nest installation issues

[m82s]

Hi all im looking for some guidance please.

i dont have much experience with heating systems but done plenty of domestic. This is my own house and here is what i have:

ideal logic 35 (logic not logic plus)
danfoss tp5000 stats x2
2 zone valves
nest 3rd gen kit

im aware a nest is needed for each zone and ill buy another but for the minute, the second zone runs one radiator only in one room. im going to consider doubling it up into one until i have money for the second nest in a few months.

right so its a new build with feed to boiler spur and 5 core into boiler. the boiler has mains voltage on the thermostat connections and i have installed my heatlink via a 5 core and done the mains power plus the opentherm connection. nest all operational at this point.

The danfoss 5000's have a 3 core to each from wiring centre and i understand most of the system wiring. 4 cores into valves. stats are wired as n/o contacts.

im having issues figuring how to go about removing the old stats and powering the nest when i wall mount it. its currently via usb.
the stats have mains switching for the valves as does the boiler on the stat connections.

please can anyone shed some light? i think the nest may not be operating correctly and calling for heat because of the existing stats. i know they need to go eventually but i just wanted to test at this point. i think the stats are holding it off calling for heat.

im i right in thinking remove the 3 cores from wiring centre to stats if not needed and connect valve switch wires to permenant feed to keep them open?
im just lost as to how to get low voltage at wall for nest and mains at valves

thanks for bearing with my waffle and i really appreciate any help

 

[Octopus]

Not another one

 

[buzzlightyear]

maybe Murdoch ,we need the charge people for help wiring heating systems up. like 1 bit coin ,many be the op could arrange a hive engineer to visit their house.

 

[Octopus]

Problem is the vendors don't give a txss about anything other than shifting boxes .........

 

[davesparks]

Go on the nest website and search for a local nest installer to employ to fix your mess.

 

[123]

Why have you left the old heating controls connected? It sounds like a bit of a fudge now.

 

[Leesparkykent]

Brown is switch live and grey and orange are the end switch.

 

[m82s]

Why have you left the old heating controls connected? It sounds like a bit of a fudge now.

Hi I have no intention of leaving them connected in the long run. I have 2 stats and 2 valves.
I wanted to ensure the nest runs on the opentherm without issue and it doesn't with the current stats connected. I need to know what I need to do in order to disconnect them yet satisfy the nest. What I have done so far is simply add the heatLink power and opentherm connection. The stats are holding the the valves off but the nest is calling for heat via the opentherm. I'd like to remove the old stats once I know if there is anything I need to do with the valve connections given they are 4 core. Cheers

 

[m82s]

Brown is switch live and grey and orange are the end switch.

Thanks for this. So do I need to just make the circuit between the end switch and remove stat leaving valve open? Many thanks

 

[123]

Why have you used the OpenTherm connections? Nest Diagrams have one for S Plan which you seem to have, follow it and you'll need to ditch the existing controls

 

[m82s]

Why have you used the OpenTherm connections? Nest Diagrams have one for S Plan which you seem to have, follow it and you'll need to ditch the existing controls

I'd been advised opentherm modulates both heating and hot water which of both can be seen and adjusted via the app

 

[Leesparkykent]

Thanks for this. So do I need to just make the circuit between the end switch and remove stat leaving valve open? Many thanks

No. Prob best to get someone in.

 

[m82s]

No. Prob best to get someone in.

Cheers for your help so far. You have helped more than the forum police.
I'm just going to leave this thread. I quoted at the start this was in my own home. In light of this thread, the police opened another completely separate thread to have a rant about folk wanting for nothing.
I'm a spark with 236, 17th update and my part p with 20 yrs in the trade yet I can't get a little hope from fellow sparks. I'm not asking to be spoon fed nor doing a job for a customer I'm not competent to do.

Maybe I'll pay another spark who has become nest pro (answered an online quiz) like all other sparks would.

Good evening to you all

 

[Gavin John Hyde]

I stopped trying to work out peoples heating systems when i was presented with a enclosure full of disconnected and incorrectly terminated wires with connector blocks, the customer had tried to install his own nest and didnt quite understand what he was doing. he started trying various combinations to try and get it all working before asking for help, so I looked at the mess and said no thanks. wires were all over place and according to the paperwork was Y plan. i wasnt going to spend ages working out which wire was which and putting it back together. He took hindrance at my call out fee doubling for being a saturday afternoon. Some jobs are more trouble than they are worth.

 

[Leesparkykent]

Cheers for your help so far. You have helped more than the forum police.
I'm just going to leave this thread. I quoted at the start this was in my own home. In light of this thread, the police opened another completely separate thread to have a rant about folk wanting for nothing.
I'm a spark with 236, 17th update and my part p with 20 yrs in the trade yet I can't get a little hope from fellow sparks. I'm not asking to be spoon fed nor doing a job for a customer I'm not competent to do.

Maybe I'll pay another spark who has become nest pro (answered an online quiz) like all other sparks would.

Good evening to you all

Cheers for your help so far. You have helped more than the forum police.
I'm just going to leave this thread. I quoted at the start this was in my own home. In light of this thread, the police opened another completely separate thread to have a rant about folk wanting for nothing.
I'm a spark with 236, 17th update and my part p with 20 yrs in the trade yet I can't get a little hope from fellow sparks. I'm not asking to be spoon fed nor doing a job for a customer I'm not competent to do.

Maybe I'll pay another spark who has become nest pro (answered an online quiz) like all other sparks would.

Good evening to you all

To be fair no one knows your an electrician as you haven't stated such on your profile and not in the opening post either.

 

[m82s]

To be fair no one knows your an electrician as you haven't stated such on your profile and not in the opening post either.

Cheers buddy. I didn't mean to go off on one. I appreciate all the folk come here expecting to be given free information. I opened a new profile thinking mine had been closed since I have not been active on the forums for about 3yrs. I didn't get a password reset. Yahoo is crap like that and takes ages. I put a brief note in my profile so people would see I'm not here to scrounge info and potentially harm myself or others. I'll add some more info. Here is my profile I set up this afternoon.

If anyone wishes to still help me then I'd be grateful.

Cheers

 

[Leesparkykent]

Cheers buddy. I didn't mean to go off on one. I appreciate all the folk come here expecting to be given free information. I opened a new profile thinking mine had been closed since I have not been active on the forums for about 3yrs. I didn't get a password reset. Yahoo is crap like that and takes ages. I put a brief note in my profile so people would see I'm not here to scrounge info and potentially harm myself or others. I'll add some more info. Here is my profile I set up this afternoon.

If anyone wishes to still help me then I'd be grateful.

Cheers

View attachment 40355

I'm not 100% but I don't think you can have two nests set up as open therm.

 

[m82s]

I'm not 100% but I don't think you can have two nests set up as open therm.

I'll cross that bridge when it comes to it I think. To pass regs my house (a bungalow has been zoned into two. The second zone runs the lounge only. I know what people will say about me altering this but that's for another day. The nest is connected to opentherm and without altering the current stats and initial install at all, it appears the nest calls for heat, the boiler fires but the valves don't open due to n/o stat connections.
The stats are wired from the control centre supplying mains at both stats via 3 cores. I can't see how without either altering the wiring at the boiler spur or locating heat link at the wiring centre cupboard I'll achieve 12v at the wall stat. For now I'm happy with running nest via USB if I can confirm isolation of wall stats is ok. Obviously this means some connection altering. I do intend on buying a second nest and remove one stat now if poss as per nest say is possible

 

[Leesparkykent]

The brown of the two port needs connecting to heating on of the heatlink.

 

[m82s]

The brown of the two port needs connecting to heating on of the heatlink.

Cheers

So the opentherm is supposed to be able to control both heating and hot water via the one pair connection.
I have a 3 core from boiler spur to wiring centre and 3 core to each stat. Brown on each valve to sw return from each stat. I understand the wiring of what's in place.
I'm trying to figure out best way to achieve 12v at wall stats and not kill the feed to the valves. I think this leaves me with 2 options. Adjust wiring at spur or install heat link in wiring centre cupboard and use 2 legs from the 3 core back to boiler for opentherm. The 2 valves are for both zone use and not domestic hot water

Img

 

[Leesparkykent]

Cheers

So the opentherm is supposed to be able to control both heating and hot water via the one pair connection.
I have a 3 core from boiler spur to wiring centre and 3 core to each stat. Brown on each valve to sw return from each stat. I understand the wiring of what's in place.
I'm trying to figure out best way to achieve 12v at wall stats and not kill the feed to the valves. I think this leaves me with 2 options. Adjust wiring at spur or install heat link in wiring centre cupboard and use 2 legs from the 3 core back to boiler for opentherm. The 2 valves are for both zone use and not domestic hot water

Img[/QUOTE

Cheers

So the opentherm is supposed to be able to control both heating and hot water via the one pair connection.
I have a 3 core from boiler spur to wiring centre and 3 core to each stat. Brown on each valve to sw return from each stat. I understand the wiring of what's in place.
I'm trying to figure out best way to achieve 12v at wall stats and not kill the feed to the valves. I think this leaves me with 2 options. Adjust wiring at spur or install heat link in wiring centre cupboard and use 2 legs from the 3 core back to boiler for opentherm. The 2 valves are for both zone use and not domestic hot water

Img

yes it would normally be installed at wiring centre position so you have access to all the cables.

 

[m82s]

Thank you matey. After all that it's just clicked in the old brain department. I need mains at wiring centre for valves but 12v at the cupboard so it makes sense to stick heatlink in cupboard and achieve both.
To confirm 5 core from boiler delivers mains in to boiler and 2 spare legs back from cupboard heat link for opentherm. Zone valves connected to heat link brown on valve. Remove stats and use 3 core from wiring centre to supply nest 12v at wall

Thanks mate

 

[Leesparkykent]

Thank you matey. After all that it's just clicked in the old brain department. I need mains at wiring centre for valves but 12v at the cupboard so it makes sense to stick heatlink in cupboard and achieve both.
To confirm 5 core from boiler delivers mains in to boiler and 2 spare legs back from cupboard heat link for opentherm. Zone valves connected to heat link brown on valve. Remove stats and use 3 core from wiring centre to supply nest 12v at wall

Thanks mate

That's the one.

 

[m82s]

Well I thought I'd Sussed it but I have not. A single 3 core from boiler won't give the opentherm legs I need plus it wouldn't be right to run opentherm connection within the same cable run as the mains to the wiring centre. Bloody valves!

 

[Leesparkykent]

Well I thought I'd Sussed it but I have not. A single 3 core from boiler won't give the opentherm legs I need plus it wouldn't be right to run opentherm connection within the same cable run as the mains to the wiring centre. Bloody valves!

Well I thought I'd Sussed it but I have not. A single 3 core from boiler won't give the opentherm legs I need plus it wouldn't be right to run opentherm connection within the same cable run as the mains to the wiring centre. Bloody valves!

is the programmer near the boiler or do you have programmable thermostats? You could connect it not using the open therm connections.

 

[m82s]

No programmer exists. Programmable stats x2

I think this leaves me with running a cable which I'd really rather not in a new build or run without opentherm

 

[MRBROWN33]

I’m sure the nest hub should have LV terminals to power the stat. Use the down stairs stat cable to goto the hub, you may need to do some alterations in the wiring Center to get the stat cable to your hub, this will depend on where you have positioned the hub. The back plate on the nest stat should have the LV terminals to connect to and then the stat just plugs onto it. For now put both Brown cables together on the valves with the call cable from the nest hub and disconnect the other stat cable. Hope this helps?

 

[MRBROWN33]

No programmer exists. Programmable stats x2

I think this leaves me with running a cable which I'd really rather not in a new build or run without opentherm

Just out of interest does the programmerable room stats run on batteries?

 

[Eliza Bennett]

Did you try Nest support? They will give you a brief solution.