed a couple of systems on slate roofs, using their Unirac post mount systems. Our roofers liked this system and found it quick and easy to install. They removed any nails in the slates with a ripper, removed the slate where the post was to be fixed to the rafter and replaced it with a specific sheet of alu flashing which has a rubber sealed hole in the centre to fit over and seal against the post. Then it's a simple case of fixing brackets to the top of the posts and bolting the rails to the brackets.
M
Martin Dawes
Is it not possible to use standard brackets? And then to make good with lead? A messy solution, perhaps, but it will be largely hidden by the array anyway.
N
Noshocks
I was working with a full time PV roofer who says thier company uses the post type mounts on nearly all roof types now, including slates, drill a hole through slate or pantile with masonary sds, drilll a pilot into rafter with auger bit then screw post in putting some roofing mastic around rubber seal for extra measure. It sounded a lot easier than I am sure it is in practice, would need precise measuring for a start to hit rafter each time.
J
JulianC
Hmmm, drilling through a tile and mounting a post through it sounds like a bit of a cheap and nasty bodge to me.
N
Noshocks
It does sound a bit bodgy i agree.
Mark.W
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Guys
I have worked on many slate rooves and the best way I have found is to use what's called a hanger bolt. I start by drilling a small pilot hole from the inside through the joist and through the slate (that way you are sure not to miss the joist from the outside). I then get up on the roof and drill the hanger bolt into the joist. The hanger bolt has a small rubber gland which fits nicely into the hole you have made making it water tight.
Cheers
Mark
I have worked on many slate rooves and the best way I have found is to use what's called a hanger bolt. I start by drilling a small pilot hole from the inside through the joist and through the slate (that way you are sure not to miss the joist from the outside). I then get up on the roof and drill the hanger bolt into the joist. The hanger bolt has a small rubber gland which fits nicely into the hole you have made making it water tight.
Cheers
Mark
M
Martin Dawes
I really don't like the idea of rubber seals. Sounds to me like a recipe for leaks in the future.
we've used same hanger bolt system on several slate roofs it is an approved method and the washers are epdm rubber same as these rubber roof coverings which have long lifespans
one of our competitors has mentioned to several prospective customers that drilling the slates and fixing thru is bad practice but we've looked into it in depth and its an acceptable method and on some older uneven slate roofs its the only realistic option
as it happens the above company when asked by several customers could not provide them with an example of not just a slate roof but any install done on a genuine customers roof only on their own installs they did for MCS yet they're going about slagging off other local installers incidently we have now installed all of the jobs mentioned above !
M
Martin Dawes
That looks pretty good. I suppose one of my big fears with getting involved in PV installs was maintaining the integrity of the roof and drilling through a tile defintely bothers me (probably unjustly).
Would you mind me asking who manufactures that system?
Would you mind me asking who manufactures that system?
Markc
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As above post has mentioned it is not just a standard rubber.
Tell me this does not look good! One of my installs!
View attachment 2865
How do you sell this to your clients? I bet you get some concerned customers about drilling a hole straight through their roof. We haven't worked on slate roofs (Yet) but I would be concerned if it were my roof.
How does this comply with building regulations also? You should not drill a hole more than 10% of the rafter width. I assume this bolt is a M8 or M10?
Not knocking your install and I can't think of a practical solution either, its just a question!
Some pictures of the finished article may be good as well.
Thanks
M
Martin Dawes
One other thing, have you found that over-tightening of the bolt cracks the tile?
J
JulianC
Was going to ask the same thing! Is this part of a proprietary PV mounting system? It looks a little flimsy to me and I'd be concerned about wind loading amongst other things. It just doesn't look strong enough to me.
Incidentally, I mentioned drilling through slates to mount rails to the roofing contractor we use on our installs. He screwed his face up. I can't tell you what he said since I believe this forum has a pretty good swear filter. Suffice to say, he didn't think much to it.
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Mark.W
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Let's get this sorted quickly....!
This is an approved method of installation and the hanger bolts get bought from segen for this use. I always show the customer what is involved and they are more than happy to have their tiles drilled as long as it is water tight, which it is!! Try it for yourself before you slate this method, excuse the pun!
I did not say that I drilled an M8 or M10 size hole throught the joist, I drill a pilot hole with a 2mm drill bit and from the outside drill the hanger bolt into the joist! It would be ludricrous to drill an 8 or 10mm hole!
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Mark.W
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I have around 50 install under my belt, and I have used various types of mounting systems, and to be honest the hanger bolts sit tighter than your normal roof anchors.
Mark.W
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You can adjust the nut on the bottom so you can drill literally the entire hanger bolt into the joist and then tighten up afterwards. You don't want to tighten too tight and you will know when you do because the rubber seal squashes.
S
solgen
Hi, I'm glad I re-opened this subject because as we all know it's a tricky one to deal with!
Mark W, you mentioned hanger bolts are an approved method - but are they approved for slate roofs and who says they are approved?
Thanks
Mark W, you mentioned hanger bolts are an approved method - but are they approved for slate roofs and who says they are approved?
Thanks
Mark.W
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Who do you want to approve it, the manufacturers of course! Of course they are approved for slate rooves that's what these specific hanger bolts are designed for. With any other roof you'd use a standard bracket!
Mark
S
solgen
Can you submit a link to the documention where you say the manufacturers recommended this type of fixing for slate roofs please as I have only seen them recommended profiled sheeting or corrugated sheeting.
S
solgen
Mark C,
I find your attitude to the people on this forum rather aggressive and abrupt! You seem to take peoples questions as some form of personal critism which in my opinion isn't the case. I believe we are just trying to learn from one another the best possible approach to challenging problems whilst keeping within MCS rules and manufacturers specifications. You have stated in a previous reply to MarkC ...
"This is an approved method of installation and the hanger bolts get bought from segen for this us"
I have looked on the Segen website and cannot find any documentation which states they are approved for slate roof mounting so I was rather hoping that you could direct me to where this is mentioned. I was incorrect in my previous e-mail using the word "recommended" I meant to use your word "approved" so my apologies for that.
All I and others are trying to do is exchange ideas and it seems that slate roofs are problematic and there isn't an ideal solution. Perhaps the method you describe is the best offering.
If anyone else has some considered opinions on this subject great!
I find your attitude to the people on this forum rather aggressive and abrupt! You seem to take peoples questions as some form of personal critism which in my opinion isn't the case. I believe we are just trying to learn from one another the best possible approach to challenging problems whilst keeping within MCS rules and manufacturers specifications. You have stated in a previous reply to MarkC ...
"This is an approved method of installation and the hanger bolts get bought from segen for this us"
I have looked on the Segen website and cannot find any documentation which states they are approved for slate roof mounting so I was rather hoping that you could direct me to where this is mentioned. I was incorrect in my previous e-mail using the word "recommended" I meant to use your word "approved" so my apologies for that.
All I and others are trying to do is exchange ideas and it seems that slate roofs are problematic and there isn't an ideal solution. Perhaps the method you describe is the best offering.
If anyone else has some considered opinions on this subject great!
Markc
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Charm down Mark, Just asking the question! As I said I'm NOT slating the work. It looks like a good installation method (As I said in my post).
I accept this is an approved method and was asking how you over come the customers concerns over drilling through their roof. I know some of my client would rather we didn't remove and replace tiles let alone drill them.
And where did I say you are drilling 8 or 10mm holes? I asked how you over come the building regs using this method? I assumed from the picture the bolt is a M8 or M10. Not that the bolt is like a coach screw? Not having used these I don't know.
Markc
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Solgen.
Have I upset you? I certainly didn't mean to. I was only asking how Mark W over comes issues I know I would be asked about. I certainly didn't mean my post to be aggressive or abrupt and I have re read my post and can't see what I have said to upset.
I sincerely apologise if I have offended.
Mark C
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Hey Mark. Chin up mate. This is probably the most useful thread I have followed on the forum. The information you have shared is really valuable and if I get a slate roof I will be using this method. As electricians I appreciate how nervous we all are about roofing. I think if the manufacturers instructions are followed, what's the problem. I think another way is to use a lead/aluminium slate but this is only from pictures I have seen over the past couple of weeks. I haven't had an install yet but I know this is a problem I will have to deal with in the future. I like the idea the the rubber seal starts to squash and so you are able to gauge the tightness. It wouldn't suprise me if the was a measurement in newtons in the manufactures instructions as well to get the correct torque setting. A phone call to them could establish that and if you're as interested as I am you will probably look into it further. Experience is king in this game and I think it would be foolish to ignore the advice of someone that has done over 50 installs.
Thanks for the photos you posted and sharing the knowledge
Thanks for the photos you posted and sharing the knowledge
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S
solgen
Apologies to MarkC, my last posting was to Mark D.
S
solgen
I'm losing the plot now - Apologies to Mark C again I meant Mark W
Markc
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S
solgen
Well said GPack.
I think you have summarised and hopefully diffused some of the tension around this subject. If anyone does have any reference to manufacturers instructions for the use of Hanger bolts I would appreciate if they could post it on this forum.
Solgen.
I think you have summarised and hopefully diffused some of the tension around this subject. If anyone does have any reference to manufacturers instructions for the use of Hanger bolts I would appreciate if they could post it on this forum.
Solgen.
We used this system on our Mcs assessment and discussed it at length with the assessor he was more than happy with our install and took a lot of pics of it . We know a consultant for BRE and he recommended it, this same person has Pv installs numbering in the hundreds having installed Pv for 9 years .Its a system which is also used on solar thermal a lot ,but its horses for courses you have to decide whether its the right mount for the roof ,we looked at other mounts first but on some jobs the spacing between battens was too tight to use a hook or fixed mount ,also the rafter size needs checking as these bolts are quite thick and should only be used on rafters of suitable size
Mark.W
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Solgen
I apologise if I come accross abrupt, it's my personality!
I accept that we are here to discuss ideas, but I don't actually see anyone coming forward with any......!
I mentioned that I have done many slate roof installs and this is the best method I have found. All anyone can say is they don't like the idea of rubber seals or they don't like drilling through roof tiles, wind loading and stability, when they haven't seen it or felt it. No reason as to why they don't like the rubber seals or drilling through tiles.
I just wish I had a forum like this to ask for advice before I started installing. I had to find out the hard way, many hours spent on the phone to suppliers discussing various methods, and yes it does feel like my installs are being criticized.
Trust me I would not go drilling through customers rooves without doing my homework first.
Anyway best of luck to all you installers,
Cheers
Mark
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M
Martin Dawes
No one is criticising your installations. Don't take things personally!
We were just discussing methods and showing an interest in yours. I do have concerns about the rubber seals, although as I've already stated, probably without justification.
For what it's worth, I think I'm going to try your method when we get a slate tile roof job
We were just discussing methods and showing an interest in yours. I do have concerns about the rubber seals, although as I've already stated, probably without justification.
For what it's worth, I think I'm going to try your method when we get a slate tile roof job
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