Tell us about your faults!

K

kung

Hi ALL
Just thought id put this one up for all those faults we find.
heres one to kick it off !
Domestic RCD tripped and wouldnt reset cause was a blown low energy light bulb.:D
There you go now for yours !
 
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Needed to disconnect garage supply for building works prior to the gas man coming to re-route the gas pipe... return to find gas pipe re-routed and the old pipe disconnected both ends but a bit still hanging out the wall. Bonding still connected to the old pipe!
I wonder how long it would have remained that way had I not been returning to re-instate the garage supply?
 
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Re: Tell us about your faults !

Phil said:
found this in a suspended ceiling today. the pics are far from the best as they are off the phone. all the cpc`s were wired outside the jb well it`s original if nothing else. 5 or 6 live cables chopped and left coming out the ends of it one 20 foot away form the jb. the socket was one of the ones that were still wired into it, on .75mm. another quality instal by bodjit and run
Click to expand...
Lack of space in a JB. Means people can do some really neat jobs. (Ye sarcastic).
 
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Just had one still unresolved.......
got called out to a house this evening with 'nuisance tripping' of RCD. Got there and noticed there was a 30mA RCD before the C/U and also one as the main switch on the C/U (no distinction between RCD's)
i then did a ramp test on RCD and neither tripped. I went at x5 on 30mA and nothing. I then kept going up as far as 1000mA and still wouldn't trip. I put an earth leakage tester on and went straight to OL on 400mA range. I took out the first RCD and replaced it with a Henley block hoping something might be better but the RCD M/S was still tripping completely randomly when not under test conditions. I started looking at circuits. I noticed that the downstairs sockets had <80mA of residual so unplugged everything from the circuit and still had <40mA of residual under no load. I took off a selection of faceplates and behind one was a parallel ring (4 of each conductor in the terminals behind double socket, two old and 2 harmonised!) the shower cover was already off, a seemingly 'in use' socket in lounge with now power at it but conductors behind. a halogen hob off an FCU from ring final and a 2KW cooker from 32A 6mm radial (not other way around as youd expect) the o/s light switch was taped to off position and another circuit in the C/U said 'ring old and new' with 4 line conductors in one 3871! The house is rented and couldn't get hold of the landlord to get consent or assurance of payment to start lifting floors, taking more time or chopping holes in flat roof area above dreaded kitchen etc etc. I think I will have to suggest an RCBO setup to the landlord with the scope of partial reword and see what else I find? Anyhow, has anyone come across an RCD that will not trip under test, will carry over what it's rated at, but will trip randomly with no extra load being added? I think it could be lots of things such as loose connections on a JB, water ingress through flat roof or maybe VIR lurking under the floor that the previous slippery spark may have neglected to be move and instead join fresh twin on 'visible areas'?
 
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Yesterdays domestic fault was a short between live and earth on a length of T&E. Caused by a fridge freezer being pushed into position and crushing the cable between a freezer foot and the floor. The cable was loose on the floor near the wall because the cable installer (kitchen fitter) had not clipped or secured the cables back to the wall or enclosed them. Also found at the same time the old ring main extension joints into to new kitchen were hidden behind a fitted cupboard unit where the joints were simply blue barrel crimps wrapped in sticky tape without a enclosure. Also noted that two of the kitchen sockets were fitted directly onto the kitchen units (not the wall), which I seem to recall this should not have been done.
 
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Andrewr3 said:
Also noted that two of the kitchen sockets were fitted directly onto the kitchen units (not the wall), which I seem to recall this should not have been done.
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I've come across this many times, and not just in kitchen cupboards but also fitted study furniture and fitted wardrobes. I was always under the impression that it was wrong (though I seem to think that, at least back in 15th ed days when I was fully reg'd and working, it was not actually against the reg's, just not recommended - could be wrong, it's a long time back). However, I was quite surprised recently when I was bemoaning the fitting of a double 13A socket and two Fused Spurs to the inside of a kitchen unit, right under the cold stop tap - which was leaking slightly - and a fully qual'd and reg'd spark, of 40+ year's experience, who I've always trusted, said it was absolutely fine and other than siting them right under the stop cock he couldn't see anything contravening reg's.
Be interesting to see what other folk on here think - and no, I've not bothered to get out my 17th ed book and check, so I do accept I may be completely wrong.
 
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I'm with you on this, i don't and never have, installed socket outlets to kitchen cabinets. As far as i'm concerned it's bad practice, and can cause more problems than it's worth in the long term!!
 
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I agree, it's defo better to fit accessories to the structure of the building - as far as I remember though it's not a reg. just a recommendation in the Guide to Building Regs - I'm sure someone will find it soon and correct or confirm!
 
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Re: Tell us about your faults !

doing remedial works on a house all insulation reading were over 200 meg , then installing an earth bond I moved a heating pipe and touched a screw and bang , the screw holding the heating trunking to the wall went straight through the live of the immersion heater cable and nothing else just goes to show you can still get a fault even though you have tested and all appears fine !
 
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Had a call from a local cafe " our power keeps tripping and we have to keep resetting it but now the button is in but there is still no power" here is what I found
2013-07-23 19.28.29.jpg
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Food warmer, hotplate, kettle, toaster, fryer, Large coffee machine and a fridge all fed of the one 30A circuit wonder how it lasted as long as it has now has a new board and split in to 3 new rings and all the old melted chock block joints removed
 
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bawall said:
Had a call from a local cafe " our power keeps tripping and we have to keep resetting it but now the button is in but there is still no power" here is what I found
View attachment 20460
View attachment 20461

Food warmer, hotplate, kettle, toaster, fryer, Large coffee machine and a fridge all fed of the one 30A circuit wonder how it lasted as long as it has now has a new board and split in to 3 new rings and all the old melted chock block joints removed
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Looks like a quote for a db and split up wiring circuits to balance load
 
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Worst fault ever was when working for local authority many years ago when concentric and neutral earth cable was coming into use for local service drops. I was installing new street lighting control equipment into steel lighting columns. This included our own new swa underground cable which was fed from a feed Colum i.e. a one with a local network cable connected via tails and cut out to our swa cable.
First job make off the swa and install service cut out (Lucy Box) then install control equipment, transformer, photo cell etc. Did all this and put the fuse into the service cut out and what the sh** the light jump into life. Tested the cut-out with the trusty 15w bulb and bayonet holder (this was over 30) years ago and yow 240 smackers.
Went to feed Colum and by now you may have guest this. The LEB (NEEB) had directly connected our cable to theirs via their service cut out. I nice little card (You know the one that reads Sorry you we out when we called to read your meter) had a note from the cable jointing team that read. “I have connected our service to yours (Called solid connecting at the time) so that you will have one less cut out to install and it looks a lot neater” Could not believe I had ringed live cable which was potently directly connected to the local network substation, put on a earth Strap, striped down the cores, shortened them, connected them to our cut out made off and connected the cable to the next Colum, by the way may mate had just made of his cables.
I guess I have never really trusted electricity ever since my first and only shock and made it a point to never touch bare copper unless it had water running through it.
 
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Re: Tell us about your faults !

Tester Steve said:
Got called to a job yesterday. House owner said that when he shuts the front door, the lights flicker!! Kid was in the front room watching the telly (on full blast!) and all the lights were on. Shut front door behind me and the lights flickered and the telly flashed!!!! Had a look at the meter and CU, tails hidden in 25 x 25 trunking. Took the front off the CU, both tails loose. Told him I was going to switch off the supply at the isolator, kid moaned about his telly going off!! Turned off the isolator............................ nothing happened!! Lights still on, telly still blairing out!! WTF?? The conversation went like this...

me: this meter doesn't supply your power?
him: No
me: where does your power come from?
him: next door
me: next f***ing door!!!???
him:yes, last year when he had his house done up the sparky connected me to his meter
me:does he know about this?
him:no!!

So... put the cover back on the CU and turned the 'isolator' back on and told him to get someone else in!!!!

Steve.
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That is illegal even if next door does know about it, is it not?

Thanks.
 
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Re: Tell us about your faults !

ChristianG said:
RCCB tripping when the bathroom light (2d 16W Flourescent) was switched off. The Bathroom light was on the main switch side of a split load board, but on a RCBO.

Turned out that a capacitor was missing from between the line and neutral. Some sort of surge knocking out the RCCB. When we took out the capacitor, the light switching off tripped the RCBO.

Added the capacitor from new light fitting to the old light fitting and it stopped tripping.

We still exchanged the old fitting for the new one though.

Also got told today by a customer that her old electrician couldn't fill the gap between sockets in her kitchen because they needed to be vented WTF? lol

If someone could explain exactly why the RCCB was tripping, I'd be grateful........still learning:D
Click to expand...

Be putting extractor fans to vent sockets next.
 
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Re: Tell us about your faults !

chcnorris29 said:
That is illegal even if next door does know about it, is it not?

Thanks.
Click to expand...

You did best to walk away in fact I would be inclined to report the property and that guy calls him a electrician a crook would be more suitable, even if was legal to wire in to next door you should still be able to isolate supply and have it protected on your property. IN No way do I agree with agree with illegal and theft procedures.
 
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Check this one out sure it passes all the regs NOT.

A internal fridge compressor used outside without any adequate waterproof housing a homemade shelter is really going to stop side rain and snow, no way.
 

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Builders way of wiring safely after removing old consumer which by the way was functional.
 

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Asked to do a survey of an mcc panel as there were no drawings. found an old supply tapped up, checked if it was live, yes it was okay ,thats a problem isolated and made it safe but then found another cable connected straight onto busbar, no markings, traced it back to a main isolater i.e live cores on both sides of isolator, no lock or label, this was a 3phase supply to a main factory db. Engineer "is that a problem sure its been like that for years" that why he gets the big bucks( nash of teeth ). We fixed during a shutdown while he moaned about the cost
 
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Found a ring main fault today. I was doing the testing after adding a socket on a spur. The signs of a problem started with open circuit on the ring neutral and then a N-E insulation resistance measurement that took just a little longer than usual to settle. But things had changed after deciding to double check appliance on the ring was isolated. I was sure I had ring continuity earlier. I finally found the fault in a switched fused spur to a washing machine. One of the ring neutrals connected into the load side of the switch, and the load neutral was where the leg of the ring should have been. It had been like that since the property was built in 1996. If the washing machine isolator switch was on then the ring sort of worked OK, but when it was off all was not well.

Two months ago in the same property I did a direct replacement of a DSSO on the same ring that had an overheated (charred) line (live) connection terminal. My first thought today was the was the overheating was caused by overload on the broken ring. But of course it could not be because the line ring was always OK. The only common factor between the loose terminal on the DSSO and the mis wired 13A Fused Spur was the installer in 1996.
 
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Andrewr3 said:
Found a ring main fault today. I was doing the testing after adding a socket on a spur. The signs of a problem started with open circuit on the ring neutral and then a N-E insulation resistance measurement that took just a little longer than usual to settle. But things had changed after deciding to double check appliance on the ring was isolated. I was sure I had ring continuity earlier. I finally found the fault in a switched fused spur to a washing machine. One of the ring neutrals connected into the load side of the switch, and the load neutral was where the leg of the ring should have been. It had been like that since the property was built in 1996. If the washing machine isolator switch was on then the ring sort of worked OK, but when it was off all was not well.

Two months ago in the same property I did a direct replacement of a DSSO on the same ring that had an overheated (charred) line (live) connection terminal. My first thought today was the was the overheating was caused by overload on the broken ring. But of course it could not be because the line ring was always OK. The only common factor between the loose terminal on the DSSO and the mis wired 13A Fused Spur was the installer in 1996.
Click to expand...

Same property but next day, in the same kitchen on the same ring. Found a very wrong but elegantly wired pair of 13A switched fused spurs in a twin recessed steel back box. The ring protective conductor from left side of the ring was neatly terminated in the top left rear of the steel back box in a proper box terminal. Nothing else connected with it. The right side ring protective conductor was similarly terminated in the top right rear of the back box, again nothing else connected with it. The each of the load protective conductors were connected to the earth terminal on their respective spur front plates and nothing else with them! It looked very pretty, wish I had a camera there. One of the spurs was a floor level heater the other was the cooker hood fan.

To test protective conductor ring continuity was a hassle as well because in the CU the two ends of the ring protective conductor were twisted together and packed into one green/yellow sleeve. It was a long sleeve as well because the CU was a large one. So I had to untwist that lot and re sleeve as well. There was another ring protective conductor trussed up in the same way as well.

Further around the wall I found loose terminals connections on a "hob" double pole isolator switch. Also had a wire fall out of another Fused Spur when I took the cover off.

This totals to finding 4 wiring faults in the kitchen and one in the hall on a spur for a bathroom heater in the same property!

It is a flat in a block. I'll be speaking with the management agent tomorrow.
 
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Andrewr3 said:
Same property but next day, in the same kitchen on the same ring. Found a very wrong but elegantly wired pair of 13A switched fused spurs in a twin recessed steel back box. The ring protective conductor from left side of the ring was neatly terminated in the top left rear of the steel back box in a proper box terminal. Nothing else connected with it. The right side ring protective conductor was similarly terminated in the top right rear of the back box, again nothing else connected with it. The each of the load protective conductors were connected to the earth terminal on their respective spur front plates and nothing else with them! It looked very pretty, wish I had a camera there. One of the spurs was a floor level heater the other was the cooker hood fan.

.
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Update on this what I perceived was a "fault". Concerning how I found the connections 1) using the steel backbox itself as part of the durable connection for the circuit protective conductor ring is not a fault, but it could well be considered bad practice. If the steel backbox between the two separate terminal connections on it provides an equivalent CSA to the 1.5mm copper conductor then all is OK. This surprised me, but I can accept that. 2) using the front plate screws to pick up the protective conductor to the load is also acceptable, but again not necessarily best practice in this circumstance. My conclusion is that what I considered to be a fault on these two spurs was in fact acceptable. But I would not do it myself that way.
 
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2) using the front plate screws to pick up the protective conductor to the load is also acceptable
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Is it?? I'd beg to differ, at the very least a suitably sized flying lead should be connecting the back box to the accessory faceplate. Fine for the faceplate screws to earth the back, but not to earth the accessory faceplate.

Once the face plate has been removed from the back box, there is no CPC at the face plate!! Relying on fixing plate screws for the appliances sole means of a CPC is wrong in anyone's book, no matter what it say's or doesn't say in in BS7671, .....or any other publication come to that!!
 
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Engineer54 said:
Is it?? I'd beg to differ, at the very least a suitably sized flying lead should be connecting the back box to the accessory faceplate. Fine for the faceplate screws to earth the back, but not to earth the accessory faceplate.

Once the face plate has been removed from the back box, there is no CPC at the face plate!! Relying on fixing plate screws for the appliances sole means of a CPC is wrong in anyone's book, no matter what it say's or doesn't say in in BS7671, .....or any other publication come to that!!
Click to expand...

I took advice on this from the NICEIC tech help line. The practice they would like to see would be not to rely on just the screws. I agree with you engineer54 and NICEIC best practice, hence why I fixed the "fault". Even where the protective conductor is steel conduit to steel end box I would still use a fly lead. But I can see the point that when the front plate is screwed down as it should, then adequate connectivity will/could be present. When the faceplate screws are loose the circuit will always (in theory) be isolated anyway. Of course I am well aware of situations where decorators choose to loosen the face plates to paint the walls and electricians may remove a face plate while testing/on near live parts on a double pole switch or a fused spur.
 
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Tell us about your faults!
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